Do I have freedom FROM religion?

reply to post by Lightworth


One word: Angels. There's already enough people of this belief-set, that an alien coming wouldn't phase them. And then there's the whole debates over whether or not these creatures would need conversion or not. Christianity may try to live in bubble, sometimes, but we don't. So, no, although it may change a few in the the big 3.

reply to post by ownbestenemy

Thought you might find it fun that Richard Dawkins actually was for Bibles being sent to schools in England, with their taxpayer money. Here:

Rapprochement would seem to be in the air – until Dawkins's thesis is studied more closely. While Gove believes the Bible is a guide to morality, Dawkins is sure it is not. "I have heard the cynically misanthropic opinion that without the Bible as a moral compass people would show no restraint against murder, theft and mayhem. The surest way to disabuse yourself of this pernicious falsehood is to read the Bible itself," he says.

See, I could live with this. At leas then, people have a public chance to be educated in it and make a decision for themselves. Got a coworker that was raised in a church, and is quite firmly an Atheist. (He shuts down when you look like you are pushing him TO religion, but has no problem talking about religion when it doesn't sound like a bunch of "you ought to".) So, having people taught things that they don't agree with doesn't change much of anything.

reply to post by SaturnFX

So, you finally got to the point of being an Atheist pushing Islam on everyone? As in what most Christians have been claiming for years? Oh, the horror!

reply to post by SaturnFX
But in a base system of 2. 1+1=10 Teaching children that 1+1 ALWAYS equals 2 does make it harder on the higher grade teachers. The value is still the same, but how it is spelled is not.

reply to post by SaturnFX

And that's twisting what I stated. If you can't see that then . I damn well could see the implications. Not my job to worry about how people choose to indoctrinate themselves.


Need to check page 7+8, reminder to self. Off to church!

Originally posted by TheRedneck

Acceptance and tolerance lead to respect. Respect leads to equality. Equality leads to happiness for all.

TheRedneck

Not sure if this slippery slope statement works for us accepting and tolerating the current political system and its self-centered structure.

Its called knowledge!

Knowledge Protects, ignorance endangers.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
I imagine most of the theists here can stroll through an atheist convention and leave with all their beliefs intact, without being influenced by whatever they hear from atheists. So...just why do you seem so concerned about indoctrination in public places... from religious people?

Good point. Most of us can listen to a whole lecture by Dawkins and still have our belief in God intact, whereas with some of these folks you have the impression that any hint of religiosity is dangerous to them. You'd have to be pretty weak minded for a "in God we trust" inscription somewhere to plunge you into a crisis.

Originally posted by marinesniper0317
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

compared to the above let me know how a prayer is worse...please...its people like you that is the cause for PC garbage, putting stress on your children leading to their need for anti-depressants...

Sniper

Being raised with the understanding that you're probably going to burn in hell would not only put me on anti-depressants, but I'd go with smoking pot with a needle stuck in my arm.

Let's get one thing straight - it's religion that's garbage, not atheism. Religion is the foundation of all hatred thrown at homosexuals. Masturbation is evil - really??? You want to know how prayer is worse than anything? Have a look at this pic. I'll bet these terrorists were praying in their last moments of dying for allah.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Discussions of afterlife are for theology. its not a science, its not a math, its not language.

"Study of the afterlife is not science" and similar beliefs imposed by the "cult of reason" in the late 17th Century led to a separation of religion and science. This separation causes the mass epidemic of ignorance atheists/humanists call "progress" and "social evolution". In a world that has progressed in the true sense of thee word, studying the afterlife would be considered normal, natural, desirable.

Originally posted by jiggerj
I'll bet these terrorists were praying in their last moments of dying for allah.

I addressed this logical fallacy on the previous page yet you guys keep on unpacking it. If those wrecking a plane into the WTC were plumbers would you say "Plumbers are bad"?

Originally posted by Flatfish

Now to answer your title question; Hell No you don't have freedom from religion here in America and if the neo-con, bible thumping, right wing conservative movement gets their way, it will only get worse. Let's not forget the "Blue Laws," where they restrict our ability to purchase certain things on Sundays in order to enforce their religious standards on our masses? Why do you think it's against the law to purchase alcoholic beverages before noon, (at least here in Texas) on Sundays? What a Joke!

If its that difficult to do without alcohol on Sunday morning, there are much deeper íssues that need addressing. Id applaud that law even if I were an atheist.

