Occupiers Celebrate 4th of July by…Burning American Flags and Vandalizing Police Property

Originally posted by seabag
reply to post by XPLodER

 

simple,

you attempt to make OWS look like anti american thugs,
at worst some black bloc tryed to give ows a bad name
ie

the worst propaganda you can bring to the table is broken windows,

They do a FINE JOB of making themselves look like thugs!

I’m simply shining a light on it.

It happens at EVERY RALLY so it sure as hell isn’t “a few” OWS’ers.

You might have a valid argument if the Tea Part actually had the power to pass law…right now there are less than 10 out of hundreds.

Try again!

OK SO YOUR TEN MEMBERS VOTED FOR THE NDAA?

OK TEAPARTY IS NOW IN AGREEMENT WITH INDEFINATE DETENTION

spread the word people tea party is now the enemy

did you see what i did there?

tar all with the same brush

xp

Originally posted by XPLodER

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by RealSpoke
reply to post by beezzer

 

The business owner would gladly fix their broken window than be in prison for life without due process. Ask anyone, anywhere, they will take the window.

Neither are good things but get real.

edit on 7-7-2012 by RealSpoke because: (no reason given)

If that was their only choice. But you paint a false either/or.

what real spoke has said is the plan cold hard truth

i would rather suffer a number of broken windows than live in a world where NDAA exists

beezer you are not being honest,
you let your fervor get the better of you,

the tea party politicians have done MUCH more damage to society with their support and passage of the NDAA

so who is the real enemy of your rights?
NDAA
broken windows and burned flags

could i please get an ANSWER

xploder

"Beezzer, what do you do worse? Beat your wife, or beat your children?"

NDAA is wrong, on the issue of personal LIBERTY.
Breaking windows, destroying personal property is WRONG on the issue of personal PROPERTY.

Work on your questions.

Originally posted by XPLodER

Originally posted by seabag
reply to post by XPLodER

 

simple,

you attempt to make OWS look like anti american thugs,
at worst some black bloc tryed to give ows a bad name
ie

the worst propaganda you can bring to the table is broken windows,

They do a FINE JOB of making themselves look like thugs!

I’m simply shining a light on it.

It happens at EVERY RALLY so it sure as hell isn’t “a few” OWS’ers.

You might have a valid argument if the Tea Part actually had the power to pass law…right now there are less than 10 out of hundreds.

Try again!

OK SO YOUR TEN MEMBERS VOTED FOR THE NDAA?

OK TEAPARTY IS NOW IN AGREEMENT WITH INDEFINATE DETENTION

spread the word people tea party is now the enemy

did you see what i did there?

tar all with the same brush

xp

On one hand, we can fight those that falsly wore the Tea Party mantle.

or

We could do what Occupy does nd call them "Black bloc".

Guess what, puddin.

We're taking responsibility and working to get those rat bastards out.

MAN UP!

WE DID!

reply to post by beezzer


would you rather,

a broken window

or

be indefinatly detained

is that clear enough for you?

i can re word this a thousand times till you answer

xploder

reply to post by beezzer


Well that's twice now you have avoided answering the question of how Occupy Oakland was supposed to do anything about this F*** the Fourth march, when they weren't even there?

reply to post by XPLodER

OK SO YOUR TEN MEMBERS VOTED FOR THE NDAA?

OK TEAPARTY IS NOW IN AGREEMENT WITH INDEFINATE DETENTION

spread the word people tea party is now the enemy

did you see what i did there?

tar all with the same brush

Some voted for it…others against.

Those people who call themselves Tea Party who voted for it are traitors and will not be Tea Party candidates any longer. Just like with ALL politicians, you have to watch them closely and keep them honest. Tea Party obviously has some LIARS in our elected ranks…it happens.

The difference is, we cast our riff raff to the curb rather than endlessly defending them, like you do to OWS trash.

reply to post by beezzer

On one hand, we can fight those that falsly wore the Tea Party mantle.

or

We could do what Occupy does nd call them "Black bloc".

Guess what, puddin.

We're taking responsibility and working to get those rat bastards out.

MAN UP!

WE DID!

i had held out hope we could work together beezer,

OWS cannot take responsibly for black bloc,
we canot BLOCK them from protesting

this is a straw man argument,

you say that you have held them to account,

yet they blocked "labeling of GMO food"

do your rights include knowing whats in your food?

and you are still avoiding my direct question

xp

Hmmm. Well, this is weird. To state clearly - I am NOT in any way supportive of the negative, destructive and disrespectful actions recorded in the OP's article. And I am not involved in OWS.

But this action, allegedly by Oakland OWS, is very confusing.
Here is a link to the Occupy Oakland official site - there is absolutely no mention of this "event" - I'm also wondering if this was an official OWS group, or part of the Black Bloc Anarchists who are wreaking havoc within the group.

