Lakewood (Colorado) Cake Shop Refuses Wedding Cake To Gay Couple.

reply to post by Annee


You do realize that all of the previous minority discriminations haven't gone bye bye, but underground?

So this really isn't the last one, and if it does go anywhere, it won't be far away. Just like the rest of our prejudices.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by OutKast Searcher

 

If you honestly don't see what is wrong with discrimination...then it is because you have a mindset that you agree with it.

I know what I believe is wrong with discrimination, but I don't see how it is any of my business, or yours, to dictate what other people believe.

How would you like to be forced to have a relationship with the biggest racist and biggot you can imagine? Is that anybody else's right to force you to create that relationship? If you had a business, and somebody came in your business that totally disgusted you with their very being, don't you have a right to refuse them service?

Sure, it is simple to say discrimination is wrong, but that doesn't mean I want to force everyone to be ok with everything and live together in some fantasy land.

Very valid point. As a descendent of holocaust survivors, I would not want to be forced to do business with Neo-nazis or KKK members and I sure would not want them on my property. Freedom of association goes both ways. If a Nazi does not like it, he can take his business elsewhere.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by nixie_nox

 

But on my wedding day, I wanted the best cake I could get, and there is only one place around me, the cake is divine.

If I wasn't allowed in for being Italian (which wasn't all that long ago) or whatever reason, I would be devastated. It would upset the whole process for me.

And if they hated you, because you were Italian, but the were forced to make your cake anyway, do you think it would still be divine?

They shouldn't hate me in the first place due to any characteristic. It is 2012, we should be passed our phobias. Next all the Gay Hating right wing bakers are going to want to put engaged gays into concentration camps.

This is how it starts people.

Would you still want it, knowing they made it because they were forced to do so? Would the process be any better, and the result be any less devastating? Would you still want to support their business?

I would rub it in their face for a good 15 minutes how the silly bigots had to make my cake.

Again,the point you are missing is that these choices should not be removed from people. It is a form of emotional abuse.

Really, how Christian is it to make people feel ostracized and feel bad about themselves?

If someone hates me, I'm going to hate them back, not ask the authorities to come force them to like me.

They don't have ot like you, but they don't have to marginalize you either. What they can do is keep their mouth shut.
And getting authorities to enforce it, works. Because black people are no longer forced to sit in the back of the bus. it took the few minorities to change that. And it wasn't popular at the time.

Suppose I'm a Chevy mechanic, and I HATE Fords. Should I be forced to work on Fords just because I'm the best mechanic in town? What if the authorities do tell me it is work on this Ford or go out of business, and I say screw them and shut down the business. Now nobody gets their car fixed, the best mechanic in town is now a landscaper. Is that the solution we're going for?

You would be a pretty lousy mechanic losing money by refusing jobs. And I am sure that a better businessman, who likes both Fords and Chevy's, would be happy to take your place and make the money that you didn't want too.

Originally posted by nixie_nox
reply to post by Stormdancer777

 

Yea its Colorado.

In a more liberal area, that bakery would be dead in a week.

Colorado it conservative?

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


I did not dodge a question. I am staying with the topic. The topic is about making cakes for the action of gay marriage. It has nothing to do with being gay, he already stated that. It has nothing to do with abortions or race. It is about an action he does not agree with. Also I answered the question you asked on target or did not read it correctly? If someone wanted an abortion cake he could deny that. It is his right.

As for bringing up the bars I was under the impression you were implying they were a private club in your post to me. If not I am sorry I misunderstood.

See the problem is you see this as discrimination based on who the people are. I see it based on an action the owner disagrees with. As I said we can take him at his word or everyone here is a liar as well. He said he will make gays any other cake but a wedding cake. He is opposed to the idea of the definition of marriage.

I can point to 3 others that will agree with me on this. One is a man I work with who happens to be gay, he is opposed to the idea of gay marriage, another is a young man who is also a student at school with my wife he thinks it is wrong also and he is also gay. My wife who either was gay or is bisexual with a preference for women is also against the idea of gay marriage. It is not that they are against the idea of them being in a relationship and being united in the eyes of the government they just think the use of the word marriage is for religious purpose only. I can agree with this myself. Actually if not for my beliefs I would not be married or united in the eyes of the government as you get taxed more here for being married than when you are single.


That being said again this is about an action he is against not a people. That is why your Japanese question is completely irrelevant.

Raist

Originally posted by Spiramirabilis
reply to post by nixie_nox

 

actually - the Denver-Metro area is fairly liberal - as compared to the rest of Colorado. Boulder Colorado of course being as liberal as it gets - anywhere

I think just because he says business is booming doesn't mean that's actually true

What's he going to say - really? :-)

Apparently (from the article) he refused to make a Halloween cake for someone as well

:-)

edit on 8/1/2012 by Spiramirabilis because: (no reason given)

I stand corrected. LOL

So are we hearing about the only right wing religious nut in the area?

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


Well,DestroyDestroyDestroy asked,

Originally posted by DestroyDestroyDestroy
I don't see how this is any different than refusing a wedding cake to a black or multiracial couple; it's all bigotry,

And a black christian group gave him their answer.

Did you watch the video?

reply to post by getreadyalready

Segregation didn't work

Not sure how you mean this

Segregation did work - when it was legal

Should we have left things the way they were?

Originally posted by getreadyalready

I have no problem with people organizing a boycott of CFA. I think it will fail miserably, because from what I have seen the press coverage is only helping CFA, but I still support you in boycotting them if you disagree with what they stand for.

Not according to the reports I'm reading.

A few years ago I think you'd be right. Times are a changing.

Some colleges have Chick-fil-A on campus. There are boycotts to kick them out.

Sports teams who had contracts with Chick-fil-A - - - are not renewing them.

