The Lie of Evolution from a Credible Scientist

Originally posted by rhinoceros
reply to post by Deetermined

 

That doesn't prove anything, except that some desert people wrote such thing a few thousand years ago. Try again.

What reason would there be for "desert people" to make up historical or genealogical records a few thousand years ago?

Why go to such links to say:

Genesis 4:17-22

17And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.

18And unto Enoch was born Irad: and Irad begat Mehujael: and Mehujael begat Methusael: and Methusael begat Lamech.

19And Lamech took unto him two wives: the name of the one was Adah, and the name of the other Zillah.

20And Adah bare Jabal: he was the father of such as dwell in tents, and of such as have cattle.

21And his brother's name was Jubal: he was the father of all such as handle the harp and organ.

22And Zillah, she also bare Tubalcain, an instructer of every artificer in brass and iron: and the sister of Tubalcain was Naamah.

or to document all of this if these records weren't meant to keep track of history...

www.biblegateway.com...

Genesis 10

1Now these are the generations of the sons of Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth: and unto them were sons born after the flood.

2The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras.

3And the sons of Gomer; Ashkenaz, and Riphath, and Togarmah.

4And the sons of Javan; Elishah, and Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim.

5By these were the isles of the Gentiles divided in their lands; every one after his tongue, after their families, in their nations.

6And the sons of Ham; Cush, and Mizraim, and Phut, and Canaan.

7And the sons of Cush; Seba, and Havilah, and Sabtah, and Raamah, and Sabtechah: and the sons of Raamah; Sheba, and Dedan.

8And Cush begat Nimrod: he began to be a mighty one in the earth.

9He was a mighty hunter before the LORD: wherefore it is said, Even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the LORD.

10And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, and Erech, and Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar.

.......and those are just the first ten verses.

reply to post by Barcs


Inside one of your links was an interesting theory on how God allowed apes to evolve up to a point and then he breathed life into them by giving them a critical thinking brain and a soul making them the humans of today. I had never heard that one before.

www.proof-of-evolution.com...

However, on the rest of the information you provided, it only brings up more questions for me than answers, especially when it comes to dating fossils.

Science is relying so heavily on a radiocarbon dating system that's only 63 years old and has known flaws. Is there anything from a scientific standpoint that shows that they've found a way to overcome the issue of heat throwing the entire dating system off?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Barcs

 

Inside one of your links was an interesting theory on how God allowed apes to evolve up to a point and then he breathed life into them by giving them a critical thinking brain and a soul making them the humans of today. I had never heard that one before.

But that is impossible because we didn't descend from apes, we have a common ancestor.

Originally posted by Deetermined
What reason would there be for "desert people" to make up historical or genealogical records a few thousand years ago?

The same, Tolkien saw necessary in e.g. Lord of the Rings and Silmarillion. Many mythologies have a long list of names. So what? It doesn't prove anything, except that some people wrote lists of names. So again, prove that people used lived nearly 1,000 years.

This is a pointless discussion! The bible was created to control the minds of the weak and vulnerable, you know the people who were poor/loners? So instead of finding out why they were like that, they prayed for a better day. Just like then, it's the same now but people are conditioned more heavily seeing how far the damn book has come and they need people to believe it so they believe in an end so yeah. World governments, celebrities, phonies use religion for brain washing, making cash, confusion and control blah blah blah. Not to mention the amount of religions there are only divide us. If we drop the scriptures, writings, books that are really the guidelines on how to live THEN maybe we can overcome the obstacle that truly holds us back, government. But until then, we're just wasting our time with discussions like these that go absolutely no where.

reply to post by ANOK


Sorry, here's the original link that we were talking about.

www.proof-of-evolution.com...

The mention of "chimp" sized brains must have stuck with me.

Along with articles like this...

www.dailymail.co.uk...

Originally posted by rhinoceros

Originally posted by Deetermined
What reason would there be for "desert people" to make up historical or genealogical records a few thousand years ago?

The same, Tolkien saw necessary in e.g. Lord of the Rings and Silmarillion. Many mythologies have a long list of names. So what? It doesn't prove anything, except that some people wrote lists of names. So again, prove that people used lived nearly 1,000 years.

Really? Mythology shows a list of genealogy?

I'd love to see how that one reads.

Do you have it?

By the way, based on your "empirical records", how far back do those records go?

