Christianity vs Atheism: The Facts

Originally posted by SisyphusRide

I can't give you the truth Annee... you have to accept it for yourself.

one has to ask Jesus to help them understand, it's the only way I can explain to you.

ask questions and consult Jesus, Jesus is the main message of the bible.

Truth? I have no problem with truth.

In real actual history - there was a man named Jesus who was a political dissident. He was put to death for crimes against the government.

There is no true history of the "mythical biblical Jesus". There isn't one first hand account of anything equivalent to the miracle events of the "mythical biblical Jesus".

So Yes - I have no problem with truth.

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by SisyphusRide

I can't give you the truth Annee... you have to accept it for yourself.

one has to ask Jesus to help them understand, it's the only way I can explain to you.

ask questions and consult Jesus, Jesus is the main message of the bible.

Truth? I have no problem with truth.

In real actual history - there was a man named Jesus who was a political dissident. He was put to death for crimes against the government.

There is no true history of the "mythical biblical Jesus". There isn't one first hand account of anything equivalent to the miracle events of the "mythical biblical Jesus".

So Yes - I have no problem with truth.

I guess the truth is in the eye of the beholder?

reply to post by Starchild23


I believe Jesus did every approach correctly... passive and non-violent tendered with wisdom and mercy.

I will behold him forever with me

did I forget Just and True?

reply to post by SisyphusRide

I can't give you the truth Annee... you have to accept it for yourself. one has to ask Jesus to help them understand, it's the only way I can explain to you. ask questions and consult Jesus, Jesus is the main message of the bible.

So how exactly do you ask or consult Jesus? Do you have to make an appointment? Does he have an office that you can go to and question him? Does he have his own 1-800-ask-Jesus service?

Originally posted by mikelkhall
reply to post by SisyphusRide

 

I can't give you the truth Annee... you have to accept it for yourself. one has to ask Jesus to help them understand, it's the only way I can explain to you. ask questions and consult Jesus, Jesus is the main message of the bible.

So how exactly do you ask or consult Jesus? Do you have to make an appointment? Does he have an office that you can go to and question him? Does he have his own 1-800-ask-Jesus service?

yes he does and it's toll free as you imagined...

you have to ask that big question maybe? "Why Am I here" or "I Wonder How Life Got Here"

read 1 John too... sometimes an emotional hit you may take (like not being successful owning a home ect) will have you seek him wisdom on your own.

I didn't find anything really, it was there the whole time... Ask Jesus to come into your heart and reveal to you... demand it up on the mountain even! (like I have before)

he will cure your blindness and give you direction and strength.

reply to post by mikelkhall


PS: only the penitent may pass...

I've actually been doing it right pretty much this whole time but for me it was seeking fortune really and beating myself up telling myself I was a failure, just a mega dose of that dreaded word depression.

I found out that was totally the opposite of the truth.

I got mad at God (because of the World and no success) somewhere traveling on Skyline Drive one evening... he began to wake me up the very next morning, literally!

reply to post by SisyphusRide

yes he does and it's toll free as you imagined...

Ok...So what is the number? I have a few things I would like to ask him. You think he would sit down and have a cup of coffee with me?

Seriously dude. If Jesus would sit down and talk to people then I would believe 100% but since God is a dead-beat-dad I really doubt he has time for a personal visit.

Originally posted by mikelkhall
reply to post by SisyphusRide

 

yes he does and it's toll free as you imagined...

Ok...So what is the number? I have a few things I would like to ask him. You think he would sit down and have a cup of coffee with me?

Seriously dude. If Jesus would sit down and talk to people then I would believe 100% but since God is a dead-beat-dad I really doubt he has time for a personal visit.

that's my story... you have the number and you don't even need a phone!

you don't want to hear this if you do end up calling...

reply to post by windword


No it doesn't, popes and politicians didn't write the Bible. Jesus' followers did.

God is not some guy sitting on a throne, looking down on us with impunity.

God's throne is in Heaven and he hates all who do iniquity.

There is no such thing as sin either. There are things that are unwanted, like tornadoes, but a tornado isn't a sinful thing.

If their was no such thing as sin Jesus' wouldn't have needed to die on the cross, and the whole of the Old and New testament is not true. The whole reason we have suffering in this world is because of sin.

We are god, and god experiences his/her/its creation through our lives and perceptions, each and every living creature and unliving things as well, like a mountain, a hurricane or an ocean, are all expressions of god.

That is pure new age nonsense and a total lie. We are not God and we can never be God. We have never been able to create a single living thing. not even a grain of sand out of nothing. We cannot create worlds or know all things. What you are talking about is pure Pantheism and Nature worship. Lets see what the Bible says about people who do that... For they exchanged the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. - Romans 1:25

reply to post by windword


The Bible is not corrupt and you have 0 evidence to make that claim. Jesus is God and we don't claim that he is the Father. The Bible condemns all of your new age lies that you promote on these forums. The Bible calls people like you the anti-christ and a liar. Matthew 7:15 "Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. It is the God of Abraham in the OId Testament that Jesus prayed to in the New Testament.

reply to post by RevelationGeneration

If their was no such thing as sin Jesus' wouldn't have needed to die on the cross, and the whole of the Old and New testament is not true. The whole reason we have suffering in this world is because of sin.

