The Politics of Rape

Disclaimer: This thread was made for the intellectual discussion of a very serious issue that has received much attention as of late. If you decide to reply to the opening post, please ensure you stay on topic, remain civil and be respectful to the experiences of others. If you find the discussion of Rape and the possible motivations behind this crime to be upsetting or offensive, or you simply feel too emotionally-involved to be reasonable and balanced with your views, then I recommend you do NOT take part in this discussion.

The following article is a long and interesting read about what can be viewed as the politicisation of Rape by the Feminist movement. Dr. Hansen argues strongly that Rape is generally a sexually-motivated crime. The article does not downplay the severity of this negative behaviour, excuse the perpetrators of their crimes or denigrate victims. Rather, it clearly and convincingly demonstrates how the Feminist movement has dishonestly used Rape as a political tool to effect social change. Remember also that while the central thesis of this article is that in the majority of cases Rape is not a politically motivated crime, there may be a minority of cases where power is a contributing factor in the Rapist's motivations. Just like any other crime, the motivation is NOT always the same.

The Politics of Rape: Debunking the Feminist Myth

“Rape isn’t about sex!” That’s what feminists proclaim. And they’ve declared it so continuously and persuasively over the last few decades, most of our society have come to believe it. The fact is, it’s not true—it’s a myth.

Rape used to be considered an act of sexual assault—“sexual” being the operative word—perpetrated by a man of weak moral character and criminal inclination. But this commonsense truth has been replaced with a politically-motivated myth that has had long-reaching, negative effects on both rape victims and society.

The politicization of rape, and the denial of truth it required, was spearheaded by feminists in the early 1970s. Since then they’ve worked diligently to transform the way society views rape. Specifically, feminists want rape to be seen as a politically motivated crime rather than a sexually motivated one. And, to a significant extent they’ve been successful in their effort.

no comment - as he bangs 2 bricks together

reply to post by Dark Ghost


Im certainly no expert on feminism, but the author of the linked article does seem to make a lot of assumptions:

Third is the feminists’ denial of any difference between male and female sexuality, because, in their lexicon, different means inferior.

Based on what information?...

Did you look at some of the other "Commentaries" on her site? After reading some I question her credibility:

Only heterosexual parents offer children the opportunity to develop relationships with a parent of the same, as well as the opposite sex. Relationships with both sexes early in life make it easier for a child to relate to both sexes later in life. For a girl, that means she’ll better understand and appropriately interact with the world of men and be more comfortable in the world of women. And for a boy, the converse will hold true. Having a relationship with “the other”—an opposite sexed parent—also increases the likelihood that a child will be more empathetic and less narcissistic.

reply to post by cartenz


I think the problem is the author uses the words "Feminism" & "Radical Feminism" interchangeably at times, when really it is Radical Feminism itself that is being addressed. I agree this is a mistake as not all Feminists can be lumped together under a single banner.

I did foresee members bringing up the issue of other articles on the website, which I should state I do not necessarily agree with. Please let us focus on this article and its merits instead of attacking the messenger. Too often the messenger is highlighted and the content overlooked.

Quite the interesting article I must say.

I have issues with the feminist movement in general. Considering you can't claim to want equal treatment unless you describe yourself as an egalitarian.

Also the issue of Misogyny vs Misandry and how one is discussed constantly, but the other hardly at all. Or there is an outright denial of it's existence.

As for the topic at hand and the issue of rape. I firmly believe that most rapists are sexually driven, not power hungry.

Sociopaths/psychopaths are normally the offenders who have some ulterior motive such as power and violence in their sexual aggression. Perhaps you would consider rape a sociopathic behavior, it's certainly not true that all rapists fall into that category.

I can't speak for his source material, haven't done enough research, but the ideas presented are worth discussing and debating. It's certainly not your run of the mill rape topic.

~Tenth

reply to post by Dark Ghost


Ahhhh, let's blame the feminists for changing the way we view rape.

