Iraq and Afghanistan veterans to return their medals to protest war on terror at Chicago NATO summit

reply to post by 200Plus

You people who have never been there can never understand. If you had to fear every day that the people in power would kill your sons for no reason, would you want to change that? If your daughters could be raped with impunity by men in power would you want someone to help you? If you lived in a mudhut with dirt floors and your neighbors had a Rolls simply because he was part of the Baath party would you cry out for justice?

Seems like you are talking about america because that is EXACTLY what happens in the USA. If you were really saving us you would be fighting those people who are enabling such in the USA. Do you not realize how much rape happens here in the USA and then people get away with with. How the rich and poor dichotomy in the USA is exactly what you see in those countries overseas.

nor did I suffer them to make other men rich. I did it because someone has too.

Actually Haliburton became very rich with your services. You did it because someone ordered you on behest of controlling Zionist and corporate interests.

I have four deployments in Iraq ranging from 15 months to 9 months each.

Do you feel you made America safer with these deployments, it is after all your job to keep the USA safe ya know..

reply to post by 200Plus
I see people living on dirt floors everyday where I live. I see people everyday getting "raped". I see people everyday getting murdered.

Its on the News in the US of A. It happens everywhere. Is Russia going to come here and liberate us all???? Cant Wait.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by muzzleflash

 

They ddn't fight for a medal. The medal just represents the character they showed in the face of danger.

What they do with it is their business.

It is symbolic, but a false symbolism because the medal doesn't represent the government. It represents their strength.

annnnnnd who was the one who gave the medal?????

Originally posted by QQXXw
Interesting how they choose to act once they have milked their salaries and the all the benefits that the military provided them with.

WTF? Really?

Surely you must be joking. If you are joking, you've got to have the worst sense of humor in the history of humanity.

If you're not joking, then....well......I don't want to say what you are.....

reply to post by hoochymama

I see people living on dirt floors everyday where I live. I see people everyday getting "raped". I see people everyday getting murdered.

Damn.....

And I thought living in Stockton was bad.

reply to post by NightGypsy


What I mean is, I look at the little picture in life. I am not a big picture kinda person.

Did men make billions of dollars through the war machine? Yes they did
Did our politicians lie in order for us to go to war? Yes they did

I myself don't care who makes money or who tells lies, because I ask different questions.

Did I build shelters for battered women who never thought they could have any freedom? Yes I did
Did I build schools so the uneducated children could learn to read? Yes I did
Did I do everything in my power to provide a better life for the "normal" people of Iraq? Yes I did

That is what I see soldiers doing, not all of them by any stretch of the imagination. A soldier is the one guy who sides with the underdog. Putting on a uniform does not make a person a soldier anymore than going into a courtroom makes a person a lawyer. The willingness to sacrifice yourself to defend someone else is what makes a true soldier.

Hope that makes sense, as I tend to ramble.

reply to post by 200Plus


Thanks, 200Plus, I appreciate your honesty and your perspective.....

reply to post by 200Plus

Did I build shelters for battered women who never thought they could have any freedom? Yes I did Did I build schools so the uneducated children could learn to read? Yes I did Did I do everything in my power to provide a better life for the "normal" people of Iraq? Yes I did

Regardless of this fact, you were still a part of an oppressive army who had arms on a very poor nations land. Maybe they did not want education, maybe they did not want to learn to read, maybe those women liked it the way it was and you THINK that what they want is freedom. They do not want the freedom what we think of in the USA.

Look what freedom in the USA has done. Do you see the corruption of the women of America?

Their life revolves around the religion of Islam. Islam means SUBMISSION to God, which is the exact OPPOSITE of freedom. They never desired, nor will the ever be free as long as they are Muslims. Yes they may be more educated (nothing wrong with that), but they will never be free as they are submitting to God

Originally posted by 200Plus
reply to post by NightGypsy

 

What I mean is, I look at the little picture in life. I am not a big picture kinda person.

Did men make billions of dollars through the war machine? Yes they did
Did our politicians lie in order for us to go to war? Yes they did

I myself don't care who makes money or who tells lies, because I ask different questions.

Did I build shelters for battered women who never thought they could have any freedom? Yes I did
Did I build schools so the uneducated children could learn to read? Yes I did
Did I do everything in my power to provide a better life for the "normal" people of Iraq? Yes I did

That is what I see soldiers doing, not all of them by any stretch of the imagination. A soldier is the one guy who sides with the underdog. Putting on a uniform does not make a person a soldier anymore than going into a courtroom makes a person a lawyer. The willingness to sacrifice yourself to defend someone else is what makes a true soldier.

Hope that makes sense, as I tend to ramble.

I am quoting this to show the rest of ATS what sort of soldiers will open fire on U.S civilians if they are ordered to.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL


Sorry to derail the thread.

I have never claimed that I fought in Iraq to defend America. The only time I ever said "I have a nation to defend" is when my ex-wife called me at work.

