I am an Orthodox Christian and Historian; Almost Everything Most Know About The Church is False

I put this in the "Conspiracies in Religion" category because the entire history of Christianity as we know it in Western civilization is a conspiracy itself. A lot of people, will read this and think, "yeah, I know. Rome invented it to control people" or something to that effect, but it's actually much much more interesting than that.
In an effort to keep the original post short, I will not cover everything here but I will check this thread as often as possible and answer any and all questions.

In 33 AD, there was an event called "Pentecost" when the actual organized body of Christianity was formed and began sharing the good news (Gospel) about Jesus, baptizing people, teaching them prayers and hymns and breaking bread (receiving the Eucharist). It quickly spread from Jerusalem in Palestine to the surrounding areas including modern Syria, Iraq, Egypt, Turkey and Greece. From there it spread farther in both East and West directions, including India and Italy. The growth of Christianity happened in outer provinces of the Roman Empire, mostly east of the Capital City of Rome. This was not people with similar beliefs and a book starting churches, but rather a organized body that recognized Christ as the head of the Church and those taught and blessed by his Apostles and those taught and blessed by those who were taught and so on, would be the spiritual "leaders" of the church to assure an unbroken, unchanged faith of the Apostles. But it was not "Rome's" Church by any means.
Skipping persecutions and about 200 years of the decline and fall of the Roman Empire, we arrive at 325AD. Rome has fallen to the Barbarians and the Capital of what remains of the Roman Empire has moved 1000 miles away to modern Turkey--into the heart of Christian culture. Partly because of the barbarian situation in the west, and partly due to new teachings that had never existed before, a council of Bishops from around the old western empire and the existing one was called to clearly define Christianity. They left with The Holy Bible and The Christian Creed among other housekeeping items. The eastern Roman empire then began to absolutely flourish while the west had what we know as "The Dark Ages". The bishops in the west were slowly replaced by barbarians (a very general term for northern European invading peoples) and in their drive for power over the old, now crumbling remains of an empire, the bishop of Rome began to assume a very powerful role in the creation of kings. The Roman bishop also changed the way things were done in the church and made slight altercations to the Creed and The Bible. By 1054AD, the bishop of Rome (the Pope) had become the leader of an organization that was no longer the faith or traditions of the Apostles and made that official when the Roman Pope left the Christian Church; then made it really official when the Pope sent soldiers to pillage and kill the other Bishops a few hundred years later.
I'm going longer than I intended so I will wrap up this post in this next paragraph. The essential point of all the above is that Rome was not Rome any more and the Eastern Empire was thriving while the war-torn west was in the dark ages. After the dark ages, there were inquisitions, crusades and plagues that made sure just about any remnant of the Apostolic faith was wiped out of western Europe and the Roman church ruled supreme. A few hundred years into this rule, reformers tried to find the true faith and didn't know where to look other than The Bible, a book whose history was somewhat known but twisted so it seemed like the pope was the boss at the canonization, when in fact, no one but Christ was "the boss". So the protestants started from shaky ground and tried to invent a faith of their own based on The Bible but not based on the "always and by everyone" rule, but leaving it up to their own interpretations and resulting in an ever growing number of "denominations" as people disagree and form new groups. Jesus didn't write a book or start a philosophy, he started a Church. It lives, unchanged to this day in pure Apostolic succession without central leadership or any desire to control anyone.

Please ask questions because I think I can help clear up a lot of misunderstandings about God, Christianity, the Church, Christ's teachings and many other aspects such as the influence of Masonry and Khazars on Protestantism, the subtle yet sinister ways the Roman church changed key elements of worship, Byzantine history, how the Roman Church plundered Christendom, or anything you've got.

Exactly my thoughts my friend,
The organized church is corrupt, We(believers) are called to be the Church of Christ, not just simply go to church, there are too many fake "Christians" nowadays.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike

I put this in the "Conspiracies in Religion" category because the entire history of Christianity as we know it in Western civilization is a conspiracy itself

Quite a premise!! S and F!
Can you give us a little more info on your background?

Looking forward to this playing out.
wild

Originally posted by DominusIlluminatioMea
Exactly my thoughts my friend,

The organized church is corrupt, We(believers) are called to be the Church of Christ, not just simply go to church, there are too many fake "Christians" nowadays.

The organized church is not the church. We are called to be the Church of Christ AND to go to church. My point is,few people actually know what church is because their understanding of it started from the Roman pope's church.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike

My point is,few people actually know what church is because their understanding of it started from the Roman pope's church.

