Viewing child pornography online not a crime: New York court ruling

Originally posted by The Old American
reply to post by libertytoall

 

It's exactly like legalizing drugs. Don't prosecute the people taking them, prosecute the people selling or making them. Viewing child porn and distributing child porn are two entirely different animals. A viewer needs help, a distributor/maker needs a bullet.

/TOA

But like drugs maybe trafficking in them wouldn't be so widespread if there wasn't the drug addicts.

Porn is like any other addiction .

And what about these online predators, they watch the child porn and then act on it.

I don't care for this topic since I was a victim .

Makes me want to puke actually.

It would take a matter of MINUTES for the authorities so determine whether a user was actually 'searching' for child porn, or accidentally coming across it. It's not rocket science.

reply to post by petrus4


The list of others you will side with is one thing, however, I would never say "to hell with protecting children".

The way this is done, must be fixed ASAP. The way its been used so anyone with a cookie on their machine, (and those are often planted by virus's put out by TPTB) could easily be changed by SIMPLE REWORDING to proof of actual intentional veiwing, in other words proof beyond cookies of things that could be virus or accidental is needed.


BUT CHILDREN MUST BE PROTECTED!!!!!!!!!!

reply to post by Stormdancer777


For the sake of consistency if you're going to take the "viewers become actors" approach then you'd have to take the position that all pornography, even all risque imagery, should be criminalized.

I suppose if we were to conclude that all images defined as "child pornography" were depictions of assaults, rape, molestation, etc... then we could make a clearer connection for the "viewers become actors" theory.

Such a clear definition is not the case however. Depending on the authorities involved a picture of your naked infant taking a bath in the sink is pornography. Right now there's a poor guy in prison because of a manga collection that was decided to be "child pornography."

I'm not in any way excusing the material or trying to argue that it isnt sick but this vaguely defined and heavyhanded way enforcement steamrolls over lives because of the sesative and emotionally charged nature of the subject matter is a terrible injustice not only to the people who have been sent up river but to the victims as well.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

For the sake of consistency if you're going to the the "viewers become actors" approach then you'd have to take the position that all pornography, even all risque imagery, should be criminalized. I suppose if we were to conclude that all images defined as "child pornography" were depictions of assaults, rape, molestation, etc...

BS.

Simple BS.

Pedophiles derserve to be prosecuted.

Child porn is Sexual assault against the child, they can not consent to these images being taken of them, YES its rape and Molestation...

By viewing these images you are driving up the demand...

The argument that its like drugs is wrong, as buying a dub sack from your local dealer does not mean a child rape took place for you to get your drugs.

The responses to this thread are disturbing to say the least, the sheer number of people who think its okay to "view" child porn disgust me.

And hiding pedophilia behind freedom of speech, or first amendment, or any other excuse is just that an EXCUSE.

They can have reasonable laws for this, and the people saying they get child porn randomly are talking out their ass. Ive had internet since my first computer with internet was in the late 80s.

I grew up with Internet as an adolescent male, and looked at every porn you could possibly find, even newsgroups back in the day before the web, AND NOT ONCE DID I ACCIDENTALLY STUMBLE ON CHILD PORN.

I Know enough about technology and the internet to know I am not going to accidentally stumble on it.


YOU know where you are when this # pops up, and you know you shouldn't be there, Besides the rare case this isn't just happening everyday, people accidentally having caches full of CP.

YOu know if I was a pedo I might use the virus excuse too when caught.

Reply to post by benrl

You're right. They can have reasonable laws for this. But they don't. And that's what I thought this thread was about.

Interesting observation of all the caps and typos in your post points to your opinion coming from an emotional place. A reactionary place.

Those are not the basis for reasonable laws.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by boncho


What are you searching for Boncho??

google search

tiny bottoms (was looking for a bathing suit for the old lady....oops)
kid rides (forgot to put in the amusement park....dam)
child sex education (crap should have left child out of that one....)

I mean seriously.....I have been using the internet for years upon years and NEVER once just happened to stumble upon a kiddy porn site.....Just sayin

reply to post by benrl

Pedophiles derserve to be prosecuted.

Only if they cause harm to actual child. Being a pedophile should not be a crime. Only pedophilic acts involving actual real children should be.

No victim, no crime. Period. The specific act of looking at CP does not objectively cause any harm. Making and distribution yes, but not simple viewing.

By viewing these images you are driving up the demand...

No. Maybe by buying them. Simple viewing does nothing, and so posessing them on the hard drive (without sharing them).

The argument that its like drugs is wrong, as buying a dub sack from your local dealer does not mean a child rape took place for you to get your drugs.

Took. In the past. Those who view the images do not cause the rape, unless they travel in time to make it happen.

CP is not crime in itself. Its merely evidence of a past crime. Should pictures of murder be also banned? Thats even worse crime than sexual abuse, and its completely legal to possess images of it.

The responses to this thread are disturbing to say the least, the sheer number of people who think its okay to "view" child porn disgust me.

I am disgusted by people who think victimless acts should be criminalised.

I grew up with Internet as an adolescent male, and looked at every porn you could possibly find, even newsgroups back in the day before the web, AND NOT ONCE DID I ACCIDENTALLY STUMBLE ON CHILD PORN.

