The Powers That Be have been real all the time. Their names? "ALEC".

reply to post by diakrite


Krugman, uncle Milt etc. not with standing, there is no free market as long as fiat currency is involved - none. The only market forces that are at play are those created by the process of printing money. Case in point. When 100 dollars is loaned at compound interest - the interest is NOT printed. So, how can 1000 dollars be paid back if only 100 is printed via the loan (loans are printed money via accounting procedure)? It can't. Do the math here, it is pretty basic.

If all the "dollars" which are nothing more then "debts" (see your dollar bill - "bill" is a Federal Reserve "Note" = IOU) were collected up, we'd still owe the value of the money collected AND the rest not accounted for. Federal Reserve Notes are debt instruments, NOT credit instruments as they are worthless. In order for this to work, there must be poor, and the poor must have their assets taken away in order to pay off the compound interest taken out by you and your mortgage - this is what wars are all about. Yes, african kids starve so you can pay the compound interest on your Credit Card: this is a fact that Krugman and his lot hide at the behest of those who want it hidden = TPTB.

As for the Kochs, they are stooges, their kind have been used for ages to do the bidding for the real powers that be - folks you will never see, never know their names, but folks the Kochs and their kind kow tow to and quiver at the mention of those who enslave them with golden hand cuffs. As for Krugman being right, he's told what to write and when, of course he's right as nothing he says is without direction, you'll note he works for the Times from which this great quote was born:

"There is no such thing, at this date of the world's history in America, as an independent press You know it and I know it. There is not one of you who dare to write your honest opinions, and if you did, you know beforehand that it would never appear in print. I am paid weekly for keeping my honest opinion out of the paper I am connected with. Others of you are paid similar salaries for similar things, and any of you who would be so foolish as to write honest opinions would be out on the street looking for another job. If I allowed my honest opinions to appear in one issue of my' paper, before twenty-four hours my occupation would be gone. The business of the journalist is to destroy the truth; to lie outright; to pervert; to vilify; to fawn at the feet of mammon, and to sell his country and his race for his daily bread. You know it and I know it and what folly is this toasting an independent press? We are the tools and vassals of rich men behind the scenes We are the jumping jacks, they pull the strings and we dance. Our talents, our possibilities, and our lives are all the property of other men. We are intellectual prostitutes."

--John Swinton, former chief of staff, The New York Times, in a 1953 speech before the New York Press Club


TPTB are not, and never have been, those with names. The rabbit hole is not a hole, it is a worm hole...

reply to post by crankyoldman


Couldn't agree more, ask a pressman about a story they would not touch with a bargepole.

reply to post by crankyoldman


Yes very well said!

People think they are 'making money' when it is simply being redistributed, from the bottom up.

Originally posted by jimmyx
all of these threads about what the "TPTB" have done and are doing don't mean a damn thing. so, everybody has this info and what?......pause.....we all get P.O.'ed and nothing is done about it. george carlin said it well when in one of his last "comedy routines" he said "it's all bulls**t. drink the kool-aid, take your soma, because nobody is going to change it.

Jimmy your right, as much as I don't want to agree with you, the main problem is that there isn't enough people aware of this massive issue to make a difference. However there those who know and don't do anything basically mostly out of fear. Then there are those who know that this happening and are actually doing something yet those people are silenced in a varity of different ways. The problem is information is being controlled by THEM by various means and methods. The mean it through the MSM and there method is mass distraction on multiple levels. This is one of the reasons why people don't do anything add to the fact the lack of proper education and being brainwashed to obey and not question authority creates the recipe of mass control by the controllers.

It's more complex than what I just wrote and an absurd amount of levels in which they try to control. Yes we are all free to a degree but once you challenge the status quo, that's when the repercussions of the controllers are hard felt. In other words, you can talk all you want on ATS, about subjects true or not true but if the members of ATS all agreed to fight against the status quo thats when the repercussions happen and a lot of people fear repercussions .

reply to post by diakrite


Oh yes like George Carlin once said people always seem to be surprised when wealthy people and powerfull groups get together and make plans to make themselves more wealthy and powerful.
It's like a conspiracy or something.

reply to post by jcarpenter

Although i agree with your assessment, I have a problem with two of your points. One of which i think suggests a partisan attitude in your post. But first, I'd like to add to your post, "US troops are being used to guard poppy fields in Afghanistan. Turkey's government and military are eyeball deep in processing opium into heroin and transshipping it to Europe", by suggesting their criminal intent is to transport the product to "ALL" global markets including the United States. The U.S. providing security to these fields rather that burning them suggests further involvement.