Like I said, I don't care who made money off what I have done. Haliburton has made millions off every tax payer in America so I hardly hold the blame for funding that company.

How long were you in Iraq? I agree that a majority are muslim, but not all. I met people there that were sects of christians I have never even heard of in America. Syrian orthodox, greek orthodox, babtist, even jehova witnesses.

Originally posted by QQXXw

Originally posted by 200Plus
reply to post by NightGypsy

 

What I mean is, I look at the little picture in life. I am not a big picture kinda person.

Did men make billions of dollars through the war machine? Yes they did
Did our politicians lie in order for us to go to war? Yes they did

I myself don't care who makes money or who tells lies, because I ask different questions.

Did I build shelters for battered women who never thought they could have any freedom? Yes I did
Did I build schools so the uneducated children could learn to read? Yes I did
Did I do everything in my power to provide a better life for the "normal" people of Iraq? Yes I did

That is what I see soldiers doing, not all of them by any stretch of the imagination. A soldier is the one guy who sides with the underdog. Putting on a uniform does not make a person a soldier anymore than going into a courtroom makes a person a lawyer. The willingness to sacrifice yourself to defend someone else is what makes a true soldier.

Hope that makes sense, as I tend to ramble.

I am quoting this to show the rest of ATS what sort of soldiers will open fire on U.S civilians if they are ordered to.

What? Are you trying to say you believe this ATS member I was replying to would open fire on civilians? I hope not.

If that's what you're saying, I wholeheartedly disagree with you.

reply to post by QQXXw


You are entitled to your opinion bro.

And I am a veteran now. Retired six months ago so no more orders for me.

I have no earthly idea how you can judge that I would "fire on civilians", so I won't even argue about that with you.

reply to post by NightGypsy


people like that are disillusioned enough to think that bombing the crap out of one of the most progressive countries in the middle east was "siding with the underdog"

I returned mine within months of leaving the Royal Navy. I'm embarrassed to tell my friends this as they wouldnt understand, but the main reason I left was because I got hugely disillusioned with our actual aims. On one of my final deployments to the gulf of oman we got a radio call that a cruise ship was being attacked by Somali pirates near the gulf of aden. At the time we were literally just sitting there in the sea just watching the two huge oil rigs there but anyway, the skipper did his business over the radio back home to see if they'd let us go to the rescue. Basically they said no and we were to remain on task. Looking around there were around 5 other warships from different navies of the world doing the same as us and more beyond visual range but either way, definitely enough to pick up our share of doing naff all. They were basically saying we were to continue pointlessly watching the oil rigs instead of going to the aid of thousands of people on that ship. Three days later I submitted my 1 years notice and returned my campaign medals shortly after I left. I know this isnt quite the war on terror but it was all the proof I needed that all 'they' cared about was oil and money rather the reasons they tell you when you join up (fight for queen and country, your flag and defend the realm blah blah blah and yes, I joined up at 16 years old and was incredibly naive). Dont get me wrong, Im fiercely proud of serving and will be til the day I die, but mainly because of those I served with. Those medals just said to me 'Thanks for helping us get richer'.

My point being, fair play to these fella's. I for one am with them all the way.

edit; Just to clarify, I am aware we may or not have got there in time, my point is surely it was worth trying.

I had a couple of friends pass away for nothing, so I hope they can make a difference. I thought NATO was suppose to be heavily guarded like in riot gear and all? I wonder how this will pan out. Guess will wait and see in 3 days. I hope it doesn't get ugly.

RIP Dutch
RIP Daniel

It's not like it never happened before.

These are Vietnam vets. Not sure if John Kerry is in this particular clip but he was also a protesting vet back in the day. How the world turns...

reply to post by 200Plus


I'm not sure which soldier you are referring, the one was a gunner atop a humvee going out on patrols looking for IEDs, that's gotta be one of the more dangerous jobs out there. And supply routes were among the heaviest to be targeted to those soldiers bringing supplies through saw a lot of action - don't know why you feel this makes him less deserving of respect than any other soldier.

I have been doing this for a few years. Well, not exactly that specifically. Used to get yelled at in the Corps when I showed up wearing only my good cookie, my nam, and my sea service. I refuse to even wear the Nat def medal which is the first one you get for serving during a time of war. I don't believe in this "war" or accept the "awards" for being a part of it. In the Air Force reserve, however, I have yet to be called out on it. People ask, but when I explain, they understand

reply to post by Jakes51


According to one of the sites I linked to, the main medal being thrown back at the NATO elites is the Global War on Terrorism Medal, which G.W. Bush invented to glorify his invented war.



And the reason they are returning them now, and not "waiting for time to heal all wounds" as you put it, is to protest the insanity that is this war. If they wait, then they may as well not protest at all, and just lay down like good little sheep and do the elite's bidding, no questions asked.

This is a fantastic idea! If it were me, i would be supporting this. Materialistic things mean nothing in a broken world. Taking a step back and looking at the bigger picture is what needs to be done. I'll drink to that sir!