Thank God It is Up to the Faithful to Build an Electric Fence and Kill Gay People - video included

reply to post by GrandHeretic


You may be right but I as a gay person would like to point out that I knew I was NOT interested in girls long before I was a teenager. Now you can say that this is impossible because of your assertion that "you are not sexually mature till yer early teens" but I would like you to prove that to me!

wait wait wait...
lock up all the lesbians
and then do the same with all the queers and the homosexuals?
so there are three... err... categories of gay now?


to tell the truth, it is the calls for violence against this pastor and his ilk that worry me more than his ignorance.
ignorance can be denied. vioence can only make things worse.

reply to post by wiser3


Well ya know, there have been cases were children get sexual ques before puberty....so its not impossible...yer gay...good for you.......may you live a long productive life in the slavery that is the global banking system.

reply to post by decepticonLaura


The point is that these replies are only "calls" for violence against this pastor, who deserves exactly what he gets, he is PREACHING violence and hatred to his "flock", he is using his position of "religious power" to advocate killing people, these are people who go to his church hanging onto his every word because of course God said so!!! I doubt very much that anyone reading and replying to this thread is going to go out and hunt this man down just because one or more ATS members think he deserves it! And deserve it he does!

If one gay person gets killed because of what he preaches anyone who sides with him will be just as guilty of that persons death as he is in calling for it!

Gay people all over the world are experiencing violence against them every day!

Just read all of the anti gay homophobic threads here on ATS and judge for yourself which side of the worlds population is calling for more violence!

reply to post by GrandHeretic


Thanks for your proof!

NOT!

reply to post by wiser3


i think you misunderstand my position here.
there are ignorant religious types spewing hateful rhetoric
there have been for a long long time now.
no need to descend to their level.

if perhaps we instead focus on positive action and making our own lives the best and most meaningful we can
maybe some of this pastor's "sheep" [who are human beings like you and i]
will come to see that they are being lied to. and in time, who knows? maybe we could all get along.
spewing hate right back seems a counterproductive way to achieve this.

Religion in this day and age is totally usurped by evil. Wearing the clothes of the holy, while the whole time its people like this preacher who speak the word of Satan.

Is it just me, or did he sound like he was drunk?

And whats wrong with the people listening to him?? I can understand why the preacher is all F'ed up in the head.. He is a snake in the grass.. But those people who egg him on.. Those are the sad souls, that had a choice.

Id get up, and walk right out of that church and never come back..

Anyone who Amens that sermon, clearly has been duped, and is lost to the rest fooled by those who have taken over the religions of this world.. But really when has religion been a good thing ever???

Maybe at one time it served a higher divine source, but in our age, its nothing but wolves in sheeps clothing.

Having seen the video the following can be stated:

We should not hate or despise this person. For all of the mean and hateful things he has stated, ultimately, we should pity him. He stands up there in front of people to give a sermon, letting his emotion get the best of him, and instead of using religion to teach and maybe to include, he uses it as a weapon.

The reason why we should give him our pity, is cause he does not see what he is doing is wrong, does not see the fallacy of his words, nor does he seem to understand that his message is not of love, or of forgiveness. It is not that what his religion would believe, but that which he would like for it to say. No where in the bible does it specifically state the word Homosexual. Not one place at all. I have read and studied, been on this site for a long time, read many texts that are religious in nature. Not once does any of them state gay people or homosexual, and there in lies the real shame of it all. Most of the religions are that of being inclusive, drawing people together, like a shepherd would draw a flock together, to include all members of the community, not exclude them. To bring them together for one purpose, to show a community of love, and understanding. Compassion should be the word of the day when it comes to those who are religious in nature, yet they tend to be lacking in that aspect, and more is the pity.

We should feel sorry for this man and those who follow what he states, as he seems to forget that gay people do have an impact on society at large. Some of the biggest names in fashion are gay, or the entertainment industry, or even just maybe the food that they buy down at the grocery store was rung up or stocked by a gay man. To spew such hate in a country that is war weary, in a world that is tired is a sad event.

You may not like gay people, or want to accept that they want what everyone else wants, but to call for the outright destruction if not killing of such, is not the way to go. Gay people are everywhere, and tends to be in all facets of life. Many are decent hard working people, who pay taxes, live like everyone else does. But it is statements like this that keep the hatred alive, and for the gay people to either fight back and stand up, or to remain in the closet, terrified of their own shadows, always looking over their shoulders, for fear that someone could be out to get them. And with statements like this, they could be right.

It is only a matter of time, before someone takes what one of these ministers says to heart and being to target gay people, killing them, and that will be a sad day, as then it will come out a blow against 2 of the very freedoms we hold dear and cherish, the freedom of religion and the freedom of speech. All it takes is one act of violence, one act so heinous for laws to be enacted that start to affect everyone. It has happened before and it may happen again. The last thing we need is another McCarthy to come up and start a witch hunt or persecution against one group or another.

reply to post by WhisperingWinds


Your absolutely right - lumping all of them together is silly, and I was always one to preach that sentiment as well. But lately, and please understand I am not trying to pick a fight, I am just curious about something else you said, because I am hearing it constantly...especially in light of what's taking place in this world with religion.

