Man arrested for reading the Holy Bible in public

Jesus himself would call that man a hypocrite. You see, public preaching was something Jesus criticized the Pharisees for. This is something that Christians tend to ignore.

The verse goes like this:

And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

Mathew 6:5

Just remember though, for every Bible verse there is an equal but opposite Bible verse.

reply to post by tovenar

If someone else is being loud, you have to just to endure it. But if a religious person is obnoxious, call the cops.

Not so. You have the perfect right to turn to them and say, "Excuse me, but I don't want to hear you arguing with your bff at this moment"...or in the movie theatre, you can turn around and say, "Shhh.".....

disturbing the peace is disturbing the peace.
I have been known to go to my neighbors when they are being excessively loud, blaring their music, or their kids are shrieking and screaming (or the adults)....and saying,
"Excuse me, can you please keep it down? You are disrupting the peace of the neighborhood."

Okay, sometimes I say "Hey! Knock it off! I'm trying to read over here!" or "My kid is sleeping!"

Am expected to stay indoors when my neighbor's cousin is blasting rap music all over the subdivision? NO. HE is expected to keep his personal recreation PERSONAL.

I have called the police more times than I can count because someone else was making TOO. MUCH. NOISE. And they weren't even on my property -- but I was, nevertheless, a 'captive audience' unless I wanted to leave my own house to get away from it.
It's against the law.

I dont walk around reading quantum physics out loud. Why cant other people just read to themselves?

reply to post by wildtimes


At least the Jehovah Witnesses aren't breaking any laws, and they politely leave if you don't "buy what they're sailing" so to speak. At least, all the one's I've come across have.

reply to post by lacrimaererum

Does the preacher feel the need to shout at people who are not going anywhere simply because people will not stop on the street to listen to him anymore?

There is no problem for this man to shout his own beliefs at people if they have the opurtunity to leave or keep moving away. The manner this whole thing played out looked like it was not the first time this man was arrested and the people invovled knew exactly this would happen. People viewing this video in shock and outrage have been conned.

I know, right?
Actually, here in my city, he would have probably been enrolled in the "Mental Health Court" diversion program and then assigned a case manager based on his behavior.

(I used to be counselor and case manager for those folks in the Mental Health Court who were there due to substance abuse issues ...I tell ya, the stories and the personalities was better than tv. Sad, and hilarious at the same time)...

reply to post by DrNotforhire


HE WAS ON PRIVATE PROPERTY, HAVE YOU READ ANY OF THE COMMENTS POSTED?..

Good grief guys.. You have nothing to support your argument except two claims which is one giant hole..

He was arrested because he had been asked to leave ((being on private property)) and he didn't. He continued doing what he was doing until further action was taken. Once further action arrived he acted as if he was the innocent one and wasn't treated fairly. He would not have been arrested if he wouldn't have continued on private property where he was asked to leave.

Whatever happened to your bs turn the other cheek thing? I'm guessing making a youtube video is how it's done in 2012, which will provoke you nuts not seeing anything further than what they want you to think?

You yell freedom of speech but combat freedom of property. Give me your address so I can come read from the Satanic bible on your porch while your outside.

reply to post by RatoAstuto

At least the Jehovah Witnesses aren't breaking any laws, and they politely leave if you don't "buy what they're sailing" so to speak.

Well, that's debatable. They are trespassing, first of all, to come onto your property without permission. And if they do so in a neighborhood where there is a No Solicitation statute (whether posted or not), they are also breaking the law. People aren't real keen on uninvited door-knocking by total strangers peddling something.

I finally had to put a sign on my door that says "No Solicitation of Any Kind Effective Immediately", after they kept showing up unannounced, even after I had told them my dad just died and I didn't want to talk to them. Then again they came on Thanksgiving Day....and again on Christmas Day....
and then..up went the sign.
They have not come back. Nice ladies, but...uh....I'll call you if I want to talk, thanks.

Originally posted by Pelvi
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Grabbing straws aren't we?..

You started off asking how the Westboro babtist church can do it and argued about it, and then you defended it when it was to prove your own point.

It's private property, if Westboro babtist went there they would be arrested too.

Public property like parks and certain graveyards you can protest. Hence why occupy atlanta was at their park.

