When Roe v Wade is overturned, what will punishment be for the crime of abortion?

The same as murder, as it should be. Having an abortion is no different than me shoting my neighbor in the head, well it is because a gun shot is much quicker than a pair of scissors being jammed through your skull.

Originally posted by OptimusSubprime
The same as murder, as it should be. Having an abortion is no different than me shoting my neighbor in the head, well it is because a gun shot is much quicker than a pair of scissors being jammed through your skull.

so, does this mean that you'd agree to legislation regarding mandatory castration for the fathers ??

reply to post by OptimusSubprime


If your neighbor crawled INSIDE your body before you shot him, then I would say you have that right.

Originally posted by OptimusSubprime
The same as murder, as it should be. Having an abortion is no different than me shoting my neighbor in the head, well it is because a gun shot is much quicker than a pair of scissors being jammed through your skull.

If it's done early enough is there even a skull present? I thought there was no skull until 2-3 months please correct me if I am mistaken.

Whenever someone premeditates ending the life of another human it is considered 1st degree murder (unless of course if the person being killed was found guilty in a court of law). The same goes if you pay someone else to kill another human. With that said, the same punnishment for 1st degree murder would apply.

For a party that likes to preach about personal freedoms and individual liberty, they sure like to restrict the choices one has when it goes against the grain of their social values.

If RvW is overturned then I simply see women going to states that abortion is legal in to have theirs, or a mass exodus of individuals moving to the states which adhere to their social values.

reply to post by Evil_Santa

Originally posted by Evil_Santa
For a party that likes to preach about personal freedoms and individual liberty, they sure like to restrict the choices one has when it goes against the grain of their social values.

AMEN! That's exactly the hypocrisy I am so unnerved by.

On the OP:

In states that ban abortion, abortion will move from the clinic to the bedroom. In most Latin American countries, abortion is illegal with a prison sentence of up to 30 years for women who have abortions--but there are still about four times as many abortions in Latin America as there are in the United States. Why? Because women who can't have abortions at clinics are still perfectly capable of shelling out two dollars for a black market abortifacient. And there are many, many abortifacients--ranging from common herbs to mass-produced anti-ulcer drugs. The police can't keep marijuana off the streets; they would have even less success with abortifacients. Bedroom abortions are much less safe than clinic abortions--approximately 80,000 women die every year from do-it-yourself abortions--but it's not as if having an abortion is anybody's idea of a good time to begin with, and many women will still be having abortions regardless of the legal or physical risks. This is why many people who do not personally approve of abortion still strongly identify as pro-choice.

Making abortion illegal will galvanize the fact that prohibition DOES NOT work!

Civil Liberty

Greetings,
As much as it would ideal for no abortions I'm afraid they will continue until society matures enough so that they are not necessary or desired.
I'm seventy four and so lived thru and experience first hand the destructive results of restricted abortions, including the mothers' death from infection from clothes hangers.
This issue goes beyond personal beliefs, This is a path to total non sectarian government. There are those who desire to control us thru their perverted view of religious laws, just lake the radical Muslims.
When a good portion of a society is addicted to cult religions then you have the conflict you are now seeing.
These dogooders don't seem to want to address the misery that the child many times endures because the parent/s do not have the ability to raise a child and therefore we have the dysfunctional person who many times is on life long welfare or becomes a criminal
What is really criminal is the actions of the politicians that use this issue to inflame people to get votes.
We have a very sick society and this issue is only one result of that sickness.
Monday morning quarterbacking may be fun and allow a sense of righteousness, but it doesn't solve the problem.
How many politicians have advocated parent training before marriage or pregnancy?
Politicians love these type of conditions because it allows finger pointing and declarations that they are going to do something about it. The worse it is the better they rejoice in it.
Until we cure the sickness of our selves and society this problem or others like it will continue on and on and on ......

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Well, Romney is calling for it now.

Election tactic. That's all. Campaign bloviating. He's trying to make all the fundamentalists like him and think he's 'OKAY' .. the fundamentalists who don't want him because he's a Mormon and not a protestant.

Romney can't change it. Obama can't change it. No one can change it.

The genie is out of the bottle. You can't catch smoke when it has escaped.

reply to post by FlyersFan


I agree, it's en election tactic, but I'm not worried about it happening soon, it would be right before his reelection in 2016 that he's likely to do something about it. No, Romney can't do it by himself, but he can appoint TP judges to the SC and Congress can pass federal legislation to declare life begins at conception. That would, in effect, overrule Roe v Wade.

There is NO worse punishment than to be stuck with a child!

Prison? Death?

I would GLADLY be put to death as alternative to dealing with a child, husband, and a particle board house in Suburbia. That is *living death* anyway.

Who wants that? That IS death!

Keep this in mind - ALL religion is FALSE and TPTB know this. They only want you to breed to make more consumers and soldiers. YOU and your offspring are like livestock to them - and you only exist so they can make money off your backs.

This is why they want you to breed more. Just like a livestock breeder. Make money off of YOU - their livestock.

Do YOU wish to live in the Breeding Pens of Suburbia? I sure as hell DON'T!

Please DO go ahead and kill me! - if the alternative is being a Suburban Housewife!

Does anybody have any good ideas about how we can reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies? If we could eliminate the root cause then abortion would cease to be an issue.

The punishment will be having a litter of rotten brats. The kind that grow up to be 'pro-lifers'.
I don't see why you all don't move in with "OctoMom" for a few months and see just nice THAT is!

See, I'm one of those who believe abortion should not be a choice--I think it should be compulsory for all infected with pregnancy. Humans really don't need to continue this parasitic existence.

reply to post by desert

Surely it is the abortionists, not the women who frequent them, who would be punished?