I'm not an expert on feminism by any means. I just know that as a woman, I want to be recognized as a full equal to a man, with the same rights and privileges.

What is the most heinous crime forced on a majority of women? Rape. So it would make sense that as women gain in power, they would bring rape concerns to the forefront. I guess that's the politics of rape referred to in the article.

My question...does categorizing rape as a "political" crime somehow make it less heinous? Is it an attempt to downplay the seriousness of the crime? Or even, dare I say, an attempt to make the woman share the burden of responsibility?

A very sensitive topic, being a male, i feel quite hesitant/uncomfortable to post in threads like these because of the typically were the discussions lead.

None the less i shall instead just make a observation on the information presented instead of any opinionated comment.

To put it simply, a young woman’s vulnerability to rape is greatly reduced if she lives with a father or husband, and a young man is far less likely to become a rapist if he grows up with a father in his home. Yet radical feminists apparently won’t allow this truth to impinge upon their political agenda.

from source

I find this argument interesting and would love to see the statistics to back this up. From a social development prospective, over the course of human evolution, i pose this question: Does this social structure remain true in today's modern world?

Perhaps in the past this model was effective, but I would be interested in seeing the data that supports to claim in a modern world.

Further, I have seen many articles over the past that have inferred that a lot of cases of Rape occur regardless of family social structures.

reply to post by MDDoxs


Generally speaking, with common sense in mind, it would seem rather logical that if a boy was raised with a good, strong, ethical father figure, he would not resort to rape. Or that he would have a better means of dealing with sexual frustration.

Mind you, this is still in the mindset of rapists want power, not sex, as your parental structure has really nothing to do with whether or not you feel inadequate at finding a sexual partner.

Resorting to forced sexual aggression is a sign of a social and mental weakness. The inability to find somebody who will have sexual relations with you is more likely tied to individual experiences outside the home as opposed to what occurred within.

I never had a strong father figure growing up and the rest of my family are well, let's just say 'less than stellar' people. I grew up relatively balanced and healthy because I sought healthy relationships outside of my home.

The opposite could have just as easily of happened.

~Tenth

Originally posted by smyleegrl
Ahhhh, let's blame the feminists for changing the way we view rape.

There is no denying that feminists have played a key part in changing the way society has viewed rape. Facts state that the Feminism movement has been instrumental in changing the definition of rape.

I'm not an expert on feminism by any means. I just know that as a woman, I want to be recognized as a full equal to a man, with the same rights and privileges.

As a man that has a great admiration and respect for women, I agree that women should be granted with the same rights and opportunities as men. The same responsibilities as well. Your use of the word "equal" is problematic btw.

What is the most heinous crime forced on a majority of women? Rape. So it would make sense that as women gain in power, they would bring rape concerns to the forefront. I guess that's the politics of rape referred to in the article.

One could argue that bodily torture (repeated non-sexual violence) is as damaging if not more than rape. It is this idea that "rape is the most heinousness crime imaginable" that has been drummed into your head that is the problem. How about unjustly murdering an immediate relative of a person? Wouldn't that leave one more emotionally scarred than rape?

My question...does categorizing rape as a "political" crime somehow make it less heinous? Is it an attempt to downplay the seriousness of the crime? Or even, dare I say, an attempt to make the woman share the burden of responsibility?

For a non-expert on Feminism, you sure are good at employing their deflection tactics.

The article does NOT claim any of those things. It simply states that Feminism as a political ideology has dishonestly categorised the crime as politically-motivated when most evidence shows that it is sexually-motivated. Stating that something is politically motivated has wide-reaching consequences on the greater issue.

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Interesting points tenth,

I feel this thread may return to a "nature vs nurture" thread. Genetic disposition does greatly effect the person you develop into, and how you are raised, whether it be supportive or abusive, has been shown to effect the physical development of the Brain, thus creating people who could be potentially unbalanced.

