I am an Orthodox Christian and Historian; Almost Everything Most Know About The Church is False

reply to post by arpgme


Jesus is also "The Son of Man". Jesus is the only begotten son. You are correct, we are all children of God, however we were all made through the process of sexual reproduction,but Christ was begotten before anything existed through God's uncreated energies making him of one essence with God, OUR Father.

Originally posted by arpgme
If Jesus is the only son of God, why does he tell us to pray "OUR father thou art in heaven?" Surely, we should be saying "Father of Jesus thou are in heaven"...

Paslms 82:6 "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High."

1 John 3:1 "Behold, what manner of love the Father has bestowed on us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knows us not, because it knew him not."

Dude, my bible (New Jerusalem) Psalms 82:6-7 "I had a thought, "Are you gods, are all of you sons of the Most High?
No! you will die as human beings do, as one man, princes, you will fall."

reply to post by sad_eyed_lady


Your bible is a mistranslation from what was originally written. It was NOT a question in Hebrew.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike


Oh, I understand your point of view now.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike


Thank you, but I think I will pass on the conversion offer. You can set me straight when I am wrong. I have great respect for the Greek Orthodox faith. I have noticed all the beautiful icons of Our Lady from your Church, so I know your Church also has great respect and honor for Mary. Many people here do not understand devotion to Mary and believe we worship her. You just can not seem to pound it into their heads that we do not believe she is God or his equal, only human, but the most special human IMO because she was chosen to be Mother of God.

reply to post by arpgme


So, do you believe you are a God?

I don't.

Originally posted by windword


Interesting stuff! I was researching the beginnings and inner workings of the Mormon church and stumbled onto so much Masonry symbolism and rhetoric, I almost fell off my computer chair! The ironic thing is, The Book of Mormon, condemns secret societies and secret combinations something like 58 times!

Mormons changed the Bible, therefore taking scripture away, and also adding to it. This is very wrong, and God will judge harshly consequently. Rev.22:18-19 "18For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

19And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book."

reply to post by sad_eyed_lady


Except Catholics pray to Mary, do they not? Therefore making her an idol.

Originally posted by windword
Interesting stuff! I was researching the beginnings and inner workings of the Mormon church and stumbled onto so much Masonry symbolism and rhetoric, I almost fell off my computer chair! The ironic thing is, The Book of Mormon, condemns secret societies and secret combinations something like 58 times!

OK, this is WAY too creepy, you just described what I found after researching Orthodox Masonry symbolism. Just like you found with the Mormon's, I read that the Orthodox Church condemns Masonry, yet the very same triangle and horus eye symbols that are found in most Mormon and Catholic buildings seem to be plastered all over Orthodox buildings.

Honestly not trying to bash Mike or his church here, the handle "TruthSeekerMike" to me says a LOT, someone who is seeking the truth. I respect that because that has been ME for the last six months. Everything I have been studying tells me that ALL mainline denominational churchs have been infiltrated. Saw this just a while ago:

"I am convinced that many Baptist churches are NOW pastored by Jesuits"

My question to Mike is why would they NOT go after the Orthodox churchs? Like yourself I am after the truth and have been studying this for a while now.

Here are some of the articles that really got my attention:

"Patriarch Bartholomew was seen on a jet airliner in his going to meeting attire, wearing his “Mason Suit” complete with necktie (Freemasons are required to wear a suit and tie to their meetings, but Orthodox rules forbid clergy to do this). Neckties are noted as being a noose, something that Judas (who betrayed Christ with a kiss) was know for using." LINK

"The Black Pope’s ubiquitous Society of Jesus completely controls the Eastern Orthodox Patriarch of Constantinople. Clearly, Bartholomew I was groomed by the Jesuit Papacy to be its agent in the east. According to his wikipedia entry here, his treason to the Eastern Orthodox peoples is obvious" LINK

In 1999 I read the bible cover to cover while considering it "fiction". On that basis it told a good version of earth history. While the fear based rulers were out of control - and ever since that lie about nudity in the garden... OMG what a mess.

Then came Jesus and restored hope to humanity - in the story - and better. He transformed the story into my heart like Superman, Johnathan E, Howard Roark, all in one. But then after the 4 books about him the pharasees started with more fear and guidlines for us vs them situations to build the church.

I was left with the sense that "Satan can't help but do God's work" (my own phrase).

After that, and a set of "paranormal experiences" in 1994 (birth of "spirit"), I was left with a sense of "Ok what do I 'live for'". In other words I already had an athiest's sense of morality, all the pagan/other spirit-books for hmmmm, but found Jesus to be the ultimate super-hero. One I could do my best to follow and be like. And as I tried it (1999) I found good feedback in it and it became more than a way of life. It became "faith".

The history of the bible and its production is as corrupt as it gets - but read like fiction and applied to life JESUS IS THE KING! Jesus is cool!