It won't put them out of business - - - I'd say its a strong warning to any other businesses. So - even if the boycott doesn't have any major effect on CFA - - - it will probably have a positive effect from other businesses.

reply to post by nixie_nox

Really, how Christian is it to make people feel ostracized and feel bad about themselves?

I'm not a Christian, so it is none of my concern how good they are at following their own chosen faith? Seems pretty irrelavent.

They don't have ot like you, but they don't have to marginalize you either. What they can do is keep their mouth shut.

Really? We should make it mandatory that anyone can come into their private place of business and demand service, and they have to just keep their mouth shut?

You would be a pretty lousy mechanic losing money by refusing jobs. And I am sure that a better businessman, who likes both Fords and Chevy's, would be happy to take your place and make the money that you didn't want too.

Here we finally agree, but this is the opposite of what you said earlier. You said you wanted the best wedding cake in town, and only one place could provide it, but now you are saying they would be a terrible business and someone else would be happy to take their place. Which is it? Should they have the opportunity to be terrible and let someone else take their business, or should they be forced to do work they don't want to do?

Do you really think you're wedding cake would be the quality you want it if they were forced to make it against their will? There is no way I would want that cake from someone that apparently hates me and everything I stand for.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Annee

 

You do realize that all of the previous minority discriminations haven't gone bye bye, but underground?

Of course. I meant legally. I've personally witnessed the: Fair Housing Act - Civil Rights Act - Disability Act.

So this really isn't the last one, and if it does go anywhere, it won't be far away. Just like the rest of our prejudices.

It is the last major one. Of course - - in the future we'll probably be discriminating against "off planet beings" - - trying to mate with Earth women. Poor souls.

reply to post by Annee


Maybe you'll be right, but I never heard or saw a word about Chick Fil A other than my kids wanting to go to their on the school function nights, and now all of a sudden I have people asking to meet me there for lunch and dinner every day, and my FB page is flooded with stupid stuff to either love or hate.

Like I said, on this matter, I don't have any strong feeling, so I won't boycott, and I happen to love their food and their customer service, so I'll still be eating there. My personal observation is that it has gotten them positive support among the people around me, but I'm sure it is just the opposite in other circles. We'll have to see how it pans out in the end.

Damn all of a sudden I am craving cake,


I need cake

reply to post by nixie_nox

So are we hearing about the only right wing religious nut in the area?

:-)

it's all about percentages - Denver is an interesting mix

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
Damn all of a sudden I am craving cake,

I need cake

edit on 033131p://bWednesday2012 by Stormdancer777 because: (no reason given)

I was thinking the same thing!! All this talk of cake is making me HUNGRY! And not just any ol' cake. I want a good fluffy, moist, yellow cake, with chocolate icing, and not that stupid butter creme icing, the good stuff with powdered sugar in it! And I want the little crunchy round sprinkles that go on top.

reply to post by getreadyalready

I’m black and gay and I’ll still eat at Chick-fil-A
youtu.be...

Originally posted by getreadyalready

Like I said, on this matter, I don't have any strong feeling, so I won't boycott, and I happen to love their food and their customer service, so I'll still be eating there. My personal observation is that it has gotten them positive support among the people around me, but I'm sure it is just the opposite in other circles. We'll have to see how it pans out in the end.

Just be honest with yourself and know who you are supporting by eating there.

Million Moms is also under the umbrella of NOM.

NOM Lets Others Do Their Dirty Work

by Mark Potok -March 27, 2012

About the worst thing said about gay men, an allegation that is regularly dragged out by certain religious-right organizations, is that they molest children at rates vastly higher than their heterosexual counterparts. It is as devastating a charge as one can make in a country where jailed pedophiles, known in prison parlance as “short eyes,” are frequently murdered by self-righteous fellow inmates.

But it is also completely false, a demonizing construct long ago debunked and denounced by virtually all relevant scientific organizations and serious researchers. That’s why the National Organization for Marriage (NOM), the leading opponent of same-sex marriage but also a group that prides itself on keeping its criticisms of homosexuality both civil and factual, does not employ the accusation.

Or does it?

Last Nov. 15, the Ruth Institute, a project of the NOM Education Fund, published the first eight paragraphs of an essay by anti-gay activist Michael Brown that asked what topic even far-right radio host Rush Limbaugh might be afraid to bring up in the face of “political correctness.” The part of the essay on the Ruth Institute website didn’t say what that topic was, but gave a “Keep Reading” link to a site run by an openly gay-bashing hate group, the American Family Association.

www.splcenter.org...

reply to post by Annee


I think he left to bake a cake.

Originally posted by Stormdancer777

I’m black and gay and I’ll still eat at Chick-fil-A

I know its shocking - - but LGBT are not a group think. They are individuals.

Just exactly like heteros - - not every LGBT person is political or do they care.

In other words - - they're as human as the rest of us.

reply to post by getreadyalready

nobody should be FORCING someone to go against their belief and accept and promote gay marriage, or abortion, or anything else that violates their personal beliefs.

Do you really believe that? That opens the door to plethora of rather atrocious examples to test it... Drastic example: we don't respect and approve the rapist who personally believes his actions are okay. We indeed force that person to go against that belief. I am sure you don't actually support the position that it's always wrong to force someone to go against their beliefs. Sometimes it's the most ethical thing to do. Sometimes in the spirit of equality and happiness for a group of people, the most ethical thing to do is to not allow the practice of said belief.

I have no problem with gay marriage, but others do, and they have every right to feel the way they feel.

And everyone else has the right to feel about the way they feel ^_^

It surprises me how often either side takes issue when they are told they are being offenseive with their views. It's a two way street, dish it out but can't take it?? Either side should expect and appreciate the offense towards their views.