Gay Marriage. I am honestly confused

This is a legitamite question, seeking legitamite discourse on the topic.

Marriage is a religious institution. Something in ancient times that was a bond created before peoples God. God was the one who said (according to religions) what marriage is, and what marriage is not, what the duties of the couples were to one another, and in marrying, they agree with God that they will follow His laws in their marriage.


My religion says I cannot marry someone who does not practice my religion, because I am a woman and someone who is not in my religion may not grant me the rights my religion affords me, and one of the things we say when we get married is that we will follow all applicable religous laws in the marriage.

Therefore, if I decide to marry someoone who is not in my religion, why would I marry them? My religion says I cant, so how can I enter into a contract before God saying that I will follow all the applicable laws of my religion within my marriage if I am breaking those laws at the time of entering the marriage?

Thats just dumb.

Therefore, if I decided to be with someone who was not a member of my religion, I might not marry at all, because it might not make a whole heck of a lot of sense to do so. The law does not say unless I personally think its ok, it says no, plain as day.

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Therefore, why do gays and lesbians want to get married under a God who has already made clear His position about such a union? (obviously one of opposition to it, plain as day)

Why are gays and lesbians not fighting to simply have the same rights as married people under the law, without entering into a religious institution?

I do not get the whole wanting to marry thing at all! I get the wanting to be with someone you love, and I get its no ones business what you do in your own home so long as its not harmful to another human being....

I just do not get the whole entering into a contract before God who does not approve thing

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
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Therefore, why do gays and lesbians want to get married under a God who has already made clear His position about such a union? (obviously one of opposition to it, plain as day)

Why are gays and lesbians not fighting to simply have the same rights as married people under the law, without entering into a religious institution?

I do not get the whole wanting to marry thing at all! I get the wanting to be with someone you love, and I get its no ones business what you do in your own home so long as its not harmful to another human being....

I just do not get the whole entering into a contract before God who does not approve thing

Because the Gays and Lesbians want to be the exception. Because they want to bully and harrass people into accepting their perverted and unnatural lifestyle choices and because they want to destroy the family unit.

It's quite simple, and not up for debate, a marriage is between one man and one woman, and a family is one man and one woman who are married, who have as many children as they can responsibly maintain.

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
Why are gays and lesbians not fighting to simply have the same rights as married people under the law, without entering into a religious institution?

They are.

All the gays I know want nothing to do with religion, and that's fair enough, after the way they have been treated by religious people.

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
I do not get the whole wanting to marry thing at all!

Well that's good for you, just don't get married then. But some people don't have that choice.

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
I just do not get the whole entering into a contract before God who does not approve thing

Wait on a minute, are you confusing getting married in a church and being legally married? Being married carries many benefits, too numerous to list, gays want these benefits but most I know don't give a dam about the church part.

reply to post by OpinionatedB


I think it has more to do with all the legal benifits that come from being married not necessarily religious belief. I don't really KNOW but I am sure any gay person would not want to be part of a religion that condems gay people, seems like common sense. Personally speaking, from a non religious view of this, I don't see why all couples shouldn't have the same legal rights as anyone. Just seems fair to me.

reply to post by polarwarrior


All I can see under the law is tax breaks, the law already affords rights of the patients to decide who visits and who can hold power of attorney etc in hospitalization and death cases.... and life insurance anyone can be your beneficiary that you choose.

so taxes seems to be it, why not fight those laws instead of asking for marriage?

That s a very good question op and its one I have always wanted to ask gay activists
but I think I already know why
IMHO they don't care it doesn't make sense, as long as they don't feel excluded its fair game to them
another IMHO the most vocal gay activists act out of hate and they have a grudge towards the world and status quo
sort of like how extreme feminists operate
logic is thrown out the window

I hope this thread does not get closed like the previous threads related to gays
there is obviously a problem and heated conversation is natural

reply to post by quietlearner


To me, if they had a religion which stated marriage was between two people regardless of sex, then of course under the law the religious beleif would be protected and the marriages could not be opposed.

the point is there is no religion which states this in their Holy Books.

So I see more logic in fighting for equal rights under the law without marriage.

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
reply to post by polarwarrior

 

so taxes seems to be it, why not fight those laws instead of asking for marriage?

It's a lot more than tax breaks, though may be different depending on where you live.

I think it's about being treated equally. They want that choice to be able to get married just like straight people can, why should they not have that choice? Even if they never want to actually marry, its still the principle of it.

reply to post by OpinionatedB


there are already "christian" churches that marry gay couples
by allowing gay couples to marry they are no longer christian but a new version, an offshoot

reply to post by OpinionatedB


The real answer to the problem is to remove religion from state. What I mean by that is, make all marriages a union in the eyes of the government, and let the private churches and religions sort the rest out. All unions would provide the same rights regardless of gender.