Originally posted by Meaningless
This is a pointless discussion! The bible was created to control the minds of the weak and vulnerable, you know the people who were poor/loners? So instead of finding out why they were like that, they prayed for a better day. Just like then, it's the same now but people are conditioned more heavily seeing how far the damn book has come and they need people to believe it so they believe in an end so yeah. World governments, celebrities, phonies use religion for brain washing, making cash, confusion and control blah blah blah. Not to mention the amount of religions there are only divide us. If we drop the scriptures, writings, books that are really the guidelines on how to live THEN maybe we can overcome the obstacle that truly holds us back, government. But until then, we're just wasting our time with discussions like these that go absolutely no where.

This might be changing the topic, but based on what we see going on in the Middle East today, and based on what the Bible has said about it in the past and future, how does everyone so easily brush it off? This book is not only about how we're supposed to live our lives. It's a record of what's happened to Israel and what's going to happen to Israel. Don't any of you find it a little ironic that such a little country has gotten so much attention?

Have you ever thought about the fact that (according to the Bible) that human life probably began in the Middle East and it will probably all end there as well?

reply to post by Deetermined
They control the world (most governments) of course they're going to use their own prophecies to destroy mankind. Why do you think religion is embraced and encouraged constantly? Gets you in this dangerous mind set that refuses to look at the facts of the world. Divides you from your fellow man or women (so you do not rise in numbers) and stuns scientific advancements. Sometimes I wished I was conditioned to believe in the same things just so I know how I feel and understand the world around me but of course I then wouldn't know I was brainwashed.

This world is headed towards disaster, not because something says so but because we're sitting here arguing over religion when the world is literally being pillaged and it's not any "demon" doing it. Evil thrives on ignorance and that is so true. You can believe your beliefs are untouched by the hands of greed I don't care, well I do but you can only do so much against an organized syndicate set out to taint the minds of babies around the world.

reply to post by Meaningless


Really? How did Israel set the whole world up for a financial collapse?

Were the Jews the ones who wrote the book on derivatives and how to market and disperse them throughout the world?

reply to post by Deetermined


There's another thread in this section on the first page that discusses various methods of dating fossils and rock layers. You should take a look.

I'm just going to throw these out there for you. Free evolution DVDs. They even pay shipping.

www.hhmi.org...

www.hhmi.org...

A couple good ones that cover human evolution. Why deny science to preserve outdated multi-translated moral guidelines? Evolution can be observed, in all creatures, humans included. We came from earth, just like all life here. Could there have been DNA tweaking along the way? It's possible, but humans definitely evolved here on earth during a 7 million year process. You can trace the features and characteristics all the way back. Compare brain size and other various features they all show slow change over time.

reply to post by Deetermined

Sure

Here's one. It's a very beautiful translation (and so old). easy read link below is creation

IN primeval times, a maiden,
Beauteous Daughter of the Ether,
Passed for ages her existence
In the great expanse of heaven,
O'er the prairies yet enfolded.
Wearisome the maiden growing,
Her existence sad and hopeless,
Thus alone to live for ages
In the infinite expanses
Of the air above the sea-foam,
In the far outstretching spaces,
In a solitude of ether,
She descended to the ocean,
Waves her coach, and waves her pillow.
Thereupon the rising storm-wind
Flying from the East in fierceness,
Whips the ocean into surges,
Strikes the stars with sprays of ocean
Till the waves are white with fervor.
To and fro they toss the maiden,
Storm-encircled, hapless maiden;
With her sport the rolling billows,
With her play the storm-wind forces,
On the blue back of the waters;
On the white-wreathed waves of ocean,
Play the forces of the salt-sea,
With the lone and helpless maiden;
Till at last in full conception,
Union now of force and beauty,
Sink the storm-winds into slumber;
Overburdened now the maiden
Cannot rise above the surface;
Seven hundred years she wandered,
Ages nine of man's existence,
Swam the ocean hither, thither,
Could not rise above the waters,
Conscious only of her travail;
Seven hundred years she labored
Ere her first-born was delivered.
Thus she swam as water-mother,
Toward the east, and also southward,
Toward the west, and also northward;
Swam the sea in all directions,
Frightened at the strife of storm-winds,
Swam in travail, swam unceasing,
Ere her first-born was delivered.

..

Originally posted by ANOK
I don't understand why you have to deny evolution to believe in an ultimate creator?

Seems silly to me.

Why has society become so black and white in it's thinking? The Human Race is supposed to become more enlightened, not fall into ignorant dogma.

Smart...Enlightened thinking. The two issues do not conflict with each other. Split Infinity

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Barcs

 

Inside one of your links was an interesting theory on how God allowed apes to evolve up to a point and then he breathed life into them by giving them a critical thinking brain and a soul making them the humans of today. I had never heard that one before.

www.proof-of-evolution.com...

However, on the rest of the information you provided, it only brings up more questions for me than answers, especially when it comes to dating fossils.