You say that some pray privately for Gay souls, because of the act of sexual immorality - do they also pray privately for those who do this?

"'Keep my decrees. "'Do not mate different kinds of animals. "'Do not plant your field with two kinds of seed. "'Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material.

Or how about eating bacon?

I think I am just fed up with all the nonsense and hypocrisy - People just can't cherry pick out of a bible and fly with the hatred. If most of these Christians followed every single rule and law, I might start agreeing with the 'what's wrong and what's right' in this world.

Now it seems every time someone brings up the Leviticus scripture to fight back (or Deuteronomy) the hypocrisy, the response from the religious community is something like...'well, Leviticus is a very difficult book to understand' - Really? Because it looks pretty straight forward to me. Laws are laws, they are listed in a certain order, somewhat clear and concise...of course that's just my opinion.

You want confusing and crazy bible books....Ezekiel, Daniel and Job....now THOSE are difficult to understand!

However, it strikes me as odd how that one tiny little verse can be the most clear and easiest part of Leviticus to understand.

Like I said, not trying to pick a fight here, but its becoming so tiring....live and let live. As already proven in countries like Canada, Spain, UK, Belgium, Finland...and many more I can't name off the top of my head, Gay marriage, Gay living, Gay civil ceremonies, Gay benefits, Gay rights are absolutely affecting NO ONE...nor is it causing earthquakes and a high number of divorces amongst heterosexual couples.

Okay rant over. Thanks for listening!

Originally posted by decepticonLaura
reply to post by wiser3

 

i think you misunderstand my position here.
there are ignorant religious types spewing hateful rhetoric
there have been for a long long time now.
no need to descend to their level.

if perhaps we instead focus on positive action and making our own lives the best and most meaningful we can
maybe some of this pastor's "sheep" [who are human beings like you and i]
will come to see that they are being lied to. and in time, who knows? maybe we could all get along.
spewing hate right back seems a counterproductive way to achieve this.

I do understand your position but as a person who has tried and believe me I have tried, I am 53 years old and I am getting tired of "turning the other cheek" as I am sure many other gay people are also feeling.

But you believe we must just live in "hope" that one or more of this ignorant creeps' followers will come around to "our" way of thinking! What's the chance? If you go to this mans' Place of Worship on any given day of the week you go there because he is preaching what you want to hear him preach, you pay him to preach, because he is just reassuring you and re-inforcing your belief that what you believe is right!
Actually this man is probably not as ignorant as we presume, he very probably KNOWS that what he preaches is exactly what his "congregation" want and need to hear to justify their homophobic lifestyle but he also knows that the more he preaches exactly what they want to hear the more money he is going to "make" out of them! And make no mistake that is exactly what this is to him, a business and what he is selling is hatred!
How does one make ones life more meaningful and positive if you are continuously told you are wrong, you do not belong, you are unnatural, you are an obscenity, you deserve to die, you are worse than a paedophile, you are a sinner, you will end up in hell, you are a servant of Satan, you are an abomination, you deserve to get Aids, you do not deserve love, etc. etc. etc? HOW?

As a matter of fact as far as I am concerned what this idiot is spouting is hate speech and he should be brought up in front of an international court of justice and tried! Ignorance is not an excuse for hatred!

Quite simple for me really. Whilst i believe in free speech, people also have responsibilities. This pastor has actually called for the deaths of people simply because they are gay - to me, that goes way beyond free speech, it is more like a call to action. As such, he is completely guilty of perpetrating a hate crime and should therefore be charged and prosecuted.

reply to post by Shadow Herder


Your point is taken. I would say however it is now "common place" amongst all religions to hate homosexuals. The constant rhetoric is damning. Where are all the good christians who know better? After a while one can quote the bible until the cows come home; if the message is mostly hate, than most religions need to acknowledge it. Rarely do they.

CJ

reply to post by ColoradoJens

Hitler recruited around him homosexuals to make up his stormtroopers, they were his enforces, they were his thugs, and Hitler discovered that he could not get straight soldiers to be savage, and brutal, and vicious enough to carryout his orders, but that homosexual soldiers basically had no limits in the savagery and brutality they were willing to inflict on whoever Hitler sent them after. So he surrounded himself, virtually all of the stormtroopers, the brownshirts, were male homosexuals.

Hahahahahaha. I can't stop laughing, seriously. Granted, the national socialist youth parties (think boyscouts) were reported to be full of aryan gay sex, hitler and the nazis detested homosexuals, so the rest of that is pure fantasy.

Pretty funny though, the gays did the holocaust. What's next? The WTC was attacked by the gay mafia because it was too phallic?

honestly the stretches people will go through to justify bigotry amazes me still.

Originally posted by wiser3
reply to post by GrandHeretic

 

You may be right but I as a gay person would like to point out that I knew I was NOT interested in girls long before I was a teenager. Now you can say that this is impossible because of your assertion that "you are not sexually mature till yer early teens" but I would like you to prove that to me!