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Originally posted by TruthSeekerMike
reply to post by wildtimes

 

I was an avowed atheist because of all the corruption in the Catholic Church and the glaring divisions and convoluted theories in the Protestant Church. I had read the Bible myself and was corrected anytime I brought up things that were obviously there or, in some cases, not there at all. As an historian, I love knowledge and research, but unfortunately as a conditioned member of this society, I often used to find myself accepting the big lies even while exposing or studying the small ones. When I began looking into why the secret societies have such a problem with Christianity and simultaneously run it, I found a whole new world of information that changed my life.
I have a BA in Anthropology and History and contribute to documentary films and independent research projects.
I hope to put all this into book form one day. I find it fascinating.

Before reading the bible I read over 500 other books including The Satanic Bible by Anton Levey as well as all the Alister Crowley books at the book store. And while reading the bible - it was plain as day that most of it had that fear-based motivation along with the hunger for power. The most contemporary example of it i saw was Toohee from the Ayn Rand novel Fountainhead. (I read all the Rand books too - and liked them, I integrate them with my "Christian values").

Anyway, yea - going around organized religion churches - 99% of them are false teaching and really annoy me. I do my best to sit there respectfully and usually read the whole books that are the subject of the sermon - but again and again it gets so fake and so cultish it becomes time to go - even to shake the dust off of my feat. The first and the worse of that sort was a Catholic church where I saw the teaching of Gay-hate which had been bullied on me when I was too young to even know what it was. Just a little bit of skew creates a whole lot of damage when its given with that much authority in a manor that's that widespread. What the parents fear the kids clobber.





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Originally posted by DominusIlluminatioMea
... changed the Bible, therefore taking scripture away, and also adding to it. This is very wrong, and God will judge harshly consequently. Rev.22:18-19 "18For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

The bible became popular in the frontier of the USA because of the nice paper - it was better toilet paper than Sears and Robuck's cattalogues.

And holding that statement too close essentially IDOLIZES the book in its form that you read. There's no room for translations, or even E=mC^2.

So while I enjoy the Rev- passages, I do think that being too "legalistic" in your interpretation is more dangerous than the literal translation of that perticular passage. YOU SHOULD RIP THAT PAGE OUT AND WIPE WITH IT!

reply to post by sad_eyed_lady


We share the same great love for Mary. Funny that so many protestant bible thumpers read, "all generations shall call me blessed" but almost seem to despise Mary. One guy told me once that Mary didn't do anything but do what God told her, I told yep, YES! that's a huge thing!
Mary was the first Christian and I love her too.

And the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father, not the Father and the Son.

I don't understand something here.

What about the holy trinity? Is that just strictly a Catholic belief?

Originally posted by DominusIlluminatioMea
reply to post by sad_eyed_lady

 

Except Catholics pray to Mary, do they not? Therefore making her an idol.

I don't know about Catholics, but we Orthodox call Mary into remembrance often and ask for her prayers. Mary is the matriarch of Christianity and keeping her memory eternal is just like remembering any great family member. Just because people get the impression that some might take the wrong approach to Mary doesn't make Mary and less blessed or worthy of great admiration and thought. I am personally glad to have Mary echoing my prayers in Heaven. I think she's more glorious and honorable that the angels, who were quick to remind people to not worship anyone but God.

reply to post by itsallmaya


Not at all. The Roman Catholics changed the essence of the trinity by adding one word, "filioque" (and the Son). This is the traditional and unchanged Christian view of the Trinity:
"I believe in one God, Father Almighty, Creator of
heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of
God, begotten of the Father before all ages;
Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten,
not created, of one essence with the Father
through Whom all things were made.
Who for us men and for our salvation
came down from heaven and was incarnate
of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary and became man.
He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate,
and suffered and was buried;
And He rose on the third day,
according to the Scriptures.
He ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father;
And He will come again with glory to judge the living
and dead. His kingdom shall have no end.
And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Creator of life,
Who proceeds from the Father (this is where the Roman cult added "filioque"), Who together with the
Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified, Who
spoke through the prophets.

reply to post by reitze


If you had found Orthodoxy, you'd feel much better about it all. "The book that was the subject of the sermon". Does that sound like worship or school? I used to think organized religion was terrible because it's just a (usually bad) lecture by some guy who everybody sits quietly and listens to. How could anyone in their right mind feel they are getting closer to God by listening to some guy babble about what he thinks rather than opening our hearts to God and experiencing the beauty of His presence in the Heavenly worship.
I need to work on my communication skills because so far no one has quite gotten the fact that in large part they have NEVER been to or seen an actual Church or worship service. They think it's all whatever somebody comes up with because that's all we've ever known as Christianity--I'm here to tell you, THAT'S THE BIG CONSPIRACY!! The Roman Catholic Church and the Secret Societies have been successful in not only keeping people from the true faith, but also in confusing them about what a true faith would even look like. What they don't mention and most don't realize is that the Orthodox faith has not changed one bit in 2000 years, same songs, same prayers, same communion, everything. It is the one and only Christian Church, all others are "playing church".