Originally posted by lucid eyes

Originally posted by SaturnFX
2 towers are missing from new york because of religious morality. Yay religious morals! please..teach us more..some of us are still breathing.

And then the usual logical distortion of guilt-by-association. The terrorists were not only muslims, they were also pilots...does that mean we have to condemn or get rid of piloting as well?

Some of the Nazis were nurses...does that mean we should ban all nurses symbols from public?

The 9/11 perpetrators were about as much "muslim" and the salem witch burners about as much "christian" as stalin represents atheism.

Your talking points are superficial and illogical.

WHAT??? If these pilots were not of the muslim faith they wouldn't have done it. If they weren't brainwashed into believing in a dangerous fantasy they wouldn't have done it. Oh, I just love how the religious can bend everything into pure insanity and then call everyone else insane. What a joke.

Originally posted by jiggerj

WHAT??? If these pilots were not of the muslim faith they wouldn't have done it. If they weren't brainwashed into believing in a dangerous fantasy they wouldn't have done it. Oh, I just love how the religious can bend everything into pure insanity and then call everyone else insane. What a joke.

And what about the many BILLIONS of muslims that dont engage in terrorist acts?

It doesnt matter what they were...they would have done it if they were Hindus, Atheists or anything other. Atrocities have been committed by any and every particular group.

You practice guilt-by-association because you are unable to tell the difference between things. You connect dots and assign false "causes". My kids do this. The villain was a post office clerk so post office clerks must be bad.

reply to post by jiggerj

WHAT??? If these pilots were not of the muslim faith they wouldn't have done it.

And if Stalin and Pol Pot believed in God, they wouldn't have done all those naughty things to millions of their people. See, this line of reasoning can be played both ways.

Sure, they didn't act in the name of atheism, but the point is that even people with a lack of belief in God are capable of committing atrocities.

You do not have freedom from religion because modern religion, at it's very core, was created to enslave you from it's inception. Why else are the gods of the old never mentioned or, when they are, portrayed as evil or demonic? Why else would a 2000 year old book, that has stolen virtually everything within it's texts from the old pagan and sumerian texts, deprive you of basic human rights such as sexual contact, while in the very same sentence threatening you with enternal hell fire and pain? What God that is supposed to be almighty and pure would threaten his own creation? The fact is, even those that practice modern religion have no idea what they're actually worshiping (and they are worshiping the religion not a certain God) because they never actually read the book. There is no seperation between church and state because there is no seperation between religion and God.

Originally posted by lucid eyes

Originally posted by jiggerj

WHAT??? If these pilots were not of the muslim faith they wouldn't have done it. If they weren't brainwashed into believing in a dangerous fantasy they wouldn't have done it. Oh, I just love how the religious can bend everything into pure insanity and then call everyone else insane. What a joke.

And what about the many BILLIONS of muslims that dont engage in terrorist acts?

It doesnt matter what they were...they would have done it if they were Hindus, Atheists or anything other. Atrocities have been committed by any and every particular group.

You practice guilt-by-association because you are unable to tell the difference between things. You connect dots and assign false "causes". My kids do this. The villain was a post office clerk so post office clerks must be bad.

Don't even attempt to argue this point. Some people are so brainwashed by the propaganda that they actually hate the people not even the religion. It's a race war more than a religious war now to them.

Do you have freedom from religion...sure.

Do you have freedom from being exposed to religion... no.

It's all about choices... and the freedom to choose. That's America. The freedom and right to choose.

Coke or Pepsi... or water? Your choice...just because it is offered does not mean you have to choose that item.

Gay or lesbian or straight? Your choice. Just because we are exposed does not mean we have to partake of that lifestyle.

Corn flakes or frosted flakes or oat meal..... tofu or steak... fries or baked potato...

it's all about choices.

You argue the point for being free from the exposure of religion and many here would agree... yet what if someone wanted to be free from the exposure of gays holding hands in the park or a lesbian parade...suddenly they would be decried as iggnorant, backward, and racist.

In part, that is the problem with the issue of Obama and healthcare...a choice... if you want insurance, fine. if you don't...fine. it's your choice... only thing is with Obama-care we have no choice.

Many feel that religion is forced down there throats at every turn...many also feel that gay rights or Islam or fascism or socialism or global warming is being rammed down their throats.

It's all about choices and the freedom to choose. As long as we have an open and free society, we will be exposed to things we agree with and things we do not agree with. That is the beauty of freedom...the right to choose.

So, if you have a child and he/she asks why those people are going into that big building with a cross on top... you can explain and tell them why you choose not to.

