Our Forefathers Would Be Shooting By Now

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


I think that in this day and age if you were to start planning such a thing, or even talking about planning such a thing, The US wouldn't like it very much. I saw somewhere on here that they questioned some teenage girl about her twitter post saying something about killing the president.

And that's just talking about killing the president, not taking over the country and making it the people's again.

But YES, I do believe we need to rise. We need to do something about this tyrany.

The revolution is something I studied in fair depth in college. Our founding fathers didn't create the revolution. Forty years of tension between the English and colonists had fomented a lot of unhappiness on both sides. The redcoats had used colonials in the French and Indian wars as cannon fodder and virtual slaves. Land that colonials spilled blood for was given back to France. Endless blunders by English commanders who dragged colonial militia all across Canada led colonials to lose a lot of respect for the English.

Meanwhile the colonies had racked up millions in debt fighting the French and Spanish which the crown had promised to reimburse them for. The crowns' solution was to burden the colonies with taxes (honestly the taxes were light and not too burdensome) and the demand that all colonial products must be shipped to English companies across the atlantic to be resold (this was actually a much bigger burden on the colonial economy).

Colonials were very jealous of their liberty and they felt the crown was infringing on that for decades before the 1770s.

It is important to realize that the social conditions were much different then. There were still three classes of people, but only the upper class had extensive educations. Only they had skills as military officers. The lowest class was typically illiterate. The upper class was an aristocracy that was considered by even the commoners as the natural leaders. They were known as the gentlemen and their lives of leisure were usually devoted to culture and extensive education. These men were like professors, well versed in the ways of politics, history, and science. This gentleman class was the same in the colonies and all of Europe.

To finish, the seeds of war were planted long before any of these "fathers" came to prominance. Even the "fathers" generally would have been content to remain under the crown. They realized long before the common people however, that the King wasn't in the mood for renegotiating the liberties and financial burdens of the colonies. Some among them advocated for independence. Eventually this was determined as the only recourse after the crown only clamped down harder on the colonies.

The revolutionary war actually started about two years before 1776. Commoners began to raid and pillage royal property and to intimidate those loyal to the crown.

These things always start out small and grow. At first very few people would support rebellion. There may be some mob action. The government clamps down and people start getting irritated. This cycle goes around a few times and soon organization begins.

But, I question how organization could occur today. All the surveillance, all the spies. The government will not play with kid gloves. They'll kill you and make up stories. Actually they won't, their little henchmen will. The police will lead the government response. We already see a lot of police abuse and corruption. That would grow as police found themselves getting killed by "domestic terrorists". The police would close ranks even tighter. I doubt they all would, but most.

Really it all comes down to the military. Whichever side most of them throw in with will win. That cannot be predicted because the unfolding of events, discension in the chain of command, and the effectiveness of media spin cannot be known. I know many who have/are serving however. I've had this conversation with several of them and I got the same unequivocal response, "The government can go to hell." Indeed, it seems that a common theme found among our recent veterans is that our government is the problem......and that is a problem for our government.

reply to post by subject x

If only we could keep the money we earned.

reply to post by olaru12


Exactly! Only white men. Women, children, black or Hispanic individuals didn't count.

No they wouldnt. Had their material needs been met to the extend they are today, america would be still part of the commonwealth.

reply to post by gladtobehere


I mentioned that earlier. We keep honestly VERY little compared to what we deserve or really earn.

They tax our income, they tax our hard earned money. They tax money that we have received from State lottery. They tax nearly every item we buy in stores. They literally tax MONEY! They tax the money that they make for the sake of the fact that they made it and want to make money off of money. They print it, loan it to America and say "We want profit off of money we've printed."

Legitimately EVERYTHING is taxed.

The point of this Post was to open some closed eyes. I'm hoping to get a lot of people to see the condition of our government "for the people, by the people."

I'm hoping more people awaken and begin to question the state of our union.

reply to post by johnwilkesbooth


I agree politicians lie, cheat, and steal. But if voting doesn't work why are the candidates working so feverishly to get yours? The problem is the media, the politicians lie and they swear to it. It's all anybody hears. Nothing but propaganda from the square box. The tea party has had such a influence in such a short time you know getting involved can make a difference. We didn't screw it up over knight it will take a while to fix it. With 20 some odd countries rioting, is it just me or does anyone find it disturbing the media only reports what Romney had to say about the deaths at the embassy? Thanks for the honest educated discussion it hard to find lately.

