Healthcare Ruling: Individual Mandate Ruled CONSTITUTIONAL, entire law upheld.

Anyone know how long the 1.7 trillion lasts? It comes out to 5500 per person...

reply to post by habitforming


There are lots of people like that who pretend they 'dont need doctors'.

In my experience, the are liars.

Originally posted by AkumaStreak

We are communities. What affects one affects everyone. Odds are you aren't living a complete life of solitude without any affect on others.

The "odds are" that you are constructing a strawman argument here. We are not talking about "community" or "the totality of all", we are discussing health insurance. I absolutely do not nor will not engage in your health care system, and there is no reason at all that I should pay for anyone else to do so if I won't even be paying for myself to do so.

That isn't a beast I'm willing to feed.

Originally posted by stanguilles7
reply to post by habitforming

 

There are lots of people like that who pretend they 'dont need doctors'.

In my experience, the are liars.

If you want, I'll U2U my full name to you. You can start digging into my medical records, and post what you find right here.

Let's just see whether I'm a liar or not, eh?

Originally posted by habitforming

You had a natural birth at home? Daddy do the snipping? Who gave you your shots as a kid. I thought you were some kind of military? Maybe a wannabe? How do you plan on ending your life? Dying quietly at home? You will never get hit by a bus? You will not fall unconscious and be taken to a hospital? Can we make up a little contract? What do you suppose we do with you if something like that should happen?
Lotsa questions fer ya.

Strawman. We're not talking about 50 years ago, we're talking about right now, but if you want to shift the conversation, I can go there. My birth way paid for in full and up front. My dear old dad was just as adamant about carrying his own water as I am.

He died the same way.

What does the military have to do with it, and what on Earth makes you think I've ever been military? You do know that there are more ways than one to tote a gun for a living, right? yeah, I've been to war, but there's no reason you have to wear a US flag on your right shoulder to go there. it's not a members only club.

How I die doesn't matter - we all know that one day I will, planned or not. The insurance has never been underwritten that guarantees immortality.

When any of those ills befall me, you can call my family and tell them to dispose of the carcass. it ain't your responsibility. I will say, though, that getting hit by a bus is a highly unlikely outcome for my end, Wouldn't busses have to be available in the vicinity for that to happen?

reply to post by nenothtu


here here im one of those who hasnt seen a doctor for longer than most posters have been alive..and i have a list as long as my forearm of injuries, disease that i have treated myself and very succsesfully, thank you and right now i am watching how the healthcare system is useless and fails those in real need, fourtunatly im not the one its failing, sad to watch friends suffer because of the quacks......if you think doctors dont spend enuf time with patients now..just wait till they have to handle a couple hundred more patients...
people will be forced to pay a penalty on something that they wont use and private business are being told that they cant run thier own business. this sets a bad precident and apparently the supporters of this 'act' in such a rapturous state that they cant see it.....

reply to post by nenothtu

You will probably never convince them that you really don't want to be in their little 'I am going to live forever club' . They worry themselves silly about how other people live their lives. Concerned that you won't join up, they can't understand why some souls want to be left alone.

reply to post by muzzleflash

thanks for the reference and here's another ... inclusive of a functional and successful brief
www.lawfulpath.com...

In addition:

Since no notice is given to people applying for driver's (or other) licenses that they have a perfect right to use the roads without any permission, and that they surrender valuable rights by taking on the regulation system of licensure, the state has committed a massive construction fraud. This occurs when any person is told that they must have a license in order to use the public roads and highways.

The license, being a legal contract under which the state is empowered with policing powers, is only valid when the licensee takes on the burdens of the contract and bargains away his or her rights knowingly, intentionally, and voluntarily.

Few know that the driver's license is a contract without which the police are powerless to regulate the people's actions or activities.

Few (if any) licensees intentionally surrender valuable rights. They are told that they must have the license. As we have seen, this is not the case.

No one in their right mind voluntarily surrenders complete liberty and accepts in its place a set of regulations.

"The people never give up their liberties but under some delusion."

don't know about you all, but i'm totally over the "fraud" currently known and applied as the US govt.

reply to post by habitforming
so what do any of these questions have to do with the reality of personal health insurance ??

You had a natural birth at home?

waht does it matter ?? ever heard of mid-wives ??

Who gave you your shots as a kid.

our family physician which graciously and thankfully budgeted the payments (with 0 interest i might add).

I thought you were some kind of military?

doesn't apply to me personally.

How do you plan on ending your life?

who said i wanted/needed/desired a hand in that decision, isn't nature good enough to decide that one?

Dying quietly at home?

if that is to be, then so be it.

You will never get hit by a bus?

if i do, the bus company is insured for such damages.

You will not fall unconscious and be taken to a hospital?

maybe, maybe not, what concern is it of yours ??
hospitals aren't going to refuse to treat me, so what's the problem?

What do you suppose we do with you if something like that should happen?

same thing that has always been done, treat the emergent injuries.

Originally posted by stanguilles7
reply to post by habitforming

 

There are lots of people like that who pretend they 'dont need doctors'.