Consider yourself lucky. Others were not so lucky..

Legalizing child pornography is linked to lower rates of child sex abuse
Study carried out in Czech Republic confirms similar results in Japan and Denmark

Could making child pornography legal lead to lower rates of child sex abuse? It could well do, according to a new study by Milton Diamond, from the University of Hawaii, and colleagues. Results from the Czech Republic showed, as seen everywhere else studied (Canada, Croatia, Denmark, Germany, Finland, Hong Kong, Shanghai, Sweden, USA), that rape and other sex crimes have not increased following the legalization and wide availability of pornography. And most significantly, the incidence of child sex abuse has fallen considerably since 1989, when child pornography became readily accessible – a phenomenon also seen in Denmark and Japan. Their findings are published online today in Springer’s journal Archives of Sexual Behavior. The findings support the theory that potential sexual offenders use child pornography as a substitute for sex crimes against children. While the authors do not approve of the use of real children in the production or distribution of child pornography, they say that artificially produced materials might serve a purpose.

Thoughts?

www.springer.com...

The ACLU’s position is this: criminalize the production but legalize the sale and distribution of child pornography.

www.stoptheaclu.com...

Isn't this really about CACHED images (temp files auto saved for faster loading/browsing) versus SAVED images that the user deliberately saves to a hard drive (that would involve concious intent)?

reply to post by benrl

The responses to this thread are disturbing to say the least, the sheer number of people who think its okay to "view" child porn disgust me.

And hiding pedophilia behind freedom of speech, or first amendment, or any other excuse is just that an EXCUSE.

I believe The legalization of pedophilia isn't to far off.

Originally posted by libertytoall
Legalizing child pornography is linked to lower rates of child sex abuse
Study carried out in Czech Republic confirms similar results in Japan and Denmark

Could making child pornography legal lead to lower rates of child sex abuse? It could well do, according to a new study by Milton Diamond, from the University of Hawaii, and colleagues. Results from the Czech Republic showed, as seen everywhere else studied (Canada, Croatia, Denmark, Germany, Finland, Hong Kong, Shanghai, Sweden, USA), that rape and other sex crimes have not increased following the legalization and wide availability of pornography. And most significantly, the incidence of child sex abuse has fallen considerably since 1989, when child pornography became readily accessible – a phenomenon also seen in Denmark and Japan. Their findings are published online today in Springer’s journal Archives of Sexual Behavior. The findings support the theory that potential sexual offenders use child pornography as a substitute for sex crimes against children. While the authors do not approve of the use of real children in the production or distribution of child pornography, they say that artificially produced materials might serve a purpose.

Thoughts?

www.springer.com...

edit on 10-5-2012 by libertytoall because: (no reason given)

The ACLU’s position is this: criminalize the production but legalize the sale and distribution of child pornography.

www.stoptheaclu.com...

edit on 10-5-2012 by libertytoall because: (no reason given)

OH!
WELL!
There you have it.

I hadn't read your post when I posted my above post.

What the hell!

Not a crime?

Paul Harvey was right.

That is the most corrupt sickest ruling i have ever heard about.

Going after the consumers of pornography is like going after the consumers of drugs. It will only ensure more people in jail/prison. more money for the courts, more police time directed away from real criminals...

Jail the people who PRODUCE the stuff, or decriminalize it all together.. but jailing the consumer is just more prison industrial complex.

Ridiculous

But legal or not if you find out someone who is doing this it is your duty to break his face!!!!

reply to post by libertytoall


Completely disagree, it is already bad enough for the victim of abuse, distributing it freely is just rubbing salt in to the wound imo. I remember a thread on ATS quite a while ago talking about some type of Japanese cartoon porn, and how it may do what your source described, which is ultimately reduce the number of victims of child abuse, considering that would completely sidestep there being any real people/victims involved that seems like a better idea to push?

How many men have been set up, ruined, etc. by their soon-to-be-ex gold-digging wives for viewing child porn? All it takes is for some biotch to google kiddie porn on hubby's 'puter and he's a sexual predator for life. And not just divorces but in any situation where someone is out to ruin someone else for whatever reason. It's definitely a catch-22, put this is probably a good law. There are too many low-lifes out to ruin people just to steal their money or for some other personal vendetta.

I cant not imagine there is too much child porn actually on the net.
I think its a myth......the only people viewing it online are through p2p sites direct from one computer to another. Its why they get caught.

This Child porn thing is blown way out of hand and I do not think there is even 1/10th of the stuff they pretend there is.

Where does all this alleged child porn come from? From people who make it for themselves most likely and share with people in their little rings.

ITs all a con as I have never accidentally found myself on a child porn site ever!!! and I do go on normal porn sites like xhamster and xvideos.

I think its BS!!!!!

reply to post by ModernAcademia



Doing what?

Looking or creating?

If i found out about someone creating CP to his/hers
own or someone elses, they would be in for a WIIIILD
ride. With a bad outcome.

But looking at it on computer, magazine, paperpicture
wouldnt make me "Break their face". But i would be VEERRY
careful letting my own kids play with theirs...If at all...