Jesus didn't die on the cross, for our sins or otherwise. He was seen up and walking around and eating and stuff. He didn't die. Anyone who says he did is a liar! The bible was written by liars, popes and politicians and anyone who says otherwise is either a liar or very naive.

Jesus is not god and never claimed to be. You are not special. You have not been specially chosen to teach the way. Your halo doesn't shine so bright after all.

Only you can save yourself. There is no magic fairy god in the sky who dies in your place and wipes away your shortfalls. You will die someday too, end of story.

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by windword

 

The Bible is not corrupt and you have 0 evidence to make that claim. Jesus is God and we don't claim that he is the Father. The Bible condemns all of your new age lies that you promote on these forums. The Bible calls people like you the anti-christ and a liar. Matthew 7:15 "Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. It is the God of Abraham in the OId Testament that Jesus prayed to in the New Testament.

edit on 1-4-2012 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

There is tons of evidence to say that the bible has been written and rewritten my men, for political reasons. It is not inerrant. It has been manipulated by Christians and Jews alike to cause society to conform the ways of TPTB, and not god. The bible is full of lies and contradictions. It is a work of fiction with some historic truths thrown in for flavor.

The bible is not god's word and without your bible, you have 0 evidence that Jesus is god. Period!

Originally posted by mikelkhall

So how exactly do you ask or consult Jesus? Do you have to make an appointment? Does he have an office that you can go to and question him? Does he have his own 1-800-ask-Jesus service?

Here ya go :

The Mojo Monkeys - Gods Home Number

www.youtube.com...

reply to post by windword


I would like to mention that despite the incontrovertible proofs that the Bible is not what Christians claim it to be, religion has pulled our butts from the fire of extinction for most of our existence.

If we had no religion, the world would be in a much worse condition. People are far more willing to commit heinous crimes when they believe there is only oblivion beyond death, and nothing to hold them accountable for their actions save their peers...after all, moral is based on religion, correct?

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by windword

 

The Bible is not corrupt and you have 0 evidence to make that claim. Jesus is God and we don't claim that he is the Father. The Bible condemns all of your new age lies that you promote on these forums. The Bible calls people like you the anti-christ and a liar. Matthew 7:15 "Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. It is the God of Abraham in the OId Testament that Jesus prayed to in the New Testament.

edit on 1-4-2012 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

I repeat, you fear the repercussions of there being no true purpose to life. Not only this, but you fear death itself. Also, you have come to associate Jesus and God with feeling good...an emotion instilled by the authorities in your life, and which you have been trained to be attracted towards. It is a Pavlov-esque reaction.

Your fear is what drives you to accept this book that was written thousands of years ago, and continually rewritten since then. No doubt it has lead you to live a good life; however, there is such a thing as being good for the sake of goodness.

You need not know Jesus nor God to live an honorable and decent life. All you need is to love.

reply to post by mikelkhall

Seriously dude. If Jesus would sit down and talk to people then I would believe 100% but since God is a dead-beat-dad I really doubt he has time for a personal visit.

He does talk to you, you're just not hearing him. You will continue to not hear him if you keep your mind closed and hold on to your anger and prejudices.

He is everywhere, thats what omnipresence is...even when you think he isn't there, he sees you. When you think you're alone, you are not and he sees the things you do, every one of them.

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by windword

 

No it doesn't, popes and politicians didn't write the Bible. Jesus' followers did.

Kind of like the reliability of eye witnesses.

Supreme Court examines reliability of eyewitness testimony

By Joan Biskupic, USA TODAY

Supreme Court cases dating to the 1960s have similarly stressed that eyewitness identifications are particularly untrustworthy and can lead to tainted jury verdicts and injustice. www.usatoday.com...

Originally posted by Starchild23
reply to post by windword

 

I would like to mention that despite the incontrovertible proofs that the Bible is not what Christians claim it to be, religion has pulled our butts from the fire of extinction for most of our existence.

If we had no religion, the world would be in a much worse condition. People are far more willing to commit heinous crimes when they believe there is only oblivion beyond death, and nothing to hold them accountable for their actions save their peers...after all, moral is based on religion, correct?

That depends on what religions you are referring to. What kind of religion did the American Indians have? Did it save their butts from extinction? What about the Aboriginal Indians, African Tribes? Did Egyptian gods, Hindu or Sumerian gods save our butts from extinction? How about Thor, Zeus or Pele, did their religions save us from extinction?

I would argue that civilization saves our butts, but civilization isn't religion. Laws don't enforce morality, they enforce ethics.

I disagree that morality comes from god or religion. It comes from instinct and intellectual analysis of what is favorable and what is not. Morality doesn't arise from outside advisories, but an inner awareness, and it evolves.

I'd say most wars and murders have been committed out of religious grievances rather than civil disagreements.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

He does talk to you, you're just not hearing him. You will continue to not hear him if you keep your mind closed and hold on to your anger and prejudices.

What anger do you perceive that I have? What am I prejudice about?

The last I heard people that were hearing voices from invisible people were considered mentally disturbed. They have medicine for that ya know.

So basically what you are saying is that I have to be open minded to and believe in an invisible, all powerful being and then ask this invisible being to come into my heart and then I will start hearing voices too?

Ok, Yeah.

Your Christian god is a logical fallacy. I have provided the arguments for this, and up to this moment, no one has provided a legitimate counter-argument.

Until such an argument is provided, we can safely assume your god is not only flawed, but nonexistent.

If I am wrong, please provide a logical argument stating and proving your case.