Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at Salt Lake grocery store

Good deal. More armed citizens=Less victims.

reply to post by DAVID64


Yeah, he would've totally round housed the knife outta that guys hand and as it was twirling in the air, he would've Karate chopped him in the throat, caught the knife, and then threw it into the guys heart.

Then, he would've said some really cool movie line as the guy was bleeding out like,
"Stick a fork in him......He's done"

Then everyone would've been all applauding and throwing him up on their shoulders and chanting his name.
....and then his mom would've been all like, "son, you're not grounded anymore".

Weeks later the President would've called him and invited him to White House for a private party with strippers and Coke.......'a'cola.

Yeah, if only he would've been there with his imposing figure.
Damn the luck.

Another pro/anti gun thread? Talk about beating a dead horse :/ All I'm seeing is a debate that keeps going around in circles.. the OP is forcing people to select between two answers, one of which would make you sound pro-gun and support the OPs opinion, and the other makes you sound like a total buffoon.

People 'snap' all the time. Sometimes it's without warning, If everyone has a gun, then you have more chance of people getting killed when someone "snaps" vs gun control where someone snaps and have to either use their fists, or a knife, batton etc.

My arguments for gun control are -

1) To kill with a knife, it's personal. You need to touch the person which makes them "real". With a gun you can kill from a distance which helps to "de-humanize" the victim in the shooters eyes (ie: makes it easier to kill someone).

2) Even with the sharpest, most bad arse knife ever made you're severely limited to the number of casualties you can create due to the fact you have to either a) Throw the knife, then run over and retrieve it or b) Physically run up to the person.

3) If you're lucky you'll strike a major artery and kill the person, but you're far more likely to cause a severe but survivable wound. Compare to any decent caliber weapon where basically, you hit the head, chest, lungs...there's a more than fair chance that person is dead due to bullet fragmentation causing a much more traumatic injury.

4) Throwing a knife and retrieving it/Walking upto the target and stabbing them takes time...time that others have to run away, grab a broom/something longer than the attacker knife reach to defend themselves, take the attacker down and for SWAT/Police to turn up. Compare to a gun where the only time "wasted" by the shooter is when they have to reload.

5) Guns can shoot through car windows, car doors, timber doors, couches, pot plants...typical things people would try to hide behind to protect themselves. When was the last time you saw a knife kill someone by being thrown/stabbed through a glass window?

6) With a close combat weapon like a knife, it takes time to focus on your next target and position yourself to attack them. Compare to a gun where you can kill someone across the room, then the person next to you, then the person riding past on their bike, all without having to move or leave yourself "open".

7) One handgun in each hand and you double your firepower and potential hit-rate. One knife in each hand and you... still take the same amount of time to find the next target. The only advantage is now you can stab each target twice as fast (theoretically). End result? You can kill ALOT more people, alot quicker with a gun than you can with a knife...and let's face facts here, in most massacres the guns used where legally obtained.

8) Countless stories of people shooting their brother/wife/husband/sister because they panicked and thought the person was an intruder. With a knife they may have caused severe injury but there's a much greater chance that the victim would survive.

9) Countries with high rates of gun ownership also lead the pack in highest rate of gun-related deaths....

I'm sure I could come up with a host of other arguments to support gun control but those are the first ones that come to mind.

In reference to the recent cinema shooting, the movie was playing which means the room was dark. In this situation having a gun in your possession would not have provided an obvious benefit. A responsible gun owner would know that they only had a relatively small chance of actually hitting the right person without hitting an innocent cinema goer...also, most people when in extreme situations tend to panic and either freeze or think irrationally (ie: shoot in general direction and hope you hit the target). When you go into survival mode, all you really think about is "how can I protect myself". You stop thinking about how your actions would affect those around you...it becomes irrelevant.