Occupy Oakland - official site

Here is an article about this fringe element within OWS (though some would say they are fringe to begin with) - the "Black Block Anarchists" - it's an opinion piece, but it speaks to the issue, and how they are NOT representative of OWS as a whole:

Cut It Out: An Open Letter To Black Bloc Anarchists

Just wondering if the whole of OWS should be painted with this brush - and how convenient for TPTB to have them smeared and labeled this way by some wicked, angry, and immature group acting out in their name. Here is an article from 2011 that foreshadows this very problem:

From the trashing of downtown Oakland after the General Strike to burning cars and looting in Rome during a huge anti-capitalist demonstration by the Indignati, no one should be surprised by the militant vandalism of self-described Anarchists dressed in black - or by the police violence they provoke. Protesters of a certain age have seen the pattern too many times, especially in the violence that paid provocateurs created in the 1960s as part of the FBI's Counter-Intelligence Program (COINTELPRO). Hopefully, today's nonviolent mass movements can learn from our mistakes, as many in Occupy Oakland seem to be doing.

Article Link

In any case - to reiterate - I in no way condone what happened in Oakland this 4th - it was terrible, vile, criminal behavior, and if OWS wishes to be seen in a different light than this, they need to weed out the Black Bloc, or suffer being painted black along with them.

peace,
AB

(I haven't read through all the responses carefully, so I apologize if I'm putting things forward redundantly...)

reply to post by XPLodER
Because your direct question is illogical. Would you rather have a stubbed toe or have an erronoius credit report?

I mean, c'mon!

reply to post by seabag


GOTCHA

YOU SAID

Some voted for it…others against.

Those people who call themselves Tea Party who voted for it are traitors and will not be Tea Party candidates any longer. Just like with ALL politicians, you have to watch them closely and keep them honest. Tea Party obviously has some LIARS in our elected ranks…it happens.

The difference is, we cast our riff raff to the curb rather than endlessly defending them, like you do to OWS trash.

you admit that ANY group can have a small group of trouble makers, you used the word liars
AND THAT THEY DONT REPRESENT THE WHOLE of the tea party,

you realise you have said the exact same reason BLOC BLOCK dosnt represent OWS

pot meet keetle

xploder

Originally posted by XPLodER
reply to post by seabag

 

GOTCHA

YOU SAID

Some voted for it…others against.

Those people who call themselves Tea Party who voted for it are traitors and will not be Tea Party candidates any longer. Just like with ALL politicians, you have to watch them closely and keep them honest. Tea Party obviously has some LIARS in our elected ranks…it happens.

The difference is, we cast our riff raff to the curb rather than endlessly defending them, like you do to OWS trash.

you admit that ANY group can have a small group of trouble makers, you used the word liars
AND THAT THEY DONT REPRESENT THE WHOLE of the tea party,

you realise you have said the exact same reason BLOC BLOCK dosnt represent OWS

pot meet keetle

xploder

We own up to our mistakes.

Personal responsibility.

Remember?

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by XPLodER

 

Because your direct question is illogical. Would you rather have a stubbed toe or have an erronoius credit report?

I mean, c'mon!

ok so your duly elected representatives signed the NDAA,

are you with me so far?

on a scale of one to ten how bad is that?

blac block broke some windows

on a scale of 1 to 10 how bad is that?

are you still with me?

which one is more important to your rights?

which one has more impact on your freedoms?

please
please answer me
please

xploder

Originally posted by seabag
The Republican party represents everything wrong with America; greed, selfishness, violence, disrespect, hatred, fanaticism, immorality, etc. This group is a bunch of wannabe Marxist revolutionaries whose ranks are filled from the armpits of our society IMO.

The people have had enough of your disgraceful BS. It's time you stop the madness and help us get on with fixing the problems in this country rather than further destroying it for future generations.

Couldn't agree more.

On a more serious note... where's the anger when it comes to allowing your government to rob you? Why are not so equally passionate about president Bush stripping you of your rights and freedoms under the Patriot Act, phone tapping, email interception? Why are you not so up in arms about the Republican dictatorship currently controlling Michigan?

Oh yes, I know why, because this is YET ANOTHER fanatical right-wing propaganda campaign by idiots who refuse to face the REAL problems with America and would rather keep the divide and conquer process in full effect with little publicity stunts like this.

Guess what, people burn the American flag all over the world, every day. The boy scouts of America burns more American flags than any other group of people on the planet.

When you can climb down off of your fanatical cheer leading soapbox and use some intelligent thinking then maybe things in your country will change.

Unfortunately, there are far too many idiot Americans willing to swallow the pill and keep this partisan BS going. It's much easier to despise an entire movement of people based on the actions of some posed photos by propagandists than it is to actually face the truth, isn't it?

If anyone REALLY thinks the Occupy movement would do this - in an effort to win over people?!?! - that is the problem - a complete lack of common sense and critical thinking. If someone says it and it fits what you want to believe, you'll get all worked up and start screaming about it. If it challenges you through process and nationalist indoctrination you can't possibly comprehend it.

