Student's 'Jesus' shirt sparks feud with school

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by discordantone

Do you not see the contradiction between being against Christians trying (and failing) to ban pro-homosexual t-shirts and being for non-Christians trying (and succeeding) to ban pro-Christian t-shirts?

NO!

Religion is a personal belief. It is a choice.

Homosexuality is a birth right of a minority group that is being denied equality.

So you would vehemently support pro-gay shirts and ban pro-Christian shirts...and your excuse is because religion is a choice but homosexuality is not.

Since when does right to expression/speech require your opinion to be innate or congenital? By your logic I shouldn't be wearing pro-gay marriage T-shirts...as I am not gay it is a personal belief, a choice in my opinion.

You simply hate and don't want Christians to have any rights, since they are one of the strongest anti-gay entities...pure and simple. The very equality you so strongly wish gays had you equally wish Christians lose.

Originally posted by DrChuck

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by discordantone

Do you not see the contradiction between being against Christians trying (and failing) to ban pro-homosexual t-shirts and being for non-Christians trying (and succeeding) to ban pro-Christian t-shirts?

NO!

Religion is a personal belief. It is a choice.

Homosexuality is a birth right of a minority group that is being denied equality.

So you would vehemently support pro-gay shirts and ban pro-Christian shirts...and your excuse is because religion is a choice but homosexuality is not.

Gays are a minority group being denied equal rights.

Even in the argument of Prop 8 - - - religious belief could not be used as a valid argument.

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by artistpoet

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by lucid eyes

Originally posted by Annee

I support political - sports - music - interests - etc.

As long as they are not accompanied with an inflammatory message.

So you would ban a school sports team from playing if any of its team members used foul language?

We are talking about what is printed on a shirt.

No we are not talking it about really - So how is one's life wasted if one does not believe in Jesus should be discussed in class and all views should be allowed

I am 100% separation of church and state. Which includes public school.

So - - NO religion of any kind belongs in a public school curriculum.

You want religion - - choose your church.

You may be 100% for something but you are not 100% everyone
All things should be discussed - spirituality and philosophy is a part of life and to relegate that as of no importance is fascism by the back door
All things in life are the things we should discuss in school
I am non religious so does that mean All Religion should not be discussed
You are simply reacting rather than discussing what needs to be discussed in order to gain understanding
Like I said - If a Kid comes to school wearing a statement of belief and others disagree with that then it should be discussed rather than banned
And what is State by the way - is that truly discussed or is the official version indoctrinated onto the kids

Originally posted by artistpoet


You may be 100% for something but you are not 100% everyone
All things should be discussed - spirituality and philosophy is a part of life and to relegate that as of no importance is fascism by the back door

I am not telling you what to do or support.

I DO NOT support religion in public high school. PERIOD!

College is elective. I have no problem with comparative religion in college - - as most students are legal adult (or close to it). It is their choice.

I do not see philosophy as religion.

Philosophy is the study of general and fundamental problems, such as those connected with existence, knowledge, values, reason, mind, and language. Philosophy is distinguished from other ways of addressing such problems by its critical, generally systematic approach and its reliance on rational argument. The word "philosophy" comes from the Greek φιλοσοφία (philosophia), which literally means "love of wisdom". en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by Annee



Proposition 8 is disgusting and stupid in all levels of hell. But it doesn't mean Christians should be denied a simple right of expression. And being denied equal rights should not grant "special rights" privileges that others cannot also enjoy, especially a fundamental right of speech/expression.

reply to post by Annee

I am 100% separation of church and state. Which includes public school.

So - - NO religion of any kind belongs in a public school curriculum.

You want religion - - choose your church.

This issue has absolutely nothing to do with "separation of church and state"!

The issue in question is this student's right to "freedom of expression" in a Canadian public school. Are you for it, against it, or do you feel this basic right should be limited by, and to, certain individuals?

See ya,
Milt

reply to post by Annee

So if Philosophy is "Love of Wisdom" then that has nothing to do with spirituality.
Religion is a tool to address the age old questions of such but should be held up to scrutiny.
Kids should be allowed to think for themselves the only value any teacher has is to guide them in this.
"Oh Johnny so I see your by your T shirt you think life without Jesus is wasted, Care to explain to class why you think that is so" ...........then............... "Class what do you think about Johnny's statement of belief"
Kids are taught to be parrots and slaves to others ideas rather than employ their own critical thinking.

Originally posted by artistpoet

Kids should be allowed to think for themselves the only value any teacher has is to guide them in this.

This is getting ridiculous.

Kids can have all the religion they want. They can choose to go to whatever church they want - - or not. They can believe the same as their parents or not. They can discuss it with their friends and/or in church - - or with their parents.

They don't need to have it in high school to have independent thought and think for themselves.

Religion does not have to or need to be every where.

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by artistpoet

Kids should be allowed to think for themselves the only value any teacher has is to guide them in this.

This is getting ridiculous.

Kids can have all the religion they want. They can choose to go to whatever church they want - - or not. They can believe the same as their parents or not. They can discuss it with their friends and/or in church - - or with their parents.

They don't need to have it in high school to have independent thought and think for themselves.

Religion does not have to or need to be every where.

