Were you in the "Gifted Program" ?

Amazing... I haven't thought about the Gifted program in years... in fact most of it was completely forgotten by me until I read this thread... So now, much like everyone else here - I shall tell my story.

When I was very young, I was taken to a psychologist around 3-4 years old. I was put through several different IQ tests and other random questions. I never knew why. After I did these tests I was told that I was going to be going to school a year and a half earlier, since the psychiatrist basically told the school that I needed to be accelerated to school immediately.

I was an outgoing child then and told random strangers the story of my life up to that point just for fun. During school everything was normal until 2nd grade. My teacher, whom name I still remember to this day, made a big deal out of how outgoing I was and did everything in her power that she could to try and destroy that part of me. Often telling me to just shut up, stop telling stories, stop drawing, stop being creative; this boiled over to the point where I was placed in a corner of the room while she taught the rest of the class. I immediately went to pick up a book, and was scalded again, told to sit in silence until the end of the day and to not do anything.

I fell asleep soon after.

I woke up later with the teacher and Principal hovering over me. I wasn't in the class room anymore, I was in the Guidance Counselors office. I was basically interrogated as to what I thought I was doing until they opened up my file and discussed things, then I was told that I was going to be placed into the "Gifted" program the very next year.

Third grade, every Thursday for four hours I would leave class in the afternoon and go into a separate class room. There was 8 other people in the class from every grade through to 6th (which was standard elementary school in my area). We were given all types of tasks to help 'enhance our gift' as they stated. There was a special teacher who was brought in for this class who was not part of the regular staff, her name however I don't remember.

This was around 1986, I was 5.

Every year, every grade, I was in the gifted program. We were the first to have a fully loaded PC with all types of engineering software (including a program to design and test car aerodynamics etc.) We were given projects dealing with marketing, politics, and things that just weren't taught in Elementary school.

My mood and attitude changed dramatically since then, as an Adult now I have severe Bi Polar disorder, I cant control my moods and have been on anti-anxiety meds ever since. Throughout school I did typical lashing out against things, I don't think that was a result of the program... but who knows.

There are points in my life I don't remember, I've seen pictures of me places that I never recall being. Going to Atlantic City to see the (then named) WWF, I saw pictures of me there - happy as can be - Can't remember ever being in Atlantic City until I was 17.

I was 6 in the pictures.

It probably is all just bad memory and just silly in general... but this thread seriously made me sit back and wonder the 'what if' of the entire thing... what if all of us in the gifted program were... well... programmed.

This thread inspired me to reach out and find the others who were in the program as well... I'll update after finding them and see if they have similar experiences as myself.

reply to post by stevenreanimator


From what I understand, bi-polar disorder is the only mental illness (aside from depression) that is actually more prevalent among higher iqs. Why that is, I don't know. Never saw anything explaining why but, in a way, I think it makes a bit of sense because of the manic-depressive nature of the disorder. I do know that the primary psychological "tool" that they use for the gifted is something called "positive disintegration". Basically, Dabrowski figured that the gifted were over-excitable in that we had a greater capacity for sensory stimulation and empathy because our brains were like sponges taking in just about everything. If you poke around a bit, Dabrowski's works will come up again and again in gifted research. To put it simply, positive disintegration was basically creating a controlled self implosion with the goal of increased personal development. John Curtis Gowan, who spent decades researching the gifted, authored over 100 papers, and was the president of the NAGC, actually called positive disintegration "developmental forcing". One of the things that he mentioned in his book, "Trance, Art, and Creativity" was that positive disintegration or developmental forcing could result in schizophrenic episodes or schizophrenia.

While neither of those are bi-polar disorder, I found that interesting after querying my own pool of gifted friends and asking them if they heard voices when they were kids. Auditory hallucinations are a common feature of schizophrenic episodes. So, out of curiosity, I asked 8 of my male friends who were also in the program whether or not they had heard voices when they were younger. All of them were shocked that I asked that question/guessed that about them as all of them said yes. Basically, every single one of them reported a schizophrenic episode in their early teen years. Now, even more curiously, that same study that was actually trying to put that "fine line between madness and genius" cliche to the test found that the incidence of schizophrenia within the intellectually gifted was the same as for a more typical population. In other words, higher iq doesn't make for an increased likelihood of developing schizophrenia. Yet 8 out of 8 of my male friends reported a schizophrenic episode, which Gowan cited as being a risk for positive disintegration/developmental forcing. That's a pretty significant coincidence.

