CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 trillion over 10 yrs(double Obama's esitmate)

reply to post by xuenchen


The liberals really want the Canadian Public Option down here in the USA.

Step 1: Force the current health care companies out of business.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
reply to post by xuenchen

 

The liberals really want the Canadian Public Option down here in the USA.

Step 1: Force the current health care companies out of business.

Even if that would work ....

There's no way the Feds put the insurance companies out of business.

unless .......

well no that won't work either.

ObamaCare is fueling their engines, not plugging the gas tanks.

I always thought the "public option" big push by Harry Reid was just an appeasement,
since he knew full well it would never happen.

Maybe if all the corruption and theft would stop.
But even then.....

reply to post by xuenchen


Exactly but the big different that we all be paying for is the mandated part of it, but hell Obama is counting with all the employment that the "new enforcement offices" I mean the" offices to enforce" I mean the" new gestapo health care enforcements" I can not get right, the offices to "help the people" get their mandated healthcare will provide, hell they will even be getting the money if they can from your taxable income.

That's what was missing from the health care before Obama.

Wow...that's alot of dough...

Guess we better stop killing and bombing and sending troops in to places that don't ever foot the bill. Maybe if the military contractors became general contractors and built bridges instead of bombs...who knows...

but mostly...

ask me if I care...we are falling apart anyway...no one is going to have to pay the bill when it's a dissolved republic....

Obama Care and the 55 mph statute - what do they have "in common?" Way back the Federal government tried to enact a "Nation-wide" speed limit of 55 mph. It was ruled UNconstitutional. Why ?

Lack of federal jurisadiction. The United States of America is limited to the little 5 square miles or so of the District of Columbia. The rest of this physical nation is called The States of the Union ; the States united ; or techinically, as per the U.S. Code - "without the United States. "
Statutes passed by our federal CONgress can only be forced upon Washington, D.C. and property "owned solely and exclusively by the federal government."

Back to the 55 mph statute. Once the feds learned that they could not force it upon the States of the Union somegenius said withhold federal Highway Trust funds IF the States do not enact identical legislation.

Guys, that is called blackmail, pure and simple, and for a majority of the States it worked. ObamaCare is in the same boat. I am wondering what the feds will do to blackmail the States this time . Maybe withhold Medicare funds? back to Highway monies, or ??

The States must get some new, stronger gonads to fight off this runaway federal government. I have run for office, and won, once. Lost at Congress. You all need to run, start local and State.
"For evil men to succeed all that is required is for Good men to do - nothing."

reply to post by juristbooks


Interesting and informative. I am a proponent of state power over federal power and throughout the decades (and centuries) federal power has increasingly tried (and succeeded) in expanding it's power over state jurisdiction. One simply needs to look at the obvious MJ contradiction in recent times as an example of that.

Take a look at the CBO report for yourselves!!

Go to:
cbo.gov...
and click on the PDF document

On the very first page it says that the new estimate for the first ten years of the program is $50 Billion LESS than what was previously estimated. In other words, the program is more, not less, affordable than previously thought!

Leave it to the Republicans, the Teabaggers and the other ftards to try to twist this into the reverse of what it says!

Originally posted by Shoonra
Take a look at the CBO report for yourselves!!

Go to:
cbo.gov...
and click on the PDF document

On the very first page it says that the new estimate for the first ten years of the program is $50 Billion LESS than what was previously estimated. In other words, the program is more, not less, affordable than previously thought!

Leave it to the Republicans, the Teabaggers and the other ftards to try to twist this into the reverse of what it says!

We cannot afford ObamaCare.

It is also unconstitutional. The SCOTUS will save us all June 2012.

" I told you so"....

Know this … there has never been a government operated health care program that cost anywhere near what the politicians who pushed it on you said it would cost. It’s always more --- it’s always MUCH more. The politicians lie – but they know you’ll buy it. After all, that’s what our education system is designed to produce --- gullible voters.

Here are some bullet points:

•In 1965, the House Ways and Means Committee estimated that the hospital insurance program of Medicare - the federal health care program for the elderly and disabled - would cost $9 billion by 1990. The actual cost that year was $67 billion.


•In 1967, the House Ways and Means Committee said the entire Medicare program would cost $12 billion in 1990. The actual cost in 1990 was $98 billion.


•In 1987, Congress projected that Medicaid - the joint federal-state health care program for the poor - would make special relief payments to hospitals of less than $1 billion in 1992. Actual cost: $17 billion.


•The list goes on. The 1993 cost of Medicare's home care benefit was projected in 1988 to be $4 billion, but ended up at $10 billion. The State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP), which was created in 1997 and projected to cost $5 billion per year, has had to be supplemented with hundreds of millions of dollars annually by Congress.