I was going to make a point about the driving force of sex being natural and would most likely be the most common reason for rape, but i find myself thinking that a desire for power over others is also an inherent human quality.

Again, i am refraining for any opinionated comments, but even facts can be presented in a biased light..

reply to post by smyleegrl


I would say it is a mix of all the factors you mentioned.

One of the main problems( IMHO) is that our society is based off of unatural situations, and has attempted and failed at trying to train natural instincts out of people.

For example, women ar constantly getting mad at their boyfriend husband for looking at other women, overlooking the fact, it isn't his fault, it is natural, men are hardwired to look for as many partners as possible. Expecting them to be anything but who they are is disengenuous.

Men are also by nature more apt to take what they want, so women walking around wearing "provocative" clothing all the time is helping to further the issue. If women weren't walking around half naked all the time, a lot less men would be tempted to do these heinous acts, as the lower animal insctinct part of the brain would remain more suppressed, do to the lack of visual stimuli.

However, in our society, women walk around wearing a band aid and act like men are pigs, for doing what nature intended them to do, mate with as many women as possible. This is an unsettling, and unrealistic world iew that is pushed on our society, with little to no merit in the long term.

What's wrong with modesty? It is still to this day the norm, for over 90% of the worlds populous, for a reason, as they understand that, out of sight out of mind.

Not to say that I am justifying rape, or allowing the animals side to control your higher brain functionality. As in the end we are still men not animals. So reason should win the day. I am merely trying to point out the obvious.

Women know that men think with the wrong head most of their lives,it isn't their fault, it is the way nature makes us. We just do the best we can at trying to control our..labido. in the end though, I know I am mostly motivated by my carnal desires, not my intelllect, unfortunately. As has been known by society for many years, hence all the bikini wearing women in almost every add that targets men.

For better or worse, the female form is the object of mens desires, at almost all times, of almost everyday. Men are just men, some truly can't overcome their lower brain functions, and their critical thinking skills fail them.

I am not saying it is right to rape women obviously, as that is quite barbaric in my opinion, though a lot of western women exaserbate the issue by over exposing mens feeble minds to sexual stimuli, on a constant basis.

In the end, I don't know what the anwer is, as I believe forcing women to "cover up" is not going to happen. However on the inverse, unless modesty makes a comeback, the problem will persist at todays elevated levels as over stimulating the little head with visual stimuli, will continue to lead to the lesser willed men to perpetuate these heinous acts, in infinitum

This author provides a very interesting commentary and certainly supports her arguments well.

For the record, I am a woman. For that reason, I am able to comment freely without fear of offending anyone. Most rape is not stranger - rape. Rather, it is more likely to be someone known to the woman, who rapes her. A friend or family member. Rape is a crime of opportunity.

I remember when rape stopped being a crime and was instead called sexual assault. I remember being shocked but was assuaged when it was explained that proving that rape occurred also involved proving that penetration occurred whereas to prove sexual assault, you merely had to prove that non-consensual touching took place.

With the passage of time and perhaps greater wisdom?, I now understand that this merely victimized men. In every other crime, you must prove the facts of the case. With rape, it is now merely a he-said/she-said type of crime, with the victor being whoever has the greater credibility in the eyes of the court. The victim in this case is often granted the greater credibility because there is usually no apparent motive to lie. But time and time again, it has been proven that woman often have obscure motives to lie. (revenge, jealously, sympathy from friends for being a victim, attention etc).

I often wonder how many "rapists" are in fact innocent but were convicted because we made it "easier" for the police by removing the burden of proof.

I am also struck by the fact that whenever abortion rights are discussed, rape victims are brought forward as the prime example of why abortion rights are necessary. They are used as weapon to silence pro-life arguments. This is a prime example of the using rape as a political weapon.

Now, don't get me wrong. I am strongly pro-abortion. But isn't it enough, given the physical and emotional difficulty of properly raising a child, for a woman to say "no, I can't do this right now, I am not ready, I am not in a position to financially provide for a child (or another child as the case may be).