On the second point, referring to Mena Arkansas, you mention Clinton's protection of illegal Cocaine shipments and avoided Bush's involvement in the operation. Personally, i believe Clinton may have known about Mena, but may have turned a blind eye as he may have been briefed on CIA management of the venture. The CIA along with the Bush clan has been reported to be involved in every sinister plot since WW-2. I hope you are aware of this as much has been written on this subject since the Bay of Pigs.

reply to post by galadofwarthethird


Thanks for that. Yeah Carlin was one of a kind. Without a doubt the best stand up comedian in the history of comedy ever in my personal opinion (if someone has another rival, let me know). His quick wit and intelligent approach to calling out the masters of puppets has no equal. The guy was special. He made me want to be a stand up comedian when I was younger. Of course that never happened though. ~$heopleNation

So, were the bills that were drafted by these entities good or bad for people? Just because they helped draft them doesn't mean they are bad. Is there any information on what laws were created this way?

Great post! Seems there is a far more intelligent crowd here, over sodahead.

reply to post by dagann


Are you aware of the suicide rates among active military? Shocking to say the least!

Originally posted by AlienStalker

I have known of the CIA and other government sectors involvement in the drug trade for a while now, but I live in Venice, Florida and had no idea of what you said regarding the CIA flying the coc aine directly into our airport. Not only that but Mohammad Atta bringing coc aine back to his girlfriend after coming from the airport?!

What I would give to know where and when those hangers could be accessed without being caught,

White gold my friend, poison, but gold nonetheless.

Google "Amanda Keller" for an eyeful. Atta's live-in girlfriend was a stripper and Atta was said to be something of a party-animal. A party animal with an out-of-control temper.

If I remember correctly, the first written references to government drug trafficking in central Florida started in the 1930's. Back then, Florida was a primitive backwater. This was pre-CIA and right now I can't recall who the perps were. It would have been run thru a military command.

As far as "white gold", think of it in terms of cyanide (absolute poison) and you'll be closer to the mark. Several kids got caught observing the CIA coc aine drops around Mena, Arkansas and they ended up "suicided". By the term "suicided", I mean there were physical marks showing the kids were beaten and one kid even had the imprint of a rifle butt to the face. Then they were run over by a train. Literally. Official word is that they got stoned and went to sleep on the tracks. Or similar nonsense.

The body count around Mena was pretty high. There is an excellent older documentary called Obstruction of Justice":

www.youtube.com...


Another excellent documentary is "The Clinton Chronicles":


www.youtube.com...


The last vid is factual but in-the-beginning makes it sound like Clinton was the defining moment in starting to corrupt our government. The simple fact is: The Clinton Clan = the Bush Clan = same crime family. SSDD. These people have damaged our country beyond repair.

Originally posted by dagann
reply to post by jcarpenter

 

Although i agree with your assessment, I have a problem with two of your points. One of which i think suggests a partisan attitude in your post. But first, I'd like to add to your post, "US troops are being used to guard poppy fields in Afghanistan. Turkey's government and military are eyeball deep in processing opium into heroin and transshipping it to Europe", by suggesting their criminal intent is to transport the product to "ALL" global markets including the United States. The U.S. providing security to these fields rather that burning them suggests further involvement.

I guess I'm being dense here but I don't see any disagreement between us.

Originally posted by dagann
On the second point, referring to Mena Arkansas, you mention Clinton's protection of illegal Cocaine shipments and avoided Bush's involvement in the operation. Personally, i believe Clinton may have known about Mena, but may have turned a blind eye as he may have been briefed on CIA management of the venture. The CIA along with the Bush clan has been reported to be involved in every sinister plot since WW-2. I hope you are aware of this as much has been written on this subject since the Bay of Pigs.

A CIA pilot has come forward to say that Bill Clinton showed up at Mena airport, (with his security detail) and personally picked up a cooler full of coc aine. You can't get more involved than that.

All the available evidence, including first-person accounts, agrees about the Bush Clan being involved in darn near everything nasty over the last 75 years -- starting with Prescott Bush. These are evil people.

reply to post by jcarpenter


I would bet that CIA pilot thing is total bull#.

What's his name, post a link, etc.

reply to post by galadofwarthethird


You know what is remarkable about this clip - the applause and hooting. In another bit Carlin (one of his last in the graveyard) does a GREAT job detailing the screwing we all get and the crowd goes nuts as if he isn't talking about THEM!

Were the a reality people could understand, when Carlin speaks these words the crowd would cry. Hooting and cheering shows the don't get it, the reality is often too much to bear...

reply to post by smurfy


I don't believe that I've seen any spot where TPTB have been attributed to one and only one group.... Take this thread: You mention government acting like cartels - "A" TPTB, if you will.

Then there is ALEC: the one that the OP talks of responsible for the drafting of 50 laws.

End Result: No single TPTB.

I'm not in disagreement with you with regards to the cheating.

I just believe that cheating isn't a property of the system - but of the people who run it, and live in it - which was what I disagreed with - those earlier posts talking of various isms being the problem.