Like I stated in the other thread, yes the US has the 2nd ammendment, but times change, people change, society changes and sometimes you have to face a hard truth that maybe some of your laws and protected rights have become archaic or no longer relevant. The stuck-in-the-mud "it's been like this for generations and I refuse to accept change even though there's an obvious problem" attitude is a guaranteed road to ruin...

Congratulations- you finally found the one example in the world of a gun preventing violence.

Now lets add up all the people who get injured or killed with guns and see which is bigger.

Originally posted by CB328
Congratulations- you finally found the one example in the world of a gun preventing violence.

Now lets add up all the people who get injured or killed with guns and see which is bigger.

"the one example"

Interesting, shows how much you know. Just to be helpful I brought more to the forefront for you.

2 men kicking in a door stopped

The homeowner told police he saw a van stop in front of his house, then saw a male come to the front door and start knocking. A second male left the van, and also began knocking, Chafee said. "As the victim [of the home invasion] was approaching the door, the suspects began to kick the door," Chaffee said. "The victim opened the door and at that time felt in fear for his life."

89 year old stops two burglars

Before she could even get out of bed, two men broke in ruby’s back door and made their way inside. “Then I heard a loud noise and I said it was somebody broken in my door.” at this point, the great grandmother says she knew what she had to do. “And I got my pistol and I met them right outside of my bedroom. Right inside of my bedroom door, two black men passed and they were two medium black men and they were dressed in black and when they saw me standing in there with my pistol, they left and run.”

Another would be burglar stopped by gun wielding homeowner

"Somebody rang my doorbell. Knocked on the door and I didn't answer it," says Miguez. "They lifted my mail slot up and looked in my mail slot and I could see somebody out there moving around - and they came around the other side of the house and jumped the fence," he says.

There are many more, but I am not going to spend the day finding them for you. Nice try though.

reply to post by AgentX09


When this all dies down I AM going to make a phone call to that manager and ask if he still thinks there should be a ban on guns in that theater.

Also, I wonder how the victims families feel about gun control?
I wonder if you asked them

Do you wish there would have been a licensed CCW Gun Owner there?


What would their answer be now?
Very simple question really.
Do you think that any of them would have given the canned gun hater response of
"Well, No because if there would have been then more people could have gotten hurt".

I'll just bet you that they would say

"Yes, then maybe my boyfriend,girlfriend,son,daughter,granddaughter,grandson,friend would still be alive. If someone would have just taken him out"


ohh, and to the gunhaters/second ammendment haters
Ohh the bullet proof vest?
Riiight.
Cuz the bullets just bounce right off you and you don't even notice it when you get hit hu?
Ever get hit by a bullet with a vest on?
Bet not.
Best you sit this one out there fella.

Originally posted by clayb2004

SALT LAKE CITY (ABC 4 News) - A citizen with a gun stopped a knife wielding man as he began stabbing people Thursday evening at the downtown Salt Lake City Smith's store.

www.abc4.com

Yet another story proving that crazy people will be crazy people, and that guns can be safely used to stop them, without injuring anyone.

edit on 7/27/2012 by Mirthful Me because: Fixed Link.

The man shouted "you killed my people" and started stabbing people. Notice how they were careful to not mention his race and religion?

10 bucks says he was muslim.

I guess it's time to revisit knife control laws.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

The man shouted "you killed my people" and started stabbing people. Notice how they were careful to not mention his race and religion?

10 bucks says he was muslim.

Sounds more like a crazy white guy. They tend not to mention the race when the person is white. If the person was a brown skinned Muslim, reports of a terrorist attack would be all over the internet by now.

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
But I'm sure hit like 30 innocent people and other gun nuts started firing in random directions when they heard his shots and every child within 50 miles was immediately sent to an eternity of suffering in the ninth circle of hell.

 

Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

 

Is it wrong that this image made me laugh?

Originally posted by Nite_wing

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
But I'm sure hit like 30 innocent people and other gun nuts started firing in random directions when they heard his shots and every child within 50 miles was immediately sent to an eternity of suffering in the ninth circle of hell.