Again though, that's not bi-polar disorder per se but the writing about positive disintegration does include discussion of the possibility of developing psychosis. Psychosis, on the other hand, can be a feature of more severe bi-polar disorder. Here's an article that talks about positive disintegration a bit and I'd suggest poking around to read some of the other articles on the site as well: positivedisintegration.com...

I can't really help in terms of memory as much of my childhood memory is woefully shattered. I've asked some of my gifted friends what they recollect and it varies between very spotty to outright blanks that perturbed them because they typically have very good memories. As far as the sleeping goes, I know that there was suggestion of using hypnosis, meditation and trance states from the mid 60's and all the way up to the 90's. I don't have the link on this computer but I did have an education news article about parents being outraged (may have already linked it here). Part of their outrage was due to the presence of guided visual relaxation exercises taking place in a darkened room, which would be a kind of form of hypnotic induction. Wish I had that link to back what I'm saying up. Sorry about that.

P.S. One thing that I do shoddily recall is possibly meeting Ram Dass. However, I'm not entirely trustworthy of that recollection as it could've been a film in class and misinterpretation. However, I do remember my and my fellow gifted friends making a lot of jokes about "Rammed ***" afterwards.

These 'Gifted' programs are social experiments.

Visitor2012
These 'Gifted' programs are social experiments.

edit on 24-1-2014 by Visitor2012 because: (no reason given)

Wrong. While what occurred within the programs themselves was frequently experimental, the primary goal of the program was to basically assist high potential children to attain their highest potential potential that would also be beneficial to society and national defense as mandated by the National Defense Education Act of 1958.

reply to post by WhiteAlice


Bipolar, borderline, and anti-social are all disproportionately in the high-gifted range. They happen less and less with IQ until you start reaching the high-gifted range. I read before that the very highest IQ's don't have any disorders to speak of. Perfectly ordered for the system. The notion on this site was that "genius" is between before this highest category, and the superior range. That you need a certain amount of neurotic and psychotic tendencies to be a "genius". Don't know how much credit I give this notion, but it makes sense intuitively.

It's basically a social experiment. The ones who test high enough, but not the highest stay within the social structure. The ones who are genius (by raw IQ standards, not the above reasoning) are funneled into military.

It's experimental, and a social program, that may turn military. How is that not a social experiment?

We had a "social experiment" or rather just a weird program within our school that was experimental.

It was called, "school within a school" for all the students that didn't bother about their grades, but tested through the roof. Nearly everyone in it was in my misfit social group that hung out every weekend. A few oddballs that didn't mix with anyone was in there as well. That's it. We didn't do any good for society that I know of. We all just thought the system was a joke. One kid committed suicide at age 17 in the bathroom of that very school.

I just realized, there was more to the program. We were in smaller classroom sizes, and had the best teachers, but also had therapy on tap for our specific program anytime we wanted it. I think that ties into the above. We could just walk out and to the counselor assigned to our group and make up whatever or talk about whatever. All we really did in that class was daydream, drive the teachers bonkers, and ace the material without needing to study for anything. It was pointless, and enabling to put us all in the same classroom. Not too bright.

Failed experiment. Only lasted 2 years.

I was never in the gifted program, my standardized test scores are and have always been unbelievably high but the one and only time I took the test (second grade) I came in just under what was needed to pass. Growing up I moved between states and schools quite often so it wouldn't have made a difference either way.

My high school however was a private school that required an entrance exam, I don't know the pass rate of the exam but I do remember that out of the 60ish people I took the test with only 2 of us passed. It didn't participate in the gifted program so once past middle school I never had another opportunity to attend (and to be honest I never actually expressed interest in attending past second grade) but our grading scale at the school was quite harsh with the cutoff for a D- being a 92% and the coursework itself being college level. My graduating class back in 2000 was only 20 people or so out of around 25 in our freshman year.

I was in this program from kindergarten until the 6th grade. It was first called Argo, then just the Gifted and Talented Program. Thanks for sparking a flame in my mind to research and remember what I was taught. Thanks OP.

I had a class or two that was supposed to be for gifted students. The same students in the class were the same ones I knew in other classes. We all had higher grades. I think what it basically boiled down to was that most of the locally born students were not very bright and neither were some of the teachers. Most of my teachers were good though. I ended up in one class with a not too bright teacher and a bunch of super slow students. I recognized one guy right away. On day one or two he told me, I think we're in the wrong class. He got transferred. I got bored. Read way ahead in the algebra book. Blurted out apparently that I could teach the class better than the teacher and she took me up on that. For two days I taught the class and the teacher just sat and watched. I was thinking I'm not getting paid to do that and went back to being a student. She said I was doing a good job but I didn't want to keep doing her job.