And, if you have a child and he/she asks why those two men are sitting over there kissing each other... you can explain and tell them why you choose not to.

And, when you have a child and they want to know why you always get pickles and no tomato on your cheese burger... you can expalin and tell them why you choose not to.

Originally posted by lucid eyes

If its that difficult to do without alcohol on Sunday morning, there are much deeper íssues that need addressing. Id applaud that law even if I were an atheist.

FYI, I don't even drink alcohol but that's not the point. Then again, it doesn't surprise me in the least that you can't see "the point."

Not that long ago here in Texas, alcohol was just one of many things you couldn't purchase on Sundays and I'm talking about all day long.

www.nytimes.com...

AUSTIN, Tex., Sept. 2— Laws mandating the use of seat belts and repealing the 24-year-old Texas blue law went into effect Sunday, three months after the 1985 legislative session that approved the measures.

The blue law, enacted in 1961, prohibited the sale of 42 items on consecutive Saturdays and Sundays, effectively banning Sunday sales.

Supporters said the measure was aimed at discount houses, since it specifically prohibited sales of furniture, clothing, hardware and appliances.

Did it ever occur to you that I may work offshore for weeks at a time and when I do get time off, I need to get my personal affairs done without the imposition of your silly assed beliefs? This is about the involuntary imposition of religious beliefs into the lives of others. If you religious fanatics don't want to buy # on Sundays, then don't! But stay the hell off my right to do so.

With respect to "In God We Trust" on our money, I have to ask; Would you be offended if the money you had to carry in your pocket had "In Allah We Trust" printed on it? If your answer is "yes" or even "maybe," then you should be able to see the point of this thread. If your answer is "no," then IMO, you are either delusional or in a state of denial.

Originally posted by Jagermeister
was created to enslave you from it's inception.

On the contrary. Religion was introduced to liberate humans from violent and barbaric conditions of pre-religious times.

Why else are the gods of the old never mentioned or, when they are, portrayed as evil or demonic?

Because the Gods of the old were barbaric themselves. No matter where you look in the world you will find these "Gods" demanding things such as sacrificing children and other atrocious behavior too sick to mention.

"My public view is, keep religion out of public policy."

You need to read about American history, how religion and government divided.

read wiki on US History en.wikipedia.org...

read about religion in american government en.wikipedia.org...

hope these website will enlighten you.

reply to post by AlreadyGone


Notice how you have the choice of hundred of soda flavors, but only 2 presidential candidates. Notice that you have the choice of 33 different ice cream flavors, but only a handful of banks. Notice that you are never given a real choice when it comes to anything that actually means something. That is America. The illusion of choice to keep people enslaved because people like yourself will run around and parrot propaganda the second anyone notices the cage they've been raised in.

Originally posted by Flatfish

Not that long ago here in Texas, alcohol was just one of many things you couldn't purchase on Sundays and I'm talking about all day long.

So what? You you buy your stash for Sunday on Saturday. Some countries dont allow alcohol on ANY day.

I know atheists love their drugs as a religion-substitute, but doing a few hours without purchasing alcohol certainly wont do any harm.

If I were in Government I would not outlaw its purchase on Sunday morning, but I can think of more important issues than those continually brought forth by atheists.

With respect to "In God We Trust" on our money, I have to ask; Would you be offended if the money you had to carry in your pocket had "In Allah We Trust" printed on it?

If Im in a country where the majority believes in Allah and Allah was involved in building the nation, why would I be offended by it? Even if it were on our Bills, why be offended by words? The mentality that throws a fit every time they see something that disagrees with their views is what needs to be addressed.

Originally posted by lucid eyes

Originally posted by jiggerj

WHAT??? If these pilots were not of the muslim faith they wouldn't have done it. If they weren't brainwashed into believing in a dangerous fantasy they wouldn't have done it. Oh, I just love how the religious can bend everything into pure insanity and then call everyone else insane. What a joke.

And what about the many BILLIONS of muslims that dont engage in terrorist acts?

It doesnt matter what they were...they would have done it if they were Hindus, Atheists or anything other. Atrocities have been committed by any and every particular group.

You practice guilt-by-association because you are unable to tell the difference between things. You connect dots and assign false "causes". My kids do this. The villain was a post office clerk so post office clerks must be bad.

Ask an atheist pilot to crash a plane into a building (sacrificing his life) because he will be rewarded in heaven. Yeah, that'll happen. So NOOOOO, they wouldn't have done it without a belief in their religion.