Deputies shoot, kill man after knocking on wrong door

reply to post by detachedindividual
Ahhhhh yes they do in todays world. Look at the Trayvon Martin case. His family now beleive they can erect a memorial to this thug on private property and have threatened to protest again.

Here in Florida the cops seem to beleive they are judge,jury and executioneer. A year and a half ago I took over my Grandmothers home after my crack smoking cousin and all her Black friends began selling dope out of the house. The first night I was there a Black under cover came to the house at 0230. He knocked on the door and was met by my big kracker ass.

He actually attempted to open my door and I pointed my SIG at his head. The front door has clear glass and a shade to cover it,shade was up. He ran down the wheel chair ramp and pulled out his badge and gun yelling police. His goon sqaud came rushing in the front yard. They were looking for my cousins nasty dope dealing BF.

I actually knew one of the cops and is probably the only reason I am not in prison. Cops are not cops any longer,they are a authorized gang in America now!

Cops at scene, one to another:
"Better safe than sorry."
"Yah, goin' home to sleep in my bed tonight."
"Right. Stupid civvies. If he had just not come with the gun..."
If they took away all the guns, then this shlt wouldn't happen."

What gun? Who saw a gun? The media? the cops? In a darkened room? Where is it? Does it belong to the victim? Is it even registered? Was it fired? How can we believe the chain of custody on this claim when they couldn't identify the suspect?

Police carry what are called "throw-downs" for exactly this. In case of mistakes involving civilians, they can later claim there was a gun. These "Tac" squads aren't going to sneak up on a home in the middle of the night and then identify themselves either. That defeats the whole requirement of surprise and endangers officer safety.

When you answer your door in the middle of the night you can do three things.

Defend your home against any intruder and die.

Answer the door without a gun and die at the hands of criminals.

Or be safe and set off the claymores in the foyer, then call 911.

Knock Knock... BOOOM!

Originally posted by getreadyalready

If someone breaks into your home, you have every right to defend yourself with force, but if they knock at the front door, you ought to ask who it is before you just point a gun at someone.

He may have - we'll never know.

I used to train cops in tactical procedure and officer survival. I once asked one of the cops who was running through his in-service training (that state had a 40 hour annual retraining requirement for every officer) whether if he had to shoot, would he shoot to wound, or shoot to kill. His answer, without hesitation, was "dead men tell no tales".

This is a case of a dead man telling no tales - not presenting his side of the story. We'll never know for sure if he verbally challenged the knock or not. All we know is that the officers refused to identify themselves. That's not a tactical advantage at 01:30 - it's a tactical error.

reply to post by xyankee


A similar case in Indianapolis a couple of years ago resulted in our legislature passing a law allowing citizens to shoot the police, and face no charges, sincethey broke the law by failing to identify themselves as LEOs.

Everything I hear of something like this I remember this video.

An officer acting in the line of duty should have to identify them self but that isn't the case it seems. That's a problem just asking to happen.

Originally posted by BIHOTZ
reply to post by HawkeyeNation

 

There is a growing problem. The reason we CAN have these orgies as you put it is because there is a HUGE problem festering. If not we would be arguing over tickets and inconveniences. NOT MURDER and organized crime.

Like the police are exempt from being criminals.....you ever heard of NYC circa 1970......Yeah....nothing there huh. Not like my home cities police Dept. aren't under investigation by the FBI (yonkers PD ,N.Y.)....or other countless cities across the US...

No, there is nothing there....move on.
yawn.....yes yawn....hows that hole? your head comfy down there?

edit on 16-7-2012 by BIHOTZ because: (no reason given)

Sure the police may be getting more aggressive but it's not all that different then say 10 years ago. The reason it gets so much more attention now is because mass media is all within a point and click. Check this site 5 years ago (don't know if you can) but I'm sure the cop threads are very minimal. It's not a coincidence that as mass media has become more advanced that more of these have become available to the public.

Originally posted by CrikeyMagnet
So... what's the answer then? Automated gun turrets to answer the door for you after 9 PM?

Interesting you should ask. Everyone should have the Argus Mark I system at least. (puts on imaginary ShamWow sales hat)

We've sort of orbited putting up a fake web site for a home and grounds surveillance system that records police activity in and around your house and uploads it to Tuvalu for safekeeping. With a Christopher Perino clip or two.