After I went to college my fears were confirmed. I had to take some remedial math courses because my High School didn't do enough math for college. Basically they never taught trigonometry. If they had taught statistics, they could have better prepared me.

I think a lot of High Schools in the south might be lacking. I remember playing chess with one guy in my dorm suite easily beating him 8 games in a row. After that he told me he was his High School chess champion. I thought he must have gone to school with idiots. I didn't say it though.

reply to post by webedoomed


You obviously have not looked into it very deeply. I've dug as far as I possibly could into the subject so here's a few things to help you start. It's always been more than just a mere social experiment and if you really think about it, it makes sense that there would be an interest in high potential kids.

The programs were mandated through the National Defense Education Act in 1958 and started with Project Talent, which basically tested students across the US. www.nagc.org...

The Department of Defense has had their fingers in the gifted pie since the 60's through at least, RAND, DARPA, SDC, and the NSA. NASA would be another federal entity involved with the programs. The NSA link can be confirmed through the NSA's own site if you go to the site, click on the academia tab and then select K-12. Likewise, you can click here, to see their internship application for G&T high school seniors. Much of the information linking these entities directly with the program, itself, was deleted from the internet after their discoveries were publicly shared.

Some of the names involved, many nationally: Donald D. Bushnell (SDC), Drs. Mary (SOI) and Robert (RAND) Meeker, Joseph P. Rice and Paul Plowman (Project Talent co-directors). www.deepdyve.com...

The reason why psychologists were involved was due to Abraham Maslow and his work on self-actualization.
www.isacs.org...

Here's a link to the bipolar/high iq study though it was primarily high iq males that they were looking at, which is interesting in itself. None of the female gifted that I know heard voices as an early teen--go figure. I'm guessing it's may have to do with a hormonal differences: thurj.org...

The programs have lasted more than two years. The programs have been around for decades. My mother, sibling, myself and my children have all been in the G&T programs. That's three generations worth of years. As far as what happens in them, it might surprise you to know that oversight for the programs is not through the Dept. of Education but at the state level. Much of the funding for them, as well, is not through the DoE but through private funding and other interested entities. It makes "following the money" really kind of interesting and difficult. It's not too hard, however, to find inferences. Gifted will mention the use of SRA cards and early computers. Well, SRA is owned by IBM. Not hard to do the math on that one.

The system that is in place now, at least in my area, is pretty slick. My eldest was admitted to college at 15 and has all of his tuition, books and fees paid for by the state. He's about to exit that program and I really wasn't surprised when he told me that his advisers are pushing him towards agency work. Most of his peers within this program came from what could only be described as a peculiar magnet school where there was no homework or grades and subjects were modular by nature. They were shifted en masse to the college program due to budget cuts forcing the closure of the school. The curriculum for my youngest, who is in middle school, is staggeringly different and more complex than the regular class. I'd show the curriculum links for each but that would be too identifying. Some of the 6th grade subjects for her class are systems thinking and trending.

Happy hunting.

reply to post by WhiteAlice


I'm not sure what to make of your post. It's as if you're either trying to prove something to your self, or replied to the wrong person??

You know what I tend to see in high IQ people? The ones who get stuck in the details.. they're the system expert types. Then there's the big-picture people... the ones who are more system-independent.

I think you're arguing against details that don't really matter. That's the only thing I can come up with. At any rate, I'm failing to see how anything you posted in any way contradicts what I wrote. It's like you just want to throw out these details, and have me acknowledge their existence... just cause? I don't get it.

You said this was done at the state level, right? Why are you assuming that your experience of it in your state has anything to do with my experience of it in my state?

Here's the link to the G/T program in my state of Texas:

Texas G & T Program

So I won awards each year for something or another, was obviously lopsided towards mathetmatics and sciences, took an IQ test one year with 4 other people in a small room, parents had a meeting with the faculty, and I stayed in the same school, though I recall the structure changed (they took top 10% into newer advanced programs), and more extracurricular programs were pushed my way. That your experience was different than mine, doesn't mean mine is somehow invalid, or wrong?! I'm just not getting your point here.

I was on duke's G & T list for years. They told me one year that if I kept scoring above a mark (I think the 98th percentile) in math and sciences each successive year until exit examinations, I would get a full scholarship (to duke uni) and start early. Apparently I was going to be advanced starting in high school to graduate early, I guess. In 6th grade I came in late for exams, and super.... goofy, lets say, and I missed the mark by a question or two. End of my chance to start Uni early.