This isn't something that government should stick it's nose into. The fact that some churches have been willing to marry same gender couples, shows that the idea of what constitutes a marriage needs to be sorted out by the people.

reply to post by polarwarrior


But there is no religion which allows for it.... I guess this is my point.

Should a hetrosexual married person get more tax breaks or benefits in society than anyone else? Really I do not think that is right, I think in a country which says all people are equal under the law then it should be so, no one should be treated any differently, for any reason.

In a state which says that there is separation of church and state, then anyone can live together etc because religious laws are not being followed in matter of law. And anyone who lives together regardless of religion or creed should all be afforded the same rights.

But marriage to me is a religious thing.... so devoid of a religion which condones it, I do not understand marriage in general.

I guess thats what I am trying to say.

reply to post by OpinionatedB


Buddha’s discourses does not explicitly mention homosexuality. As long as a couple does not involve adultery, it would not break one of the percepts. That's one, doesn't promote it, but, doesn't condem it.

reply to post by billy197300


Do they get married? (The Budda people?)

reply to post by OpinionatedB

if the only goal was legal rights then you are correct, its more logical just to pursue those rights individually
however, I have learned that the ultimate goal of gay activist is to change the notion of marriage globally
they want to get rid of any aspect of gender in marriage

for example:
when people today think of the world "marriage" people immediately think "woman and man" or "female and male"
what gay activists want is to change "woman and man" to "two humans" with no reference to sex at all
so that when people think of the world "marriage" then people will immediately think "two humans"

reply to post by OpinionatedB


It's not a religious matter, anymore, if it used to be. It's a legal process. When you want a divorce, where do you file for one? A church? Nope! A court house! Yep!

These days people can be married in a drive thru! Talk about holy! ha ha ha

Divorce rate is at or worse than 50%! Talk about holy! Whew! All those sacred unions!

The bible is the most perverted hypocritical thing known to man, written to be vague and to divide people and oppress women. For all you know, there are two god figures: one man, one female, each sharing power. Oh, that can't be true, though, because that wasn't what you were told. Of course. Maybe god is a female lesbian with a gay brother who co-rules. You wouldn't know.

People who talk about god(s) are just making a fool of themselves. Nobody can prove anything. Even if you saw the most awesome display of power, you couldn't say it was the grandest of all. Even if you yourself felt immensely powerful and above all, could there not be something else that one day proves you wrong? The concept of god(s) relies on definitions, which we conveniently create to suit our personal agendas.

End of story.

reply to post by OpinionatedB

Why are gays and lesbians not fighting to simply have the same rights as married people under the law, without entering into a religious institution?

That is when the separation of Church and state comes into the play. And that is what secular Zionist wants. The secular groups want to let the corruption spread and suffocate the church. They let religion be affected by politics , but they don't let church affect the politics. The separation of church and state is mostly interpreted as state should rule the religion.

but still , there are people believing in Church and Jesus. So , the secular groups decided to bring the corruption into the church. Anyway it looks like the sign of bigotry , because it should be done at church.

The hope is how some religious families hope to keep their faith in this zoo we live in.



I do believe in the causes that people prefer same sex.

Some of them involve lifestyle and some of them are induced by TV.

The sexual organs and the relationship is not given for playing. In fact , it will be given at the age when people are not kids and they can think for themselves.

So , there is a goal and hardship behind the pleasure. Like there is a goal behind the pleasure of eating.

The pleasure of eating is to make you move for getting the food you need for survival. So , we don't eat for just enjoying. And the pleasure of sexual intercourse is to bear the hardship of reproduction and ...

The whole problem arrived as soon as entertainment industry came into the play and induced people like "people , welcome to your play ground , choose your own entertainment and play until the day you die."

There are more dark agendas behind the entertainment industry , if you think for yourself.

reply to post by daynight42


I am not here to debate the existence of God, or who or what constitutes God, nor am I pushing any religious belief.

I am trying to understand a concept, as we know it today, in this country, concerning what constitutes religious freedom, and equal rights under the law in regards marriage and/or living together.

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
But marriage to me is a religious thing.... so devoid of a religion which condones it, I do not understand marriage in general.

I guess thats what I am trying to say.

Yeah I see what you're saying now. I guess to non-religious people then marriage is not a religious thing at all, like atheists still get married.

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
Should a hetrosexual married person get more tax breaks or benefits in society than anyone else? Really I do not think that is right, I think in a country which says all people are equal under the law then it should be so, no one should be treated any differently, for any reason.

In a state which says that there is separation of church and state, then anyone can live together etc because religious laws are not being followed in matter of law. And anyone who lives together regardless of religion or creed should all be afforded the same rights.

Agreed

reply to post by OpinionatedB


Just read this about Hindus also: Homosexuality is regarded as one of the possible expressions of human desire and Hindu mythic stories have portrayed homosexual experience as natural and joyful.[49] There are several Hindu temples which have carvings that depict both men and women indulging in homosexual sex.[50]