"A secret recording was the difference in 2007 between a murder conviction and 12 felony convictions for the cop! Detective Perino lied on the stand 12 times! And he would have gotten away with it except for a recording he didn't know his victim had made! Now you can have your OWN secret recordings! Imagine the looks on their faces when your lawyer introduces YOUR surprise evidence into cross-examination!"

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by CrikeyMagnet

 

I would expect that police would not have identified themselves as police because maybe they had no indication that someone was going to answer the door.

Then why knock?
I knock on a door anticipating that someone will answer. If I thought no one would answer, I wouldn't bother knocking.

The good idea that has already been posted would be for the police to announce who they are when they knock. If the police announce who they are at 1:30 am at my residence, I will inform them before I open the door that I am armed and will need to see a badge and ID through a window before I put down my gun and open the door.

Why knock? I didn't mean they should kick the door in... I just meant maybe there weren't any lights on, and they weren't the type of folks to go yelling into the night when there might not even be anyone home. Or when that would send the person they were looking for fleeing out the back door. Knock and wait for a response before identifying?

Is it standard practice for Police to identify themselves loudly as they knock?

Originally posted by WildTurkey101

Originally posted by CrikeyMagnet
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

Yes. Exactly.

As far as police "getting away with this", they pretty much have to. They MUST have the ability to fire if someone's life is in danger. I don't remember if there was mention of how many officers were at the door... but every one of them was in danger as a result of a pointed firearm. As far as I'm concerned, their reaction needed to be "stop this guy from shooting".

It probably would have been better for him if they asked him to drop the weapon first...instead of just shooting.

Perhaps, but that response may depend on how the guy opened the door... and how intent he looked. Again, the most likely response to a gun being pointed is a gun being fired. It's all a matter of timing beyond that.

first of all you dont come to someones residence uninvited and unannounced at 1:30 in the morning...

secondly how long did it take the LEOs to draw and fire while having a gun pointed at them...? by not annoucing
themselves as LEO, after all it was an apt complex, but unless you live there, you dont know what kind of neighborhood it is.
obviously there was a man in the area who was involved in an attempted homicide,

hell even havin a cruiser's lights on in the parking lot would have held some ground...

its like they knocked on the door with guns drawn...

reply to post by CrikeyMagnet

Is it standard practice for Police to identify themselves loudly as they knock?

It is supposed to be.
It should be.
Sadly it doesn't seem to be anymore.

reply to post by xyankee


Its sad to say it but some officer just got himself a paid vacation for committing murder. Almost makes me want to become a police officer. I've been working for ten years without a vacation, let alone a paid one.

The weak link here is the failure of the police to ID themselves. The safety of the public over the police must be the priority....the police are not drafted; if it is too dangerous then they can join the TSA. Also they can wear body armor and take other precautions (robots, dogs, swat,etc). ESPECIALLY at 1:30 am. Common sense should trump the "element of surprise."

I say find where these police officers live and then simply go knock on their door at 1am.

Wheres the harm in just knocking on a door?

Originally posted by 11235813213455
I say find where these police officers live and then simply go knock on their door at 1am.

Wheres the harm in just knocking on a door?

Make sure and go there wearing body armor and fully armed. That's the way the cops did it. They must have had their guns drawn when they knocked on the door, too.

Yes, I agree with some of you, he should not of opened the door, without saying who is it. I go to the door with a gun in my hand at 1:00 am. I don't open the door like I'm bad arse, I say who is it, if they say cops, that don't mean I going to open the door, then you say what do you want, Oh! Dave, Dave's snot here.

Stand back from the door let me see your badge and uniform, where's the white cop, I don't see him, no, no, go get white cop or let me see your search warrant.

Yes and my door is not one you would put your foot to, not unless you want a broken foot.

In this case I would say they were all stupid not just cops, I hope they planted enough drugs at the guy they killed house to make it look good. Yep, we kilt him, but he was a dirty no good drug dealer , as easy to see by all the illegal drugs drugs we found.

reply to post by detachedindividual

Even if they shouted Police, he has no reason to expect an armed contingency of the local mafia banging on his door. I would have answered in the same way, and they would have shot me, because they had the wrong house...

The thing is, the mafia wouldn't bang on the wrong door!

reply to post by HawkeyeNation

The only thing your statement says to me is that they were just as wrong back then as they are now.

Absolutely disgusting.