I get that it's operated at the state level, has private investors, and branches out to more specialized programs in some states if you go through all the hoops year after year. I just didn't care to after reaching the 6th grade. Had enough by then. No regrets here.

reply to post by webedoomed


Wasn't arguing per se but stating that there is a lot more to them than what you espoused. I have read almost a thousand abstracts and scholarly papers on the subject of the gifted programs and have researched the crap out of this subject. I was providing you with some more information. I'm actually a systems thinker, contrary what to you might think, but I chose to actually base my macro view through the accumulation of details. Kind of like putting together a puzzle. Actually, exactly like putting together a puzzle.

In fact, you're declaring that your program would've been different than mine and my observation that it is run at the state level and not the DoE basically affirms that the experiences from state to state will be varied. That was the point of bringing up that factoid. Another factor would be time period so that one person in the program in California during the 70's is going to have a different type of experience as another living in Iowa in the 90's. Outside of that, there are a few commonalities that would be national but it's not going to be glaring and in your face. These portions of the curriculum would be catered to children and not immediately identifiable as being something of a higher level. Hence why I directed you to the K-12 curriculum page on the NSA's website.

Don't shoot the messenger.

reply to post by webedoomed


You and me both know any testing doesnt prove perspective which is unique to each problem solving situation anyway so whats the difference?

When i was in school my parents were having problems and around 6th grade we started moving all over, all over the country. I was aspiring to be on the football team and had perfect grades. Then in 7th grade after going from school to school i finally got sick of everything and stopped doing the work and paying attention in class. I was always new in school and finally i started manifesting real anger issues and started getting into a lot of fights. So this ended up with me going into a problem kid class with about ten other kids with similar issues. Well, luckily my grandmother knew i was really smart and kept on the school telling them i needed to be in college prep classes and i was really good with computers (i knew 3.0 like the back of my hand and i was getting into MUD gaming so i was learning through the interests of gaming early).

Well during this process and after looking at about 6 years of perfect grades they decided to put me through a multitude of tests. Till this day i have no idea what the tests were or what scores i got because my life for the next few years was very rebellious and full of crap. I can however tell you that i never complete a homework or school assignment for about 3 years straight and the school systems wouldnt fail me. On top of this i got offered scholar ships to go to programming charter school in New Jersey and they kept writing my grandmother who took custody of me due to home issues and requesting they send me to their school where i would complete 4 years of programming in highschool and then be offered scholarships based on academic reviews for college.

Long story short my parents wouldnt let her send me to this school i really have no idea why and if it was a good thing or not but i eventually quit school.

reply to post by onequestion


I once read roughly 1/3 of the people who get their GED test in the gifted range. I had skipped far more days since the sixth grade than what was allowed, never did homework, and aced materials until I was 17. Week after I turned 17, went into the deans office, and told him I was dropping out. They tried to convince me it wasn't an option (upon reviewing my record), which I refused to accept as a reality. So I took the GED, went to community college a year early (it was then ranked #1 in the nation), and was disappointed to see it seemed to be a step down from the senior high I was previously at.

I thought the system was a joke from age 12 on. Never had the violent streak you did, though. I, too, was advanced with computers and programming. Self-taught html at 13, had multiple websites, made games for the graphing calculators in class, and was basically bored out of my skull. Instead of fighting, I just goofed around and tried to learn from other funky personalities around the metro area. It mostly worked out. I remember the weirdest part was watching adults think they could some how control me, and knew what was best for me, or how to shape my mind. They were clueless! The funnest part was continuously getting out of whatever situation they tried to box me in. I'm thankful for them giving me the opportunity to grow... outside of their ridiculous boxes.

I wasn't in any of these gifted programs. Matter of fact I've always had problems staying in school. Couldn't stay in them then, can't now.

Yeah back when I was in elementary I remembered that.
But it was middle school they really vamped up the test, made me do test involving equations I never seen before, but answered them to the best of my knowledge.
I still remember the guy, he was balding, tall an lanky, big nose with glasses, lol. I was told that I was above average to my siblings an peers...
But I guess nothing came of it since I'm not in some top rated university...ig I wasted it all in the military, lol...But I did score high on the asvab a GT score of 104, first time go an being out of school for 5 fives years, beating HS an College kids right out of school, guess I got some of that old mental edge there...

reply to post by webedoomed


I'm the same way with the GED, i studied for like 2 hours total before the test and i scored into the 99%tile. The lady gave me the tests and said that noone ever scores this high and i should go to college and i was like whatever lady give me the paperwork LOL.