As for the author's other comments regarding children raised in a heterosexual couple. She is absolutely correct in how children learn how to relate to the opposite sex. However, she is absolutely wrong that it has to be the mother or father who provides the role of the opposite sex. Obviously, any loving adult can and do fulfill that role.

Tired of Control Freaks

reply to post by MDDoxs

I feel this thread may return to a "nature vs nurture" thread. Genetic disposition does greatly effect the person you develop into, and how you are raised, whether it be supportive or abusive, has been shown to effect the physical development of the Brain, thus creating people who could be potentially unbalanced.

Yes, I agree with that. Although genetic disposition as a means of determining mental illness or sexual deviancy is light on research in most cases. I think most of us are a combination of both nature and nurture in the end and it really just depends on whether or not you can find positive relationships and experiences.

In my case for example, my parents showed me what ' not to do' so to speak when it came to raising kids. So even though my childhood was less than great, I still do not regret those experiences as they forced me to have a more positive and balanced outlook on how I raise my children today.

I was going to make a point about the driving force of sex being natural and would most likely be the most common reason for rape, but i find myself thinking that a desire for power over others is also an inherent human quality.

Physical power vs emotional power are two different things. I would think that rape is far more of an emotionally driven crime than a physical one. Although again, these things are open to interpretation.

As for you not sharing your opinion, I honestly think that's a damn shame. Another testament to how the conversation has been warped to exclude some, because their views and opinions are ridiculed or seen as less than valid.

~Tenth

Originally posted by Dark Ghost
Remember also that while the central thesis of this article is that in the majority of cases Rape is not a politically motivated crime, there may be a minority of cases where power is a contributing factor in the Rapist's motivations.

In my life, I have never heard feminists claim that rape is a politically-motivated crime. I believe you misunderstood something. You seem to think a power-motivation is the same as a political motivation. For the crime itself. The crime itself is motivated by violence and PERSONAL power or sexual power or even lust, but it's not politically-motivated.

Now. Has rape been used as a political tool? I'm sure it has.

I have been raped. In my case, I would consider it a crime of a sexual nature. But I think it's different with each offense. I don't think it's always about sex, but neither do think it's always about power.

From your source:

If a criminal sees your car and wants it, he takes it. If a criminal sees you and wants you sexually, he takes you.

How does this explain old, ugly, fat women being raped? The author is suggesting that women get raped because they are desirable, when clearly, that is not always the case.

If a rapist’s goal was other than sex, such as a desire to inflict violence upon his victim, why do most rapists not inflict high degrees of physical injuries on their victims?

Being raped is a violent act in itself. Rapists are sometimes satisfied by the emotional violence they inflict. No further injuries are necessary to "satisfy" the rapist's need to inflict violence.

On the other hand, it is necessary for a man to have some type of sexual desire before he can rape.

See comment above about old, fat ugly women being raped.

Rape is not a political act of male domination and patriarchal control, as feminists conspiratorially allege.

Then how do we explain organizations that cover-up and protect their own who have raped? Football teams, Christian organizations, the military. All run by mostly men, all cover up and protect their own from sexual assault and rape charges and investigations.

I don't think we can say that rape is never an act of male domination and patriarchal control. I know better.

Bottom line, I agree with this article on some points and disagree with most. And Dr. Trayce Hansen (the article's author) is not credible.

Source

Dr. Hansen never had been qualified as an expert witness by any court. Dr. Hansen never had been retained by any party as an expert witness. Dr. Hansen’s psychology practice involved geriatric patients. Dr. Hansen conceded that she currently did not work with children and had fewer than four years of professional experience after earning her Ph.D. She had worked as a research assistant and had published one article in the journal Personality Assessment in a forensic-type situation.

reply to post by inverslyproportional


I completely disagree with your assertion that woman invite rape by dressing provocatively. If it were the case that men simply could not control themselves in the presence of a provocatively dressed woman, rape would occur in a public place, in front of witnesses.