I'm sorry man but no matter how much you change up your words it's not going to change what actually went on..

edit on 6-4-2012 by Pelvi because:

No, no, no. I defended the WBC right to speak, NOT the content of what they say. I'm quite consistent. And even defended their right as a military veteran who finds their content disgusting. I'm defending the US constitution only.

I've already described how I deal with "The Louds" in the 'hood, and the JW prosyletizers...
but want to mention also that I live RIGHT NEXT DOOR to a church. My backyard (my sanctuary) is adjacent to their side yard...in warm weather they (if they are there at all - they have a service about once a month, and a congregation of about fifteen vehicles total) open their stained-glass windows and the music and preaching drifts over into my yard.

Do I go stomping over to their church, fling open the doors and tell them to shut the hell up??
Absolutely not. They are indoors, doing what they do, and I am outdoors, hearing the joyful ruckus ... it can be annoying, but it's not "DISTURBING THE PEACE."

Originally posted by buster2010

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by buster2010

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by timetothink
It still comes down to a matter of who owns the property, they in turn have the right to not allow anyone to be there or tell them how they can act. Someone or thing owns that parking lot they were in and in America private property rights are sacred.

even though I believe in religious freedom, these people were standing line in waiting to do something and these people were annoying.

It's not private property, had you watched the video it happened at a DMV location, that's public property during business hours.

The DMV is government property. So it has to follow the law which means no religion. The little wall of separation between church and state.

People shouldn't be crying war on religion just because the person in the video was too stupid to know the law.

Again it doesn't matter. It was in no way funded or supported by the state of California, nor the DMV so it doesn't classify under the establishment clause. It classifies under free exercise clause. And its not a captive audience. At anytime people were free to leave, its not criminal confinement.

Yes the law does matter. And kudos to the cop who arrested him he purposly targets government buildings to pull this kind of stunt while knowing he is breaking the law.

Not funded by California? Who do you think pays the bills and allows the DMV to issue licenses and plates for cars.

Not a captive audience? Maybe you should actually go to the DMV sometime.

I have a drivers license. Been there numerous times. Not once was I prevented from leaving at my own volition. That would be criminal confinement. And you cannot ignore HALF the law. You're ignoring the free exercise clause of the first Amendment.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


You really.. just don't get it do you?..

His first amendment was never violated..

That would have been the case if he was arrested for what he was saying, the words coming out of his mouth..

It was never about what he was saying.. It was about what he was doing.. Disturbing and tresspassing after he was asked to leave.. If you are on private property you can be asked to leave for no reason at all, it's the right of the owner or person in charge..

His 1st amendment would have been violated if he was only arrested for being christian or reading a bible..

reply to post by DocHolidaze


If I want to hear a bunch of fairy tales about a phony sky god, I will go to church.

Originally posted by Pelvi
reply to post by DrNotforhire

 

HE WAS ON PRIVATE PROPERTY, HAVE YOU READ ANY OF THE COMMENTS POSTED?..

Good grief guys.. You have nothing to support your argument except two claims which is one giant hole..

He was arrested because he had been asked to leave ((being on private property)) and he didn't. He continued doing what he was doing until further action was taken. Once further action arrived he acted as if he was the innocent one and wasn't treated fairly. He would not have been arrested if he wouldn't have continued on private property where he was asked to leave.

Whatever happened to your bs turn the other cheek thing? I'm guessing making a youtube video is how it's done in 2012, which will provoke you nuts not seeing anything further than what they want you to think?

You yell freedom of speech but combat freedom of property. Give me your address so I can come read from the Satanic bible on your porch while your outside.

The Department of Motor Vehicles is NOT private property. It's government property. Owned by everyone who pays taxes. This was not on someone's driveway or front yard. Nor was it on a private business's property.

Originally posted by Pelvi
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You really.. just don't get it do you?..

His first amendment was never violated..

That would have been the case if he was arrested for what he was saying, the words coming out of his mouth..

It was never about what he was saying.. It was about what he was doing.. Disturbing and tresspassing after he was asked to leave.. If you are on private property you can be asked to leave for no reason at all, it's the right of the owner or person in charge..