Science is relying so heavily on a radiocarbon dating system that's only 63 years old and has known flaws. Is there anything from a scientific standpoint that shows that they've found a way to overcome the issue of heat throwing the entire dating system off?

WOW! I mean...WOW! OK! I have read enough baloney about GOD...APES and Humans. First of all....we know two of the three actually exist...the two being Apes and Humans.
Secondly we KNOW...as a FACT via both GENETICS and FOSSIL RECORDS that Humans and their various evolved forms and Apes and their various evolved forms...began splitting down different paths or more aptly....we are all commmon anscestors of the beginning of primate evolution which started 85 Million Years Ago. As time passed...like branches on a tree...there were different evolutionary directions for development of all the Great apes and all the Evolutionary Forms of Early Human...LUCY....a direct Human ancestor was around 2.3 to 2.4 Million Years ago. Arti discovered not so long ago was even older.

All life on this Planet can be traced back to a Single Celled Organism via comparing Hundreds of complete Mapped Genomes of Humans and other Animals. EVOLUTION IS UNDENIABLE. Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity


So, what changed in order to give humans a critical thinking brain and emotions?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by SplitInfinity

 

So, what changed in order to give humans a critical thinking brain and emotions?

Did you not read a single thing I said? The brain size evolved slowly. Look at the skulls in the link I posted. You can verify it with scientific studies on the cranial capacity. Those things didn't suddenly happen. They developed slowly as brain size and intelligence increased.

You should also know that plenty of animals also experience emotions.

reply to post by Barcs


So, if this all happens so slowly, why have we seen such great advances in science and technology just within the last 150 years? What changes have we seen in the brain in this short time frame?

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Barcs

 

So, if this all happens so slowly, why have we seen such great advances in science and technology just within the last 150 years? What changes have we seen in the brain in this short time frame?

The reason for the boom in the past 150 years is because of advancements in science, particularly in medicine. With that, came a HUGE population increase, which led to more brains working together and much faster gathering of knowledge and development of technology. If not for the dark ages and religious suppression this technology boom would have probably happened much earlier, and you can't really discount the possibility of an advanced civilization existing in the past. Intelligence hasn't changed significantly in 200,000 years.

Besides, people have been developing technology for much longer than 150 years. Go back to the industrial revolution, that started 250 years ago, and before that the Renaissance period, and even further back agriculture. Don't forget a glacial period ended about 10,000 years ago, since then it's been slow progression with a bunch of revolutions and technology booms. Capitalism also has something to do with that, but it has nothing to do with evolution, just the ability of humans to work together and learn things.

reply to post by rhinoceros


I like it!

Thanks!

Originally posted by Deetermined


That's just it, the reason both sides have never come together is because neither is capable of "proving" anything in man's terms so I wouldn't be looking for proof of spirit, unless you're open enough to listen to other people who claim they have experienced it.

Problem is, of the two 'sides' only one is making any claims, the theist side (god, spirits etc). The other side, the atheist side, merely rejects those claims. The burden of proof is with those making the claim, and as of yet in this instance they have not met it. To quote a fairly well known scientist "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence", and your book does not meet that requirement.

I've been reading your posts and responding to them, as I have with many many theists for many years, so its fair to say I am open enough to listen to those who claim to have experienced such phenomenon. However I am not gullible to accept such extraordinary claims at face value.

Originally posted by DeeterminedTake ChaoticOrder for example. Someone who claims to have had spiritual experiences that science would say is bogus, but clearly believes in science more than God. He/she claims that these experiences can probably be explained through some scientific theory, but not all. In other words, there is no explanation for it, nor will there ever be, without faith. Unfortunately, most people won't develop faith until they've had a personal spiritual experience of their own, and even that can be questionable. How much proof is enough? Probably none.

How do you know those experiences will never be explained by scientific enquiry? 'faith' is the laziest and easiest explanation, it requires no thought, no investigation, no effort.......just gullibility.

Originally posted by DeeterminedYes, I believe humans are exempt from the evolutionary process. The Bible tells us.....

And we're back at square 1, validate the bible is in-fact true before attempting to use it to prove anything...

Originally posted by DeeterminedPeople need to start exercising their spirit instead of only their minds for them to work together. Everyone has a spirit, but they don't realize it, because they don't exercise it. Prayer helps.

Ive heard 3-4 different explanations for what 'spirit' or 'spirituality means in just this thread alone. If you were to venture out into world you would encounter a different definition for those words for every person you met. They are completely useless and I think that stems from the fact they don't actually refer to anything at all, apart from hopeful thinking maybe.

A single pair of hands at work are worth more than a billion clasped in prayer.