If a man can control himself to the point where he can delay his gratification until he can get the woman in a semi-private place, where there are no witnesses, then he can hardly claim to have been provoked to the point where he lost control of his sexuality.

Further, rape of woman wearing burkas is quite common in middle eastern countries. Rape of woman in tribal cultures where the woman may be naked or semi-naked in also just as common.

How a woman looks has NOTHING to do with it. An ugly woman dressed in sweats is just as much as risk as a beautiful woman in a skirt with a low-cut top.

Tired of Control Freaks

reply to post by tothetenthpower

Yes, I agree with that. Although genetic disposition as a means of determining mental illness or sexual deviancy is light on research in most cases. I think most of us are a combination of both nature and nurture in the end and it really just depends on whether or not you can find positive relationships and experiences.

I agree. A combination of the two is most likely to determine the person you become and just like you have mentioned, the results can very as per your own personal experiences. One could develop into a outstanding member of society or a rapist whose motivations are not quite so clear. I would mention that if you have the genetic predisposition, coupled with a traumatic up bringing, the likely hood of you developing into a social misfit is increase, but is not always the case.

As for you not sharing your opinion, I honestly think that's a damn shame. Another testament to how the conversation has been warped to exclude some, because their views and opinions are ridiculed or seen as less than valid.

I have chosen to refrain from offering my own in opinion in the hopes to maintain the flow of thread without risk of accidently making a comment that is taken offensively by another party. It does bother me that i feel i have to censor myself in some cases, not that i have offense opinions, but anything these days can be misconstrued as a verbal assault, which falls in the line with the apparent motivations (fighting domination, regardless of facts) of feminism as described by the author of the paper.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Benevolent Heretic

I am sorry that you were raped. You didn't say much but it sounds like a date-rape situation or one where your rapist was known to you. It must have been a horrible experience.

But rape is very much used as a political weapon. I remember the days when woman were trained not to go out after dark for fear of rape. I remember having to overcome that fear in order to experience that wonderful sensation of feeling soft summer breezes and looking at the stars.

I remember the Catholic Church approving the public viewing of pornographic movies that all had the same theme, "bad" girl sneaks out after dark and parties with the boys - with rape and even gang rape being the "wages of her sins"

The reason for the burka and other control behaviors that woman must abide by is to "avoid being raped".

I gave another example with the abortion issue.

And yes- rape occurs because some men cannot abide being denied what they want by a woman.

Tired of Control Freaks

reply to post by TiredofControlFreaks


You assumption that "I am am woman so I am free to to comment without offending anyone" is well. Badly worded at best, and idiotic more than likely. Being a woman no more gives you the ability not to offend than it gives you more right to comment on the subject matter.

You overgeneralized and lumped all men and all rape into the same catagory. Istead of reading my post. I said" lesser willed men" as in men who do not have the will power to override animal instinct with reason. But I suppose that was probably intentional on your part.

Also, it is known that women who are wearing pprovocative clothing are more likely to be raped, than women who are not.

You once again lumped all rape and rape vikctims together by trying to say, my assertions were flat wrong because fat ugly women still get raped. Yes they do, but in much smaller numbers. As has been my experience. I know several women who have been raped, not one of them was fat, old, or ugly, at the time the rape occured. Not all were raped while wearing skimpy clothing, a full half were raped by men that saw them wearing skimpy clothing, at the, the pool etc and followed them home. Describing during the assaault how they " were so hot in that oufit, they just had to have them."


I never one time said women invite rape on themselves, that is ludicrous. You can't invite unwannted criminal attack. The word invite means you wanted it, even welcomed it. That is a complete load of crap and you know it. I said, basically what a car insurancr company says. Don't leave the keys in the car and it is less likely to be stolen. Or in my wordingn " out of site out of mind" as the criminnal who will rape women, are more often than not motivated , like all men, by visual stimuli. It is a fact, not an opinion.