Religion is a part of life for millions and is everywhere.
I say it should be discussed - I am not saying saying it should be preached and there lays the difference.
To deny or ban does not make the problem go away it merely outcasts and causes resentment that confirms true or false facts -
So far the only solution forwarded is censorship
What else should be banned from school discussion?
Should we also ban such subjects from ATS

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by discordantone

Do you not see the contradiction between being against Christians trying (and failing) to ban pro-homosexual t-shirts and being for non-Christians trying (and succeeding) to ban pro-Christian t-shirts?

NO!

Religion is a personal belief. It is a choice.

Homosexuality is a birth right of a minority group that is being denied equality.

Homosexuality is a sexual orientation.

However being pro-homosexual (gay marriage, shirts etc.) is a personal belief and a choice just as religion is. Both OPINIONS should be treated similarly by law and state regulation. If you agree with a ban on pro-christian shirt, then make no mistake, there is no legitimate or objective reason why the same should not apply to controversial pro-gay shirt. Both are just opinions, and I am saying this as someone who supports gay marriage. Dont you think you are a bit hypocritical in this regard?

Originally posted by DrChuck
You simply hate and don't want Christians to have any rights, since they are one of the strongest anti-gay entities...pure and simple. The very equality you so strongly wish gays had you equally wish Christians lose.

A pro-gay shirt does not propose "I'm right and you're not" The shirt in question made that statement about Christianity. Pro-gay messages are generally about tolerance. "A day without Jesus is a day wasted" is most decidedly not.

Like I said, the good Lord above never said "Thou Shalt Not Think".

reply to post by Annee

Would you have been OK if the kid had worn a shirt that had "Gay Pride" boldly emblazoned on the front and back?
Are you OK with "Alternative Lifestyles" being taught in schools?
Are you still mad at me?

See ya,
Milt

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck

A pro-gay shirt does not propose "I'm right and you're not" The shirt in question made that statement about Christianity. Pro-gay messages are generally about tolerance. "A day without Jesus is a day wasted" is most decidedly not.

What if the shirt said "Life is a Waste without Gay Sex"? After all, it's only fair to compare "apples to apples", and not "apples to oranges". I have seen similar shirts!

See ya,
Milt

reply to post by technical difficulties


Not everyone who believes in global warming believes the Gaia hypothesis, but it is definitely a big part of the concept. Some people who believe the theory of global warming maybe just never heard the part about Gaia, but I have definitely seen it around. But an important point here is that while schools are suspending kids wearing t shirts sporting the name of Jesus and anything else related to the Christian religion, and Christianity in general has been eliminated from school campus on the grounds it is religious, the Global Warming theory proponents believe in something involving a pagan goddess and attaching some "scientific" theory to a religious teaching. You would be wrong if you think it hasn't gone global. It is very much involved in the UN and the World Council of Churches.

And yes the Global Warming theory of religion is being preached in the public schools.
www.globalwarmingclassroom.info...

Originally posted by BenReclused
reply to post by JohnnyCanuck

 

A pro-gay shirt does not propose "I'm right and you're not" The shirt in question made that statement about Christianity. Pro-gay messages are generally about tolerance. "A day without Jesus is a day wasted" is most decidedly not.

What if the shirt said "Life is a Waste without Gay Sex"? After all, it's only fair to compare "apples to apples", and not "apples to oranges". I have seen similar shirts!

I ain't seen that'un! If so, I would consider it to be ironic, not meant to diminish another. Certainly not appropriate for school. Kind of funny, though.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
But an important point here is that while schools are suspending kids wearing t shirts sporting the name of Jesus and anything else related to the Christian religion...

That certainly isn't the issue at hand and you are being disingenuous to suggest otherwise. We are talking about one shirt, one kid, Nova Scotia. Anything else is another argument and should not be mixed with this one.

Well if he wants to continue wearing that shirt, then let him. I would just be amused to see how he, and other Christians/Catholics, would react if someone wore the Cradle of Filth shirt that has "Jesus is a c*nt" on it to the School. There would be a public outcry about it. But that's because so many people that follow an organised religion are intolerant.

what about the kids that wear the satanic Baphomet star shirts? they never got in trouble when i was in school..

Originally posted by Starchild23
reply to post by Annee

 

Hold on. Religion is an innate part of our country...our country was founded based upon Christianity. Christianity plays a key role in a huge part of our history. Religion plays a key role in the whole world.

I tend to agree with a lot of what you say but this is complete BS. America was founded on a secular document, the Constitution, and does not appeal to any God, Christianity, Jesus, or other supreme deity. If you need a reference, just read the preamble.

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck

I ain't seen that'un! If so, I would consider it to be ironic, not meant to diminish another. Certainly not appropriate for school. Kind of funny, though.

I got a kick out of your answer!

I don't feel the phrase "Life is a Waste without Christ" is any more, or any less, inflammatory than "Life is a Waste without Gay Sex". In all fairness, they should both be regarded in the same way... as a form self expression.

See ya,
Milt

Originally posted by artistpoet

Religion is a part of life for millions and is everywhere.

And it is a hateful pain-in-the-neck for millions more.

Religion does not need to be everywhere.

High school kids have enough going on - - they can leave religion at the door for these few hours a day.