Its funny man, its weird how to us its so natural to just tap into that knowledge source thats in our DNA. Im a lefty too so im a little weird and it throws people off LOL.

They dont have systems for people like us because everything is developed for mass production so when we come along and were like WHATEVER they haveno idea what to do because their so used to the mondaine.

Then we get into conspiracies because we are so far out of the mondaine that we cant understand how or why the world works and we end up turning to things like drinking or just generally do dumb#.

WhiteAlice

Visitor2012
These 'Gifted' programs are social experiments.

edit on 24-1-2014 by Visitor2012 because: (no reason given)

Wrong. While what occurred within the programs themselves was frequently experimental, the primary goal of the program was to basically assist high potential children to attain their highest potential potential that would also be beneficial to society and national defense as mandated by the National Defense Education Act of 1958.

Social programs that appear 'frequently experimental' are called social experiments. Doesn't matter where the mandate comes from.

Roundtree
I'm sure many of you have heard of the gifted program, if not, it is a program set up basically to first identify "gifted" children, and then bring them all to different schools to learn different things, once a week. They took IQ tests, constantly gave us projects which were high complexity for 7-8 year olds, as well as other mentally challenging tests. The wierd thing was out of say 7-8 schools in the area, there were only 20 of us in the gifted program, called Odyssey in my region.

Was this an attempt to get the intelligent children on the books? find out who they are and watch them as they mature?

Also, how many of us ended up here? the gifted program taught us to reason, to ask why and how things happen, which is what this and other conspiracy sites are all about. Id advise you all to research star children, and compare the characteristics to the gifted program. I'm sure that we are in a record somewhere, identified as possible star children or something, what are your guys' thoughts?

I was tested in second grade and easily made it. This was after they taught me to read in first grade and I was in the second to the bottom reading group, but between first and second grade I skipped to third or fourth grade proficiency on my own.

They didn't have any room for me in second grade, but I was given access with another to girl to advanced reading. We were allowed to go at our own pace. Sometimes, we would decide to just read the whole reader over the weekend and move on.

In third grade, they still didn't have room for me in the regular gifted classes, but the gifted instructor took me and another girl in class out for regular advanced math instruction two or three times a week in the library. We were in long division before the year was done. This was in addition to being placed in a 3rd-4th grade combo room where I could be placed in advanced reading again and given more independent latitude with my work in general.

By fourth grade, I was in the Gifted Class being pulled out regularly to work with about five or six other kids in my grade school about two or three times a week for an hour a day. We would do the special projects you talk about, and we also learned formal logic and reasoning. This continued through 6th, and in 7th, all of us from all the grade schools were tracked together into advanced track programs in math, science and English. Generally, it meant we were usually in most of the same classes together even when they weren't advanced.

We also got the opportunities to do the special academic competitions (Science Olympiad, Scholars Bowl, Math Relays, etc.) and field trips. We went to a lot of lectures in high school. We were within driving distance of a couple major unis and two jucos, so we got the opportunities to attend their lecture series if we wanted to. I saw people like Arthur Ashe, Bart Conners, Helen Thomas, Dr. Red Duke, Larry McMurtry, Maya Angelou, and others I don't remember their names, but I remember them. It was voluntary, too. Sarge (our high school coordinator) would send us newsletters each month, and we'd sign up for what we wanted to go attend.

I was particularly adept at working the system. By the time I was a senior, I could get out of almost a whole week of classes legitimately.

Arnie123
Yeah back when I was in elementary I remembered that.
But it was middle school they really vamped up the test, made me do test involving equations I never seen before, but answered them to the best of my knowledge.
I still remember the guy, he was balding, tall an lanky, big nose with glasses, lol. I was told that I was above average to my siblings an peers...
But I guess nothing came of it since I'm not in some top rated university...ig I wasted it all in the military, lol...But I did score high on the asvab a GT score of 104, first time go an being out of school for 5 fives years, beating HS an College kids right out of school, guess I got some of that old mental edge there...

Our middle school pre-algebra and algebra teacher used to make us take those tests. They were called Sigma tests.

When it comes to math, my weakest thing is story problems, especially when I have no clue how to apply the math to the situation, so I started writing huge paragraphs about how and why I had no clue how to answer the problems just to fill the time we were forced to spend on them.

My teacher was less than amused I think.