This will be my last response to you in this thread unless you at least try to be objectiive and a lot less obtuse in your responses.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

In my life, I have never heard feminists claim that rape is a politically-motivated crime. I believe you misunderstood something. You seem to think a power-motivation is the same as a political motivation. For the crime itself. The crime itself is motivated by violence and PERSONAL power or sexual power or even lust, but it's not politically-motivated.

Please see this link: Feminist Perspectives on Rape

Some Radical Feminists view male-on-female rape as one of the negative products of a patriarchal system.

Now. Has rape been used as a political tool? I'm sure it has.

Rape as an issue affecting women has been used as a MAJOR political tool.

I have been raped. In my case, I would consider it a crime of a sexual nature. But I think it's different with each offense. I don't think it's always about sex, but neither do think it's always about power.

I am sorry to hear of your experience, I hope you have been able to overcome the trauma and hardship you faced following the incident.

I agree with you, the motivation can be different for each case. Quite a large number of people seem to think rape is always motivated by a lust for power and domination. What I am trying to demonstrate is that it is usually far more often driven by a desire for sex than a lust for power. There are far easier ways to assert power and domination over another person than raping them.

From your source:

If a criminal sees your car and wants it, he takes it. If a criminal sees you and wants you sexually, he takes you.

How does this explain old, ugly, fat women being raped? The author is suggesting that women get raped because they are desirable, when clearly, that is not always the case.

The author is stating that in most cases, sexual appeal from the perpetrator's perspective is a major contributing factor to the crime. Somebody might be very attracted to old fat women. Just because there are a handful of exceptions does not negate an overall pattern. Do you really think attractiveness is not a factor at all?

If a rapist’s goal was other than sex, such as a desire to inflict violence upon his victim, why do most rapists not inflict high degrees of physical injuries on their victims?

Being raped is a violent act in itself. Rapists are sometimes satisfied by the emotional violence they inflict. No further injuries are necessary to "satisfy" the rapist's need to inflict violence.

That is a valid point, but it does not negate the fact that perpetrators seem to stop after they have achieved sexual gratification.

Rape is not a political act of male domination and patriarchal control, as feminists conspiratorially allege.

Then how do we explain organizations that cover-up and protect their own who have raped? Football teams, Christian organizations, the military. All run by mostly men, all cover up and protect their own from sexual assault and rape charges and investigations.

It's strange that you initially claimed it is not a politically-motivated crime, and then you go on to post such a response.

I don't think we can say that rape is never an act of male domination and patriarchal control. I know better.

See above reply.

Bottom line, I agree with this article on some points and disagree with most. And Dr. Trayce Hansen (the article's author) is not credible.

That does not make her "not credible", it means her credibility is not up to your standards.

Originally posted by MDDoxs
A very sensitive topic, being a male, i feel quite hesitant/uncomfortable to post in threads like these because of the typically were the discussions lead.

None the less i shall instead just make a observation on the information presented instead of any opinionated comment.

To put it simply, a young woman’s vulnerability to rape is greatly reduced if she lives with a father or husband, and a young man is far less likely to become a rapist if he grows up with a father in his home. Yet radical feminists apparently won’t allow this truth to impinge upon their political agenda.

from source

I find this argument interesting and would love to see the statistics to back this up. From a social development prospective, over the course of human evolution, i pose this question: Does this social structure remain true in today's modern world?

Perhaps in the past this model was effective, but I would be interested in seeing the data that supports to claim in a modern world.

Further, I have seen many articles over the past that have inferred that a lot of cases of Rape occur regardless of family social structures.

edit on 8-9-2012 by MDDoxs because: (no reason
given)

edit on 8-9-2012 by MDDoxs because: grammer not so good in morning

I, too, would like to see some data on this.

IMO, rape is more often a crime of opportunity. A woman doesn't spend her entire life being chaperoned. And a lot of rape survivors knew their attackers.