His 1st amendment would have been violated if he was only arrested for being christian or reading a bible..

Freedom of Speech is not the civil right that was violated. It was the free exercise clause of the first amendment.

Focus.

Originally posted by mileysubet
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You keep saying that these people where not a "captive audience" but I would have to disagree. Next time you need to renew your drivers licens and have to stand in that line while listening to some one preach about some subject that you find offensive come back to this thread and lets know how much you enjoyed it...

Enjoyment is irrelevant. A captive audience is one that cannot leave if they wish to leave of their own choice. An example would be is a prison ministry stood in front of a jail cell and preached to the inmate in that cell. People standing in line of their own choice isn't a captive audience. This should be common sense.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by XelNaga

 

read the bible out loud in church or home, not in public.

Are you nuts? That's a violation of his civil rights. You may not like the message, but at least you could defend his constitutional rights to have that opposite opinion. It's both a freedom of speech and a freedom of religion issue.

Should I really go any further?
Focus.

Originally posted by Pelvi

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by XelNaga

 

read the bible out loud in church or home, not in public.

Are you nuts? That's a violation of his civil rights. You may not like the message, but at least you could defend his constitutional rights to have that opposite opinion. It's both a freedom of speech and a freedom of religion issue.

Should I really go any further?
Focus.

No you should not go any further, you should go back. Go back to page 2 or 3 and look at the rulings of all the SCOUTS desisions on this matter that I linked. This is an issue of the free excercise clause. The establishment clause is irrelevant because it was neither government funded or encouraged.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

The Department of Motor Vehicles is NOT private property. It's government property. Owned by everyone who pays taxes.

That totally depends on the store-front location.

For example, the DMV branch I have to go to for tag renewal is a free-standing building (once a bank) either owned or rented by the county government ...if it was in a government building, like the county courthouse, then yeah, it's govt property that the "public" supports with taxes.

But,
the DMV for DL renewal I have to go to (yup, two different places that don't provide the other service) is a space in a strip mall that is OWNED by someone else...and only leased by the DMV. The mall owner is the property owner = private property.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Don't forget prayer in school.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


LOL if someone was at your neighborhood yelling stuff for hours you didnt want to hear of course you would be muzzled. And this doesnt prove squat that christianity is being persecuted or we are losing our free speech. Only shows that annoying people who "PUSH or FORCE their voice and beliefs on some else deserves to be arrested. This has nothing to do with free speech.....

If this was another guy on the street corner reading loudly from a synopsis of a book, and annoying the heck of out people, he would be arrested too for disturbing the public.

The guy was asking for it, he got what was coming for him. If you want to go and holler on the street, someones gonna muzzle you for annoyance. What do you think happens to dogs who want to have free speech and bark and bark and bark? HMM?? You think the dogs are all up and arms about telling them to be quiet and going to the courtrooms saying their rights are violated? Or the pet owners? Of course your gonna be told to shut yer yap, your being an annoying a@@.


Plus you Christians are trying to act like some kind of celebrities, which is against your Bible your reading from. Maybe you should keep to your pulpits and quit trying to publicize your speech so much, tv evangelists is enough.

Matthew 6:1 “Beware of doing your kind deeds before men, in order to be seen by them. Otherwise you have no reward from your Father in the heavens.
6:2 “Thus, when you do a kind deed, do not sound a trumpet before you as the hypocrites do, in the congregations and in the streets, to be praised by men. Truly, I say to you, they have their reward.
6:3 “But when you do a kind deed, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing,
6:4 so that your kind deed shall be in secret. And your Father who sees in secret shall Himself reward you openly.
6:5 “And when you pray, you shall not be like the hypocrites. For they love to pray standing in the congregations and on the corners of the streets, to be seen by men. Truly, I say to you, they have their reward.
6:6 “But you, when you pray, go into your room, and having shut your door, pray to your Father who is in the secret place. And your Father who sees in secret shall reward you openly.
6:7 “And when praying, do not keep on babbling like the gentiles. For they think that they shall be heard for their many words.
6:8 “Therefore do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask Him.

Heres a vid to explain what I mean.



Does this mean that free speech you can annoy and say anything you want where you want when you want? Hmm........... I would rethink what you people say is free speech, within boundries.