In my experience, the are liars.

no one here claims they "don't need doctors" ... they/we are stating emphatically that we do not need or want insurance or the govt intrusions of this proposal, which btw is invalid anyway.

reply to post by Honor93


Correct, it is technically fraudulent activity, and provable in court with hard facts and documented evidence in conjunction with the actual valid law books on the shelf today.

It would almost appear as if, the entire "United States" corporation, is committing all sorts of actual crimes against the very people of not only North America, but the entire world.

They are akin to the modern robber barons, proven by historical study and genealogy as being descendant from the great lords and monarchs of the past, going as far back as all available historical records reveal far into antiquity.

And I would suppose that leaves us as being the modern peasantry, led blindly into whatever agenda suits tptb at the time.

I would presume that it really comes down to the fact that believing what we are told is a pitfall, and we must be skeptical and actually go check the books first hand.

It's a proven fact they are participating in racketeering (organized criminal syndicates).

I just wish someone would arrest these criminals and we could try them under the law in respect to what sorts of actions we can prove they committed.

Originally posted by clearmind
reply to post by nenothtu

 

here here

im one of those who hasnt seen a doctor for longer than most posters have been alive..and i have a list as long as my forearm of injuries, disease that i have treated myself and very succsesfully, thank you

and right now i am watching how the healthcare system is useless and fails those in real need, fourtunatly im not the one its failing, sad to watch friends suffer because of the quacks......if you think doctors dont spend enuf time with patients now..just wait till they have to handle a couple hundred more patients...
people will be forced to pay a penalty on something that they wont use and private business are being told that they cant run thier own business. this sets a bad precident and apparently the supporters of this 'act' in such a rapturous state that they cant see it.....

I throw my own stitches and treat my own ails, and when one comes along that I can't treat, I'll follow the natural course of events and die. If people can't understand that, it's not MY problem, it's their failure of empathy.

You have to wonder how loud they're going to howl when the other team is at the helm, and they are required to subsidize Smith and Wesson and purchase a quota of firearms (for the common good and defense, of course) or pay the tax for failure to do so.

The precedent, as you say, has already been set.

Originally posted by Honor93

Originally posted by stanguilles7
reply to post by habitforming

 

There are lots of people like that who pretend they 'dont need doctors'.

In my experience, the are liars.

no one here claims they "don't need doctors" ... they/we are stating emphatically that we do not need or want insurance or the govt intrusions of this proposal, which btw is invalid anyway.

ORLY?

"Nor do I pay my visits to corporate butcher shops with the big red crosses on the roofs"

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by nenothtu

 

You will probably never convince them that you really don't want to be in their little 'I am going to live forever club' . They worry themselves silly about how other people live their lives. Concerned that you won't join up, they can't understand why some souls want to be left alone.

I'll eventually make believers out of them, but it will probably take a lifetime - or a death time - to do it. Even then, they will believe, and never, ever understand.

reply to post by muzzleflash

and i've been wondering for most of my adult life when SOMEONE, anyone was going to use the RICO statutes against the US Govt and all of its agencies. are we there yet ???

i cannot think of anything more disappointing than our govt purposefully extorting the citizenry but it has gone on for so very long, most ppl don't even recognize it anymore.

reply to post by stanguilles7
??? what are you saying ???
who or what is orly and what is that nonsense in quotes about anyway ?

Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by muzzleflash

 

and i've been wondering for most of my adult life when SOMEONE, anyone was going to use the RICO statutes against the US Govt and all of its agencies. are we there yet ???

i cannot think of anything more disappointing than our govt purposefully extorting the citizenry but it has gone on for so very long, most ppl don't even recognize it anymore.

edit on 29-6-2012 by Honor93 because: add txt

RICO...........do you really expect LEOs, the military, 3 letter org., etc to go against the people that write their checks and endanger their lively hood by enforcing RICO against the govt.


I don't see it. Bureaucracies and institutions corporate and private are hard wired for self preservation.

ricoact.com...

Originally posted by stanguilles7

Originally posted by Honor93

Originally posted by stanguilles7
reply to post by habitforming

 

There are lots of people like that who pretend they 'dont need doctors'.

In my experience, the are liars.

no one here claims they "don't need doctors" ... they/we are stating emphatically that we do not need or want insurance or the govt intrusions of this proposal, which btw is invalid anyway.

ORLY?

"Nor do I pay my visits to corporate butcher shops with the big red crosses on the roofs"

That's right. That's what I said, and that's what I meant. I can die on my own - I don't need a doctor to help me along.

Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by stanguilles7

 

??? what are you saying ???
who or what is orly and what is that nonsense in quotes about anyway ?

He quoted where I said I don't need or want doctors.

Oh and another very important point I feel that many people are missing.

Doctors can't prevent death.
We have to face this fact and stop trying to pretend it isn't so.

Hell, look at the records available to the public.
Sometimes, visiting the doctor results in a shorter life span.

You never know what's going to happen. You should try to take care of yourself, and seek a healthy and productive life sure, but you can't cure death. It's inevitable, 100% odds sooner or later, we all 'kick the bucket'.

And who really could argue convincingly that we are not pointlessly wasteful with our resources?

I'm convinced this is a nation of hypochondriacs and that the pharmaceutical corps are the dealer.