"Lets get some support"
"I know how, we'll pose for pictures burning the American flag, then we'll threaten cops and act like stereotypical thugs. That'll persuade all those Republicans we're the good guys!"
"Yeah! Good idea, lets give them even more ammunition for their 'commie' gun!"

The people who starred this thread really ought to go and take a hard look at themselves. Stop being so obviously reactionary and actually use those braincells.

Originally posted by XPLodER

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by XPLodER

 

Because your direct question is illogical. Would you rather have a stubbed toe or have an erronoius credit report?

I mean, c'mon!

ok so your duly elected representatives signed the NDAA,

are you with me so far?

on a scale of one to ten how bad is that?

blac block broke some windows

on a scale of 1 to 10 how bad is that?

are you still with me?

which one is more important to your rights?

which one has more impact on your freedoms?

please
please answer me
please

xploder

edit on 7-7-2012 by XPLodER because: (no reason given)

Okay. NDAA has more impact on my freedom.

Breaking windows are justs the result of Occupy punk thugs who are entitlement ##snipped##

reply to post by AboveBoard


It doesn't matter how much common sense you use with the people who start these threads, they intend to keep the BS "commie" crap going in any way they can. They believe in propaganda, but they support it when it suits their needs - and often their party.

It's quite funny how so many of them scream foul when it's someone pointing out the Tea Party racism, the signs comparing Obama to Hitler, the Republicans who scream about a free capitalist market while taking your tax $'s as a bailout - but this they'll swallow perfectly happily, because OWS is something they don't understand, can't comprehend, are scared of...

Once again, the hypocrisy of many is exposed in their immediate acceptance of things they WANT to believe and accept without question.

reply to post by beezzer


i had hoped to see OWS work WITH the tea party,

but we have tolerated attack thread after attack thread after attack thread,

we get it from the tea party the main stream news and from breitbart

through all of this i hoped you would come to your sences,

i have tryed to be paitent,

but you have proven to me that truth doesnt matter to you if it gets in the way of your ajenda to smear occupy.

we have been reasonable till now
and every report states a very peaceful protest

oakland was not officail ows or IT WOULD HAVE BEEN PEACEFUL





xploder

reply to post by XPLodER

you admit that ANY group can have a small group of trouble makers, you used the word liars
AND THAT THEY DONT REPRESENT THE WHOLE of the tea party,

you realise you have said the exact same reason BLOC BLOCK dosnt represent OWS

pot meet keetle

Gotcha?? Ya right!

You’re talking about one vote! Occupy raises hell every time they go somewhere!

A few traitors - ONE DAMN VOTE!

Occupy has MANY MISCREANTS who act up EVERY TIME!

Weak attempt at drawing a comparison but I’ll give you an A for effort!

If you want to follow a bunch of dopers I certainly won’t stand in your way! Enjoy!

Originally posted by XPLodER
reply to post by beezzer

 

i had hoped to see OWS work WITH the tea party,

but we have tolerated attack thread after attack thread after attack thread,

we get it from the tea party the main stream news and from breitbart

through all of this i hoped you would come to your sences,

i have tryed to be paitent,

but you have proven to me that truth doesnt matter to you if it gets in the way of your ajenda to smear occupy.

we have been reasonable till now
and every report states a very peaceful protest

oakland was not officail ows or IT WOULD HAVE BEEN PEACEFUL





xploder

edit on 7-7-2012 by XPLodER because: (no reason given)

Give me an effing break! I voulunteered to be a spokesman for the Tea Party at an Occupy on-line group.

I got shut out.

Save your wounded knee.

Originally posted by seabag
reply to post by XPLodER

 

you admit that ANY group can have a small group of trouble makers, you used the word liars
AND THAT THEY DONT REPRESENT THE WHOLE of the tea party,

you realise you have said the exact same reason BLOC BLOCK dosnt represent OWS

pot meet keetle

Gotcha??

Ya right!

You’re talking about one vote! Occupy raises hell every time they go somewhere!

A few traitors - ONE DAMN VOTE!

Occupy has MANY MISCREANTS who act up EVERY TIME!

Weak attempt at drawing a comparison but I’ll give you an A for effort!

If you want to follow a bunch of dopers I certainly won’t stand in your way! Enjoy!

SO passing the NDAA was a it was not us thing
but black bloc is the entire OWS?

come on really/

xploder

The KKK has a right to protest.
The Neo-Nazis have a right to protest.
Westboro fanatics have a right to protest.
Black Panthers have a right to protest.
Tea Party has a right to protest...

And indeed, so do those people in Oakland whoever they are.

The real un-Americans here are those who condemn anyone's right to speak their mind and express their grievances with the system.

We do have a right to ignore them, after all.

Let's call this a brief lesson in America 101.