We live in the best country on the planet despite how many politicians want to ruin it.

The Founding Fathers shot so we don't have to. They didn't possess the republican representation that we do.

this is what the constitution that they founded has led to.

they were a bunch of freemasons any way.

political parties should be outlawed. you can only be a senator or representative of the state you were born in.

the electoral college abolished. or at the very least, one state one vote, majority wins.

that way you have to earn each citizens vote, not just depend on the votes of your registered party members who vote for the party and not the candidate.

all wars on earth have been started by political parties regardless of country.

Originally posted by subject x
Were the founding fathers here today, they would most likely be rich, fat CEOs.
I doubt they'd be wanting change.

I see somebody hasn't read anything on what the fOunders wrote

reply to post by MarlinGrace


I do believe this is one of the best countries out there. I want to check out England and Canada too though!

No problem though, I love educated discussion. I'm surprised no trolls arrived.

Originally posted by randomname
this is what the constitution that they founded has led to.

they were a bunch of freemasons any way.

political parties should be outlawed. you can only be a senator or representative of the state you were born in.

the electoral college abolished. or at the very least, one state one vote, majority wins.

that way you have to earn each citizens vote, not just depend on the votes of your registered party members who vote for the party and not the candidate.

all wars on earth have been started by political parties regardless of country.

No, I don't believe it is, sir. This is what the ADDITIONS and SUBTRACTIONS to the Constitution has led to. The slow erosion, over time, of our Freedom and Liberty was NOT part of the plan. At least, it wasn't the plan of our Forefathers. Now the Bush administration.....

I agree, screw political parties. You can't get anything done with them anyways. Because if enough hatred brews, they don't even vote in a manner that would help it's citizens, they vote to block out the other parties votes. 'It's all politics.'


Finally, I believe all wars have been started on Earth due to three things actually. Money, Power, Politics. In that order of importance. No one would care to invade an area if they weren't going to gain anything out of it. If our allies need help, they call in a more powerful country to help. Lastly, politics does have a big hold on us. We're stuck together by the terms "ally". If one of our "allies" goes to war, we have no choice either. Well you know what? Sometimes it's not the best choice for us. Haha.

reply to post by eLPresidente


Oh you could tell that too? Thank goodness I wasn't alone. The simple fact that they did all of what they did proves that they wouldn't be rich fact CEO's. Some of them WERE rich. If they wanted to stay rich they wouldn't have even said anything.

They simply couldn't take it anymore and revolted. Now they were revolting against a simple army, compared to today. I couldn't even imagine how hard something like that would be today, with all of our technology.

reply to post by subject x


You may be correct. But... Isnt the government beating our wallets to death now in the form of taxes? Removing our rights and eroding the constitution? Nothing will come of it though. This will continue until we are a fully government controlled country with no rights. Socialism, communism, call it what you want. And still, we as a country will do nothing. How sad will it be when the American people have to look for help from a foreign country to rescue us from our own government?

reply to post by subject x


To answer your question about the forefathers being rich and fat, here is what happened to the men who were rich and signed the Declaration of Independence. Some of them LOST EVERYTHING. What became of the men who signed the Declaration of Independence

Originally posted by xyankee
reply to post by subject x

 

To answer your question about the forefathers being rich and fat, here is what happened to the men who were rich and signed the Declaration of Independence. Some of them LOST EVERYTHING. What became of the men who signed the Declaration of Independence

He'll never understand this and probably won't take your link seriously.

Some people on ATS just gather their post material straight out of their ass.

Originally posted by olaru12

Originally posted by LittleBlackEagle



they were for freedom and liberty for all men and they laid their lives on the line for it.

maybe a little research would give you a something more to know about those dead guys.

gwpapers.virginia.edu...

Yeah, freedom and liberty for all white men. If you were black you weren't even considered a man; you were property.

Perhaps you could benefit from some research as well.

check out my last post on that page and please i'm american indian you don't need to teach me about the white man.

bumping a good thread which i think a lot of people could take something good from.