And I say OH Hell NO!!!!! this can't be allowed to happen.....

When the private sector can’t keep up with the demands of this federal mandate, this will leave the door wide open for the government to swoop in and “save our healthcare system.” Single-payer – which is the way Democrats say “complete and absolute control over your health care”, here we come!

Neil Boortz

reply to post by relocator


ObamaCare is doomed.

We simply cannot afford it.

I am sure by the time 4 years is up, it will have already spent over 2 trillion. We all know how good our governments are at balancing the books

reply to post by Eurisko2012


Tell me about it...my copay has gone from $25 to $40 and my deductible has gone from $500 to $1,000 thru my works group policy. We did let go about half our employees and this is one reason our company had to switch ins. plans. But after going through all the plans available this was the best they had to offer. And if you choose HMO you will pay an extra $500 deductible for out patient surgry where as with the ppo you don't have an extra out patient surgery copay. Crazy and confusing....oh and they're only giving you 4 days to make up your mind and turn in your paperwork. Geezzzz....

reply to post by relocator


It sounds they are already spitting on the Constitution.

Even before the the old spit is dry !

I say rename the thing "Ophlem-o-care.

Originally posted by marg6043

I would have taken your stance, with not problems if the health care was free, even if we had to pay more for entitlement programs or one was created for the purpose of supporting Universal health care, or just fix what we got already, but in this instance most of the money that Obama is going to utilized is going to the training and operations of the biggest scam artist of all, the health care industry and their mandated health care thanks to Obamacare, more money into the hands of private industries to gouge the tax payer, while enforcement offices will be operating to make sure you pay the dues.

The irony.

No. I cannot support healthcare if it is free. Not in these times, with the damocles sword of 15 trillion dollar debts over american heads. Perhaps one day when the national GDP is double of what it is today, it can be considered. Otherwise, right now, everyone will have to co-pay through insurance.

No doubt the insurance and health industry players are looking at a windfall. But market forces will be at play to keep competitive prices down.

No doubt the health industry is spiralling out of control with costs, there are ways and means to tackle this problem. I find it downright an atrocity when a bed, with a mechanism that can recline and tilt, can cost more than a pre=owned car. It has lesser parts and yet, the cost is outrageous compared to the car of many parts.

They claim on intellectual rights. I call it BS, cos if they truly care for intellectual rights, then they should have paid our ancestors whom gave them metallurgy and concepts freely. How much does a patent holder or CEO of a health industry wants to achieve? Millions, billions? Heck! We came into this world with nothing and will leave with nothing anyway. Why the greed for $$$ a the expense of the sick and infirm? Had mandkind's conscience sunk so low today.

By all means, let them have their greed, while Society will figure out ways to claw it back from them, through creative ways such as taxation, labour laws, ignorances of lobbyists, etc.

Humanity WiLL and MUST, do all they can, to bring the spiralling upward inflation of healthcare down. As they have well paid consultants and lobbyist, the People will have to utilise the Power of Masses to confront them.

Originally posted by relocator
reply to post by Eurisko2012

 

Tell me about it...my copay has gone from $25 to $40 and my deductible has gone from $500 to $1,000 thru my works group policy. We did let go about half our employees and this is one reason our company had to switch ins. plans. But after going through all the plans available this was the best they had to offer. And if you choose HMO you will pay an extra $500 deductible for out patient surgry where as with the ppo you don't have an extra out patient surgery copay. Crazy and confusing....oh and they're only giving you 4 days to make up your mind and turn in your paperwork. Geezzzz....

Hang on. Help is on the way.

When ObamaCare is thrown away we will see a better solution.

Originally posted by xuenchen
You seem to be assuming that most people have no insurance.

The fact is, most do.

AND, many are on Medicaid.

AND, the same ones on Medicaid now, will remain there !! right?

AND, many will be included in Medicaid soon enough as long as jobs continue to dwindle away.

AND, many employers will force the "exchange" plans to be implemented.

What exactly is wrong with the current system ?

Your post is based upon the ASS U ME d presumption that 'most' americans are on medicaid.

That is a false perception. Many more have no medical insurance to speak of. It is often the poor and the middle classes whom have too many bills to pay with their slave wages slogged for, to place the lowest priority for insurance of any form, are are sadly lacking of it.

But unfortunately, human mortality and fraility is real, just as death and taxes are the only sure thing in civilised societies. It is the number 1 priority all human must take care first, for if one is sick, every single cent you saved may not be even enough to pay for the inflationary rising medical costs. Thus medical insurance is necessary.

In a free society with humans having free will, medicaid for ALL will seem an imposition. Some will scorn, deride and even react violently to it. I am a supporter of medicaid for all, and fully aware they will venge their anger if not violence at me, but it is ok.

Because, as sure as the sun that sets each day, human frailities will occur at some point in life, and they will be glad healthcare insurance had been imposed upon. They will thank folks like me, but it is not accolades that the insignificant nobody me seeks for, only they may be saved for each human life is precious and means something special to another, rather to choose to die because they cannot afford uninsured healthcare.

No citizen or even human must claim that it is better to die than to fall sick.

Employers who have to pay more must share their wealth. Without a healthy workforce, they would have no company in the first place to help them earn their profits. There is only so much we can earn, and after the 3rd luxury car, one realizes money isnt everything or something we can lug along in the next life.

For those employers whom cannot afford even healthcare, then they have no right to set up a company. If one does not have the capital, or the biz concept to earn sustainable honest revenue that provides for all fairly, one had no right to set up a biz. Better he become a roadsweeper to earn an honest day labour instead of screwing up his human workers.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

Your post is based upon the ASS U ME d presumption that 'most' americans are on medicaid.

Sorry,

please re-read my post.

" 'most' americans are on medicaid "

isn't even mentioned or even suggested !!

the rest of your post has some good points.

Your OP is bunk...no offense, just the truth.

From Forbes magazine

Anti-Obamacare Forces Introduce Their Latest Effort To Mislead The Public

On Tuesday, the Congressional Budget Office released its 2012 estimate on the ten- year projected cost of the Affordable Care Act. Instantly, the anti-Obamacare crowd took to the airwaves and social media to proclaim that the numbers reveal the costs of the Affordable Care Act to be double what was promised when the law was passed.

Wow. That’s some scary stuff.

Good thing it is a complete and utter falsehood.

I suppose it should not come as a great surprise that the opponents of Obamacare would mobilize—given that the CBO report actually estimates a net decrease in the costs of health care reform totaling $51 billion when compared to last year’s estimates. The last thing those who oppose the law want is Candidate Obama running around the country talking about how the estimated cost of his landmark health care reform are actually going down.

Indeed, not only is the GOP pitch a gross distortion of the truth, this is one of those all too rare moments where I get to actually prove the meme to be nothing more than another effort to confuse Americans.

How?

By simply asking you to read the report. It’s easy.

www.forbes.com...


This is where you tell me Forbes magazine is communist liberal media.

reply to post by Indigo5


If ObamaCare is so wonderful, then why is the 2 year anniversary being ignored

by the White House???

Obama should be leading a parade down Pennsylvania Avenue.

Everyone knows the liberals - low balled - the cost of ObamaCare.

It's going to be found unconstitutional by the SCOTUS on June 29, 2012 so

who cares? On July 1, 2012 we will go back to complaining about the high price

of gas.

reply to post by Indigo5


I'll just have to agree to disagree with you and with a Forbes columnist. I've tried to read the CBO report and it would seem that one would need to have a masters in forensic accounting to decipher it. Trying to estimate numbers on this monstrosity is a complete bust all the way down to Obama's original estimate.

Here's the problem, we are trying to calculate the real costs of more regulations, more taxes, and an indefinite increase in government control and the related expenses associated with that control. The fact that the target continues to move in both directions is troubling. If they can't properly forecast the unknowns of expenses how in the hell can they project a net decrease of $51 Billion. (details of that net decrease?)

I'll surrender and just say its all BS and its all an unknown. Unknowns are dangerous to a fragile economy.

I wish I could just change the title of this thread to suggest that the costs will be unknown until the bills come rolling in. They are just playing with numbers to offset the reality of this mess. Repeal it and reform our healthcare system properly. ONE step at a time. The panacea approach fails especially when the govt. steps in.
Obamacare is full of gimmicks and slight of hand tricks. Let's flashback to 2009 to see something that makes sense.

Another gimmick pushes much of the legislation’s costs off the federal budget and onto the private sector by requiring individuals and employers to purchase health insurance. When the bills force somebody to pay $10,000 to the government, the Congressional Budget Office treats that as a tax. When the government then hands that $10,000 to private insurers, the CBO counts that as government spending. But when the bills achieve the exact same outcome by forcing somebody to pay $10,000 directly to a private insurance company, it appears nowhere in the official CBO cost estimates — neither as federal revenues nor federal spending. That’s a sharp departure from how the CBO treated similar mandates in the Clinton health plan. And it hides maybe 60 percent of the legislation’s total costs. When I correct for that gimmick, it brings total costs to roughly $2.5 trillion (i.e., $1 trillion/0.4).

Here’s where things get really ugly. TPMDC’s Brian Beutler calls “the