I will write of one of the ways in changes are effected in this system (at least in likely in the US and definitely in Canada):

There is a co-worker at my workplace, who was dis-satisfied with the way her daughter's school was run (which was a public school, here in Canada). She joined parent meetings and convinced a whole group of parents that things should change. These parents alongside herself volunteered and went out and found an election candidate in her riding who she made aware of the problem, and who promised to support her view if he/she got elected. The parents and my co-worker started an advertising campaign for the candidate, who won the election, and got the laws changed.

For changes across the board, concerned people have to make a platform and get actively involved in getting good candidates elected.

As for debates on ATS - this is a good way to see alternate views of the same issue - but as with everything, you need to be careful what you are looking at - the bigger picture is not *always* present. Additionally, you can ask for help about different topics and might get some good ideas here.

Profiteering is a relatively permanent thing that goes on in this system (regardless of what country). When the common man's pockets are empty, the marketplace will collapse both for the rich (greedy or not) and average joe (we make up the majority of the market). Large scale can no longer apply at that point and the cost of operation of *any* business becomes expensive.

The rich man can't be more secure than the country. He is also dependent on economy of scales for cheap production and delivery of his personal goods. He is also dependent on government for law and order, and public services (roads, sewers etc...). He is possibly also dependent on geographically well distributed welfare of people, if he is to travel far and wide, safely. He is dependent on well distributed road systems for the transport of locally unavailable resources such as oil, electricity, food, wines etc... He needs the gasoline pumps where the trucks that bring him his share of wealth (pumps manned by people of good health and good disposition).

A reversal of the economy bodes not well for the rich either, then. Those who have the money, are essentially those who have to pay to keep the system healthy. If they do not pay, their money becomes more worthless over time as the system degrades and costs skyrocket.

If they hide a stash of wealth for their personal five year survival during a severe economic downturn - what government will be left to ensure the safety of these people - will they pay for it? They have to. They *could* potentially wait five years in running and hiding - from those other rich thugs, who will gladly relieve them of their stash of wealth in a stagnant economy (Somalian pirates are paid for by rich thugs). They can get their share of unhappiness if critical mass of modern infrastructure breaks. If they need fixes - who will they pay, when broken education systems no longer deliver?

The cheating, will only fall on the heads of those who can remain in the economy, and it will be a hell hole, I would personally be glad to leave behind.

Now... if only I could get a grip on survival when trouble arrives - if it arrives (if it doesn't, I'll be employed, else, I'll be organizing people to live - I have to succeed, my life may depend on it).

the pigs and sheep find evidence and proof that they are owned by some farmer, then they go to feed on the food-slop the farmer shovels to them, forgetting completely about the endless butchering.

you are all wrong unit 2800 or unit 8200 has the control has control with the newnsa i do not want them to pick me up as they scan everything as the scan everything. they know what your typing.

These "people" (and that term is loosely defined here) are a plague on earth.
Reminds me of The Flood in the Halo games..parasitic and everywhere..

This is where I get lost on the whole TPTB thing.....

Which one is it? Is the government a bunch of evil geniuses that go to the trouble to coordinate & orchestrate false flag attacks for a global agenda?

Or are they a bunch of blithering corrupt idiots who do nothing, and have little knowledge of the real world?

Are they hiding in a penthouse board room, coming up with nefarious ways to take away our liberties and make us all slaves?

Or are they slowly, secretly, poisoning us, in the hopes that we all die off? Dont they want/need us so they can tax the hell out of us to fund their nefarious plans?

Or are they wasting a bunch of money to create prisons to house us all in like animals in a zoo?

They secretly want us to have class warfare, racial tensions, but then these same people show outrage over the smallest hint of said social problems?

They're secretly rounding up those who learn too much, harvest their organs, and experiment on them in secret underground bases, but at the same time they allow the FOIA, and spend millions of tax payers dollars on housing, food, and hospital care for them?

You said it:

They are either in full control (we don't know who) OR

They are in partial control: in all its possible permutations or combinations.

They have no control.


All we have are just guesses - wild guesses.

But take a look at what we have seen so far: Things worked, it would seem for the longest time, until quite recently and it all included us. Now things are slowly, apparently falling apart (with fighting on various sides). If this is part of the "Plan", it looks really easy... Perhaps they are just losing control? (looks like a duck, smells like a duck, quacks like a duck: What is it?)

I'm sure if the balloon burst, there will be plans to take smaller pieces and use that to rebuild... Who then cares who is in control?

If we can assume that there is a TPTB, can we not assume that there is none too? Heads or tails?

Obviously, what ever TPTB there is, if it is the net effect we are looking at - there is a distinct possibility that SHTF they won't/aren't bothered about the small guy?

Just leaving us alone will crush us - cause we're too busy speculating and can't do anything on our own.