Hello everyone!
I'm new to this website but happened upon this forum when I was doing a Google search last night on Mentally Gifted Minors in California. That was prompted by some interesting flashbacks I was having while playing brain training games at a website called Lumosity.com.

Here is my contribution to the thread. I was part of the Mentally Gifted Minors (MGM) program in the 70s and then was in the Gifted and Talented Education (G.A.T.E.) program until high school graduation. This was in the Silicon Valley of CA, not too far away from Stanford University (more on that later).

I normally have a pretty excellent memory for details from my past but when it comes to the MGM / G.A.T.E. program, there is a lot of fuzziness. I have to say, it sort of freaks me out because having read a number of posts in this thread, I'm beginning to remember more things.

Interestingly enough, I was diagnosed on the autism spectrum with Asperger's syndrome a couple years ago after my two sons were diagnosed with autism and Asperger's respectively. As Asperger's didn't make it into the DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual) until 1994, I'm wondering if many of the children that were part of MGM and related-type of programs were some of the early undiagnosed Aspies who are now having children today, many who are also ending up on the spectrum.

So as far as my MGM memories go, here are a few random things:

* Being taken to what I remember being a "closet" (that might not be right but it seemed to be a room off of our school cafeteria which was also our auditorium, so maybe it was some sort of back room) and doing lots and lots of "games" and "tests". There was more than one person... but usually just one-on-one with a woman who was not a teacher and for the life of me, darn it, I can't remember her face.

* There was a lady who used to live down the street, Mrs. V.E. Somehow she knew about my IQ test and was fascinated with me and would tell me all sorts of things about what a "smart" and "good girl" I was... She had a son the same age. They moved away.

* I remember someone talking with me about my "IQ" test and telling me I wasn't allowed to tell anyone my score because I was "so special".

* I remember talking about my adoption. (I was adopted at just a few weeks old.)

* Someone wanted me to skip ahead a couple grades and kept talking to me about it. I was already the youngest in my class and didn't want to... or my parents didn't want me to, not sure. I just know that the subject seemed to come up repeatedly.

* Practicing ESP (star, square, circle, plus sign, squiggly line). Later, I practiced this with another girl who had also moved into town and was new to the school. We were both adopted and I remember distinctly that she and I were really in sync with each other and how cool we thought that was.

* I was placed as a tutor in a special education classroom in elementary school. I loved doing that.

* Later in middle school, I was also allowed to leave campus to be a tutor in a special education classroom at another elementary school. This was exciting and fun and didn't seem at all strange, however in retrospect, I seriously can't remember how I would get to the school because it wasn't "that" close but I guess I either walked or rode my bike.

I don't remember ever applying or asking to do these things. They just happened. I ended up tutoring a bit in high school too although by that time, being the "smart" kid was starting to wear off novelty-wise and I was more self-aware that being the girl in the classroom who knows all the answers is not the key to social success. In fact, I went through somewhat of a rebellious and prankster stage.

* Another friend and I (he was my "manager") performed a mini-concert for other elementary school kids. I loved to sing and was probably just trying to emulate a 4th grade teacher but now that I think about it, it's odd that they let me just do it. It was out in the field behind our 4th grade classroom. I suspect they were trying to humor me.

* With another friend (who also moved away), I published a poem book that was mimeographed (remember the smell of those machines) and given to the students in the school with some of my artwork, the latter of which was not very impressive, at least in my eyes.

* I know I was grouped with certain kids in certain classes but my pull-outs for MGM were one-on-one.

* Back in the 70s, it wasn't unusual for our elementary school teachers to take us into "the closet". Could you imagine that nowadays?

* I would get to go on special "field trips" including Stanford University. I didn't know at the time it was Stanford but when I was in middle school, I had a friend whose parents worked at Stanford and occasionally we would visit there and play pinball.

* I remember visiting Atari in Sunnyvale and getting to play video games.

* Being in the Silicon Valley, I was always encouraged into computers and math and pushed into AP classes whether I wanted to be in them or not.

* Those are a few of the "positive" or neutral things I remember.

I'm a bit concerned talking about the negative because I want to make sure what I am remembering is really correct. There is some stuff that happened that I KNOW is correct but I am not putting it here on this board for anyone to see because quite frankly, I don't know you, you don't know me and there is a lot at stake to be protected. Some of the stuff which I'm remembering sounds cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs so I'll just sit back down and observe...

For what it's worth, if you were in the Silicon Valley and were in MGM / GATE in the same timeframe, please feel free to post.
Thanks!