But it didn't happen that other people got shot. The criminal got stopped by a responsible gun owner..
This happens almost every day but the media won't report it because people like you won't read or believe it.

I just read that guns are successfully used 25 times for personal protection for every time a gun is used in a crime. You won't hear that either and I would suspect you wouldn't believe it also.

By the way, did this bozo have a permit for that knife?

edit on 27-7-2012 by Nite_wing because: (no reason given)

I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic.

reply to post by clayb2004

Yet another story proving that crazy people will be crazy people, and that guns can be safely used to stop them, without injuring anyone.

It's nice to read news that show good people using firearms to do the right thing. I wish these kinds of stories were given more attention.

Does anyone actually stop to ask why this guy was stabbing people instead of instantly jumping on the "guns are heros" bandwagon?

He still managed to stab people before the gun was pulled, meaning guns didn't prevent this, they only shortened its duration.

You have to address the root cause of these issues in society...

Why was he saying "you killed my people"?

reply to post by clayb2004


Anything can be a weapon or tool for carnage..

I call for an immediate worldwide ban on all kitchenware, Sticks (yes all trees must be removed so people can't have pointy sticks), Glassware, Tools (screwdrivers, tyre Irons etc.. People can just call a "licenced mechanic")..

Oh the list of things that need to be banned from public use just goes on and on... Sorta like the people who protest for these laws to be brought in...lol

/sarcasm off

reply to post by polarwarrior

Does anyone actually stop to ask why this guy was stabbing people instead of instantly jumping on the "guns are heros" bandwagon?

He still managed to stab people before the gun was pulled, meaning guns didn't prevent this, they only shortened its duration.

You have to address the root cause of these issues in society...

Why was he saying "you killed my people"?

Why was this guy stabbing people? It doesn't matter to me. Stabbing unarmed people at the grocery shouldn't be tolerated for any reason. I do feel sad that the guy was shot, but he brought it onto himself. I won't go as far to say that he deserved to be shot. However, the customers and workers at the grocery store deserved to have the incident stopped as fast a possible. Actually, they deserved not to be stabbed, but at the time of the shooting it had gone past that. Even if only one person was saved from being stabbed, it was worth it.

I don't know why he was saying "you killed my people". He should have taken that complaint to the fuzz.

It's not all about the "guns are heros bandwagon". It's about a crime being stopped before more innocent people were injured. If instead of shooting the stabber, the guy had knocked him to the ground and stomped on his head, I'd be saying "Yeah, the guy was stabbing people for no apparent legal reason, and he got his head stomped in. So what"

reply to post by CB328

Congratulations- you finally found the one example in the world of a gun preventing violence.

I found a hell of a lot more than that earlier today! You could too... IF YOU WANTED TO.

See ya,
Milt

Ok, for those of you who don't like the example of good use of guns and self defense from "way back" in April, how about one from this month?

www.washingtonpost.com... tW_story.html

awesome video BTW.

reply to post by clayb2004


Here is a more recent incident of closed conceal saving the day: Armed guy thwarts robbery.

This guy actually shoots at the armed robbers!

reply to post by Bakatono


Your link doesn't work or the source has deleted the video. I suspect it is the same video I linked? Check my link and tell me if it's the same?

Originally posted by LordGoofus
9) Countries with high rates of gun ownership also lead the pack in highest rate of gun-related deaths....

Please don't post disinformation, research before assuming. Shame on you! Switzerland is the best example that your statement is absolutely false:

Guns are deeply rooted within Swiss culture - but the gun crime rate is so low that statistics are not even kept. The country has a population of six million, but there are estimated to be at least two million publicly-owned firearms, including about 600,000 automatic rifles and 500,000 pistols. This is in a very large part due to Switzerland's unique system of national defence, developed over the centuries.

news.bbc.co.uk...
www.stephenhalbrook.com...