"Church" is the great outdoors....the more uncontrolled and unimproved by man, the better.
"Church" is our Earth.
"God" is all that we see outside of our windows. It is love, light, joy, happiness, connectedness, compassion, friendship, laughter.
Faith and hope lie within each of us. We just need to stop looking to a dark, dank structure and a bunch of others (preachers, priests, deacons, rectors, ministers, whatever) telling us how crappy we all are.
Namaste

reply to post by wildtimes


I was an avowed atheist because of all the corruption in the Catholic Church and the glaring divisions and convoluted theories in the Protestant Church. I had read the Bible myself and was corrected anytime I brought up things that were obviously there or, in some cases, not there at all. As an historian, I love knowledge and research, but unfortunately as a conditioned member of this society, I often used to find myself accepting the big lies even while exposing or studying the small ones. When I began looking into why the secret societies have such a problem with Christianity and simultaneously run it, I found a whole new world of information that changed my life.
I have a BA in Anthropology and History and contribute to documentary films and independent research projects.
I hope to put all this into book form one day. I find it fascinating.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike


Awesome. Would like to hear more about it.
I am also a historian....and have a Master's degree in human behavior (Social Work....Christ's basic message: Treat others the way you would like to be treated)....and decades worth of study of world religions.
Cheers.

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by TruthSeekerMike

 

My point is,few people actually know what church is because their understanding of it started from the Roman pope's church.

"Church" is the great outdoors....the more uncontrolled and unimproved by man, the better.
"Church" is our Earth.
"God" is all that we see outside of our windows. It is love, light, joy, happiness, connectedness, compassion, friendship, laughter.
Faith and hope lie within each of us. We just need to stop looking to a dark, dank structure and a bunch of others (preachers, priests, deacons, rectors, ministers, whatever) telling us how crappy we all are.
Namaste

edit on 30-4-2012 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)

Church is actually a place with beautiful things that glorify God and where his people can meet as a community to pray and sing as a community, as God intended. It's not a dank dark place--that's what you know it as because you've been duped and that's what they fed you as church. No guy standing at a lectern telling me I suck is Church or even close to it.
You are so right about God and faith and where to look. You are telling me true Christianity and don't even know it. I go to the original Church (known now as Eastern Orthodoxy) and I can assure you, your thoughts are very close to what Christ taught.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike

ou are telling me true Christianity and don't even know it. I go to the original Church (known now as Eastern Orthodoxy) and I can assure you, your thoughts are very close to what Christ taught.

Yes, TruthSeekerMike, I do know it. Again, looking forward to hearing more from you.

Where and how does Constantine fall into all of this? It is my understanding that he helped form what we now call Christianity. I could be wrong though. I was born and raised Catholic but have since started going to an Episcopal church. Thank you for the thread.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike


Do you believe that Jesus is a god?

Do you believe in the Bible?

What do you think about the Gnostic Christians?

Originally posted by wildtimes

Yes, TruthSeekerMike, I do know it. Again, looking forward to hearing more from you.

Here's a fun one, I'll call it "What's in a Name"
The Roman Catholic Church is the original official "name" of the Christian Church (though it was at first simply called "The Way"). It was founded in the Roman Empire and the Creed speaks of the Catholic (universal) Church. But. . . it wasn't called anything but "The Way" until the city of Rome was sacked and nearly empty and the concept of a central office never existed, but there was only one "way" and its life was in a community called the "Roman Catholic Church". It wasn't until the organization now known as the Roman Catholic Church left the Roman Catholic Church that the Roman Catholic Church became known in general by the term Orthodox while the western organization headquartered in the fully barbarian-controlled Rome started calling itself the Roman Catholic Church.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike



Now as God reveals revelation by Spirit and not history and all you offer is history, there is no credibility of anything that reavels you as a spiritual person or one called by God or anything else

What church do you belong to...., I mean a body of people where you are voluntarily under the leadership of a man called by God and you participate in some way with saving souls (the goal of the church) which is also saving your family first, becuase if you can't do that your not qualifed for the other...

What I'm asking is your 'fruit'. What is your 'fruit' that reveals who you are.

And what are you in the body, who called you, and what is your mission?

I have seen much said about 'church' and while you are right there is no conclusion, no solution or no anything really...

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by TruthSeekerMike

 

Do you believe that Jesus is a god?
I believe in one God, Father Almighty, Creator of
heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.

And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of
God, begotten of the Father before all ages;

Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten,
not created, of one essence with the Father
through Whom all things were made.

Who for us men and for our salvation
came down from heaven and was incarnate
of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary and became man.

He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate,
and suffered and was buried;

And He rose on the third day,
according to the Scriptures.

He ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father;

And He will come again with glory to judge the living
and dead. His kingdom shall have no end.

And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Creator of life,
Who proceeds from the Father, Who together with the
Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified, Who
spoke through the prophets.

In one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church.

I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.

I look for the resurrection of the dead,
and the life of the age to come.

Do you believe in the Bible?

Sure do. I even have a few copies.

What do you think about the Gnostic Christians?
I think they were ancient secret societies trying to muddy Christ's message and work and were a huge part of the reason the Church needed ecumenical councils to keep the Apostle's faith pure and uncorrupted.

reply to post by TruthSeekerMike

When I began looking into why the secret societies have such a problem with Christianity and simultaneously run it, I found a whole new world of information that changed my life.