I live on the other side of the world, in a country with a population of about twenty million. Abortion is illegal except to protect the life of the mother. There is no specified punishment for the woman, but convicted abortionists get between three and seven years' prison. With late-term abortions, a fine may also be imposed at the discretion of the magistrate.

Yet whether it is women or abortionists who are punished, the punishment will have to be harsh indeed if it is to deter women from having abortions.

According to the national Family Planning Association, whose annual report I helped edit last year, between 600 and a thousand illegal abortions are performed in my country every day. That's about 300,000 abortions a year.

This happens despite those legal penalties for abortionists, the massive social stigma suffered by women in a conservative Asian culture who have abortions, religious disapproval (in which all major faiths worshipped here are united) and all the terrible dangers of illegal abortion.

Overturning Roe vs. Wade is not going to stop desperate American women from having abortions. It probably will not even affect the number of abortions very much.

reply to post by Astyanax
I agree with your points and the implications. This is from a 2003 WHO report on 'unsafe abortions.'

Each year, throughout the world, approximately 210 million women become pregnant and some 130 million of them go on to deliver live-born infants. The remaining 80 million pregnancies end in stillbirth, or spontaneous or induced abortion. Approximately 42 million4 pregnancies are voluntarily terminated each year – 22 million within the national legal system and 20 million outside it. In the latter case, the abortions are often performed by unskilled providers or in unhygienic conditions, or both.

whqlibdoc.who.int...

It goes on to note that 1 in 4 women will experience serious problems including death. Of course, this doesn't happen in a vacuum and impacts family as well as emergency services. It's inevitable that even death penalties won't prevent some women from taking this route and we already know that death penalties won't dissuade the 'back-alley abortionist.'

In terms of societal impact, it wasn't too long ago that Catholic Irish girls would have to leave the country for abortions. It was happening in the 1990s. Shame and condemnation from neighbours! Anonymous phone-calls to spread the news. Malicious gossip. Some would enjoy a return of the curtain-twitching community and would applaud the criminalisation of millions of people. They like to present themselves as full of compassion for these unborn lives and yet seem to have none left to spare for the rest of humanity.

reply to post by jeantherapy

Originally posted by jeantherapy
Does anybody have any good ideas about how we can reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies?

1. Education is the most important.
2. Change the negative and judgmental social perceptions of pregnancy, women having sex and birth control.
3. Make birth control HIGHLY accessible, without the negative connotations of women being promiscuous.
4. Get religion OUT of government.

The GOP is actively fighting ALL of the above... Hmmm...

I find it real strange that most people who are "pro-LIFE" are also "pro-WAR" and "pro-DEATH PENALTY".

As well many "pro-LIFE" people enjoy hunting for sport?!?!?!

I know, I know, it is all so confusing....how can some people be so adamant about protecting a fetus in the womb and have the same passion about going to war and KILLING the enemy?

If RvW ever gets overturned and we head back to the dark ages look for a big population increase of poor white trash babies raised by immature teenage mothers while daddy's in prison doing 7-12 for drugs.

Thank you for the replies. I wanted to put out there the real possibility of RvW being overturned, with the criminal implications, find out opinions, and I haven't been dissapointed.

Originally posted by KeliOnyx
reply to post by olaru12

 

No they didn't want to overturn it. However now the once minority of the party has taken control and will overturn it at the first opportunity. It took about a generation to do but the Paul Ryan's of the party are the product of Regan's use of the Religious Right to bolster the party ranks. They aren't just using the theocrats they are the theocrats themselves.

"They aren't just using the theocrats they are the theocrats themselves." Ok, I think this sums it up. Socially, America has changed, and certainly in the political area it has done a 180.

A man was chosen a heartbeat away from POTUS, one of these young theocrats:
List of anti-abortion bills Ryan/Akin co-sponsored

The following sentiments this candidate expressed re God and rights are lauded as correct by many who would in effect like a theocracy:

“Our rights come from nature and God, not from government. We promise equal opportunity, not equal outcomes!” – Catholic Paul Ryan during VP announcement speech August 11, 2012. This comment drew the largest applause and cheers followed by the chant U.S.A., U.S.A, U. S. A!

source

As was noted on pg 1 ...

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher

[states] already have the power to punish self abortions.

And the woman in New York could be sentenced up to a year in jail. When the abortion laws are re-done to reflect no abortion to severely restricted abortions, I believe the punishment of jail time for women would continue, and be introduced in states who do not currently have such provisions. The minimum could be community service.

Before RvW (1975) there was an acknowledgement in American culture that females would be respected, if not in private, at least in public. After 1980, the cultural rules changed to include, for ex, having females publicly castigated as murderers (re abortion) and feminazis. Nowadays, females would be punished legally for self induced abortion.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by jeantherapy

 

Originally posted by jeantherapy
Does anybody have any good ideas about how we can reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies?

2. Change the negative and judgmental social perceptions of pregnancy, women having sex and birth control.
3. Make birth control HIGHLY accessible, without the negative connotations of women being promiscuous.
4. Get religion OUT of government.

The GOP is actively fighting ALL of the above... Hmmm...

The only negative judgement I make when I see a pregnant lady is one I keep to myself but it goes like this (Oh great, another future Earth destroyer)

I feel like birth control is accessible, I've seen 15 year old girls taking it and we may agree that girls that age shouldn't be sexually active. Also isn't this taking effect now: usgovinfo.about.com...

It's rather a charade, religion in our government. Not only is our current president a former pracising muslim but he is not now and will never be a christian, nor was George W or his father, etc. You can't order men to their deaths as casually as you order sub sandwiches for lunch and expect people to still believe you are a christian.