I am not gay but grew up with a gay friend. It was obvious he was gay from the time I met him (2nd grade). I didn't know it then, because I couldn't define it, but he was gay the day he was born.

CJ

Originally posted by Flavian
Quite simple for me really. Whilst i believe in free speech, people also have responsibilities. This pastor has actually called for the deaths of people simply because they are gay - to me, that goes way beyond free speech, it is more like a call to action. As such, he is completely guilty of perpetrating a hate crime and should therefore be charged and prosecuted.

We don't do that here anymore. A group recently offered $10,000 for the capture of someone "dead or alive" and it was widely reported in the media. It doesn't get clearer than that, yet no charges. Imagine what two groups that can't tell the difference between a family reunion and a High School prom like this bunch and Westboro Baptist could accomplish together.

reply to post by GrandHeretic


There is NO sexual choice. You are what you are, be it gay, straight or bisexual. You don't decide one day to turn gay from straight or vice versa so please stop pushing that ridiculous notion because you know as well as I do that it is simply false.

Originally posted by Amadeo
reply to post by GrandHeretic

 

There is NO sexual choice. You are what you are, be it gay, straight or bisexual. You don't decide one day to turn gay from straight or vice versa so please stop pushing that ridiculous notion because you know as well as I do that it is simply false.

Great, now that we have that behind us we can start looking for a cure.

As a true Christain this type of stupid verbiage is embarassing to me. Christains (radical idiots) choose to selectively preach a portion of the word, typically for their own benefit. It is written that homsexuality is wrong, also so is sleeping around. I personally believe it is a sin however, I have many gay friends and it is their choice, it is not for me to judge them right or wrong. If christains would only act like christains are supposed too based upon the teachings of Christ, the church and the world would be a much better place.

Originally posted by Amadeo
reply to post by GrandHeretic

 

There is NO sexual choice. You are what you are, be it gay, straight or bisexual. You don't decide one day to turn gay from straight or vice versa so please stop pushing that ridiculous notion because you know as well as I do that it is simply false.

What if everybody is at least a little bit gay? What if homosexuality was a common practice before dogma came on the scene and it is instilled into all of us genetically? Some people just prefer to remain heterosexual, some people are vastly insecure of homosexuality and some people just plain flaunt it everywhere.

Look at bonobos, one of our closest relatives in the animal kingdom:

The bonobo is popularly known for its high levels of sexual behavior. Sex functions in conflict appeasement, affection, social status, excitement, and stress reduction. It occurs in virtually all partner combinations and in a variety of positions. This is a factor in the lower levels of aggression seen in the bonobo when compared to the common chimpanzee and other apes. Bonobos are perceived to be matriarchal; females tend to collectively dominate males by forming alliances and use sexuality to control males. A male's rank in the social hierarchy is often determined by his mother's rank.
Wikipedia - Bonobos

Sexual intercourse plays a major role in bonobo society observed in captivity, being used as what some scientists perceive as a greeting, a means of forming social bonds, a means of conflict resolution, and postconflict reconciliation.

...

The sexual activity happens within the immediate community and sometimes outside of it. Bonobos do not form permanent monogamous sexual relationships with individual partners. They also do not seem to discriminate in their sexual behavior by sex or age, with the possible exception of abstaining from sexual intercourse between mothers and their adult sons. When bonobos come upon a new food source or feeding ground, the increased excitement will usually lead to communal sexual activity, presumably decreasing tension and encouraging peaceful feeding.

If we examine our kin in the animal world, it almost looks like the very reason the world is so conflicted as it is now is because we have become sexually frustrated, dogmatic people.

Bonobo males occasionally engage in various forms of male–male genital behavior.[33][34] In one form, two males hang from a tree limb face-to-face while "penis fencing".[33][35] This also may occur when two males rub their penises together while in face-to-face position. Another form of genital interaction ("rump rubbing") occurs to express reconciliation between two males after a conflict, when they stand back-to-back and rub their scrotal sacs together. Takayoshi Kano observed similar practices among bonobos in the natural habitat.

Bonobo females also engage in female–female genital behavior, possibly to bond socially with each other, thus forming a female nucleus of bonobo society. The bonding among females enables them to dominate bonobo society. Although male bonobos are individually stronger, they cannot stand alone against a united group of females.[33] Adolescent females often leave their native community to join another community. Sexual bonding with other females establishes these new females as members of the group. This migration mixes the bonobo gene pools, providing genetic diversity.

As you can see, some of our closest relatives are apparently voracious homosexuals with no apparent shame about it, then they don't have concepts like religion and whatnot. So this begs a question: If humans did not have dogma, would everybody be gay? (Or bisexual I guess?)

reply to post by DOLCOTT


The point is "It is NOT their choice"!

At no point in my life was I ever faced with the question: "So, do you want to be heterosexual or homosexual?"

Were you?

No, I thought not!

And guess what, if I HAD been asked (knowing what I know now, the hate that I would come up against) I would never have chosen to be homosexual!

But I am at peace with myself, I was accepted by my parents and sister and brother and as far I am concerned they are the only ones that count!