Interesting stuff! I was researching the beginnings and inner workings of the Mormon church and stumbled onto so much Masonry symbolism and rhetoric, I almost fell off my computer chair! The ironic thing is, The Book of Mormon, condemns secret societies and secret combinations something like 58 times!

reply to post by pacifier2012


I'm here to help with history because the actual Church never went anywhere. It's called Eastern Orthodoxy. It hasn't changed since the Apostles. The fruit of my Church is The Bible, the 325 years leading up to the Bible, the foundations of Christian life, holidays, everything. The Roman Catholic Church stole the history of the Church and replaced it with its own. I'm here to tell you, don't judge me, I'm a sinner, judge Christ's Church--Eastern Orthodoxy--it's fruits are beyond measure.
"Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things."

I am a Catholic. Yes, the Church has made many mistakes, trial and error, corruption, etc. People are known to sin, especially people in power. That being said, the Church has weathered some very hard times and faced terrible persecution. My father's family was from England where many Catholic martyrs fell and others fled Europe to come to America to be able to practice their beliefs without persecution. I come from a genealogy that includes two American Archbishops, a great uncle that was a priest and I was named after a great aunt that was a nun on my mother's side of the family. They were outstanding people who dedicated their lives to God by serving others. Hearing Catholics put down is painful for me so if the hate remarks spew against my faith I will not hang around.

Your anti-Catholic sentiment is noted and you will find a ready audience who would relish an opportunity to bash Catholics, but if it does that will be nothing new for ATS. You will find many Catholic haters here. People who don't consider Catholics to be Christians and Protestants who don't know they are Protestants. You have your work cut out for you.

Actually, I hope people who doubt Jesus existence will pay attention and wish you the best with getting your thoughts to be considered by non-Christians.

I will pray you are able to bring others to know the Lord and clear up any confusion.

I will leave you with something to reflect upon:
Is The Church Corrupt?
www.washingtonpost.com...

If Jesus is the only son of God, why does he tell us to pray "OUR father thou art in heaven?" Surely, we should be saying "Father of Jesus thou are in heaven"...

Paslms 82:6 "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High."

Originally posted by Cowgirlstraitup7
Where and how does Constantine fall into all of this? It is my understanding that he helped form what we now call Christianity. I could be wrong though. I was born and raised Catholic but have since started going to an Episcopal church. Thank you for the thread.

Constantine was the emperor at the time the first council was held and where the canon of scripture and the creed (no filioque) was determined. He encouraged the council and allowed state resources on it because Christianity was THE culture in Macedonia and divided beliefs and teachings could have resulted in social unrest. He played no role in the proceedings other than occasional audience and greeter. The important thing to remember is that even though Constantine was the emperor of Rome in title, he was 1000 miles from Rome and the western empire was essentially dead. It matters because, as you noted, Roman Catholics and the rest of us are taught that what Constantine did in Macedonia mattered in Italy, but it couldn't be less true. Rome only existed in name in the West after 300 or so.

Originally posted by sad_eyed_lady
I am a Catholic. Yes, the Church has made many mistakes, trial and error, corruption, etc. People are known to sin, especially people in power. That being said, the Church has weathered some very hard times and faced terrible persecution. My father's family was from England where many Catholic martyrs fell and others fled Europe to come to America to be able to practice their beliefs without persecution. I come from a genealogy that includes two American Archbishops, a great uncle that was a priest and I was named after a great aunt that was a nun on my mother's side of the family. They were outstanding people who dedicated their lives to God by serving others. Hearing Catholics put down is painful for me so if the hate remarks spew against my faith I will not hang around.

Your anti-Catholic sentiment is noted and you will find a ready audience who would relish an opportunity to bash Catholics, but if it does that will be nothing new for ATS. You will find many Catholic haters here. People who don't consider Catholics to be Christians and Protestants who don't know they are Protestants. You have your work cut out for you.

Actually, I hope people who doubt Jesus existence will pay attention and wish you the best with getting your thoughts to be considered by non-Christians.

I will pray you are able to bring others to know the Lord and clear up any confusion.

I will leave you with something to reflect upon:
Is The Church Corrupt?
www.washingtonpost.com...

It's not your fault at all. My goodness, our ancestors were tortured into being Roman Catholics. Unless you and your family were encouraging the pope to alter Christianity, you have no blame and I have nothing but the greatest love for you. The pope is not the head of Christianity, Christ is. He doesn't need a vicar on Earth. Peter wasn't the boss of the Apostles--clearly evidenced in Acts. And the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father, not the Father and the Son. So many little twists that changed the faith. Sorry. It's just the truth. You can look it up too. Lots of Catholics convert to Orthodoxy when they give it 5 minutes thought--Protestants take 10-15 minutes.