Originally posted by TruthSeekerMike
Please ask questions because I think I can help clear up a lot of misunderstandings about God, Christianity, the Church, Christ's teachings and many other aspects ....

You want questions? Sure ... I'll ask ...

1 - HOW is this not something that should be in the off topic religion forum? The amount of preaching of your interpretation of scripture as 'truth' in your opening post deems this as something that should be in that forum instead - IMHO.

2 - HOW on earth can you say that you can clear up misunderstandings about God, Christianity, The Church, Christs teachings, etc. All you have is your interpretation of scripture and your interpretation of history - history that may or may not be accurate. For 2,000 years, minds greater than ours have tried to unravel the mysteries of God and have been unable to do so .. even though they claim to have been able to do so, and yet all the while they contradicted each other. So tell us .. how is it that your interpretation is the real one and the others through out the millenia are false?

Originally posted by DominusIlluminatioMea
Except Catholics pray to Mary, do they not? Therefore making her an idol.

:shk: Catholics do not worship Mary. People really need to read the Catechism ...
Catholic Answers - everything Catholics believe about Mary
Catechism of the Catholic Church - "Worship belongs to God alone"

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by TruthSeekerMike
Please ask questions because I think I can help clear up a lot of misunderstandings about God, Christianity, the Church, Christ's teachings and many other aspects ....

You want questions? Sure ... I'll ask ...

1 - HOW is this not something that should be in the off topic religion forum? The amount of preaching of your interpretation of scripture as 'truth' in your opening post deems this as something that should be in that forum instead - IMHO.

2 - HOW on earth can you say that you can clear up misunderstandings about God, Christianity, The Church, Christs teachings, etc. All you have is your interpretation of scripture and your interpretation of history - history that may or may not be accurate. For 2,000 years, minds greater than ours have tried to unravel the mysteries of God and have been unable to do so .. even though they claim to have been able to do so, and yet all the while they contradicted each other.

So tell us .. how is it that your interpretation is the real one and the others through out the millenia are false?

I clearly explain why it's in the Conspiracies category, because it is a conspiracy to keep people from knowing that there really is an unbroken chain of truth that is solid as a rock.

I'm not sharing MY interpretation of anything. I'm sharing the interpretation that has existed since the early days. It is clear in both scripture and writings from the early Christian world. I can claim that other interpretations are false because they are not what Christ left on this Earth. He actually instructed his Apostles in "the Way" and that way has continued unchanged and unbroken in the Orthodox Church and only the Orthodox Church because it was the only Church Christ ever started. Do you see how this is not opinion or interpretation? It's history that can be researched and proved in countless ways. I'm here to expose a conspiracy not express my opinions.

Originally posted by TruthSeekerMike
it is a conspiracy to keep people from knowing that there really is an unbroken chain of truth that is solid as a rock.

Um .... no. This thread is your version of 'truth' It's your opinion. It's your interpretation. .

I'm not sharing MY interpretation of anything. I'm sharing the interpretation that has existed since the early days.

You are sharing ONE OF MANY interpretations that have been around for hundreds of years. It is your OPINION that it is the correct one. Your claims that it is correct are no better than anyone else's claims that the version they have embraced is correct.

I can claim that other interpretations are false because they are not what Christ left on this Earth.

That's your opinion. That's your interpretation. Your 'proof' is subjective. All sorts of groups claim that they are the ones that have the remnant truth from Christ. Hundreds of groups ... all absolutely sure they are the only ones who 'get it'. Each one contradicts the other.

reply to post by FlyersFan


I don't think you're fully comprehending what I'm saying. Let's use an analogy to help:
A ferry sunk in India this morning, that is the truth. It is what happened and will always be what happened.
Let's say a group of people dedicated themselves to remembering the victims of the ferry accident and they keep going for millenia. The truth remains unchanged and the group does the same thing it always has. But over the years some people for whatever reason decide to slightly change the story and the way the group remembers the ferry tragedy, resulting in them leaving the original group to start their own. The other groups may have thousands of members who truly believe they are the keepers of the memory, but the original group alone is the only one that never changed and therefore the only one who knows and teaches the actual truth.
There is only one truth when it comes to the formation of the ferry group or the Christian Church.

When I say Jesus started a Church, it's not my opinion, it's His. If you read the Gospels you'll see Jesus talks about His Church not infrequently. The book of the Acts of The Apostles is about nothing except the formation of the Church. Also, the vast majority of the books of the New Testament are letters to people at actual Churches and are concerned in large part about doctrine and practice in The Church.

I'm not saying "hey my pastor figured out what the old church was like", I'm saying, "The old Church never went anywhere, it's been there all along, our western upbringing and historically illiterate society keeps us from knowing or even having the mind to understand that there really was an original Church that was led by people who walked and talked to Jesus and that it has not changed to this day."

Originally posted by DominusIlluminatioMea
19And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book."

You realize that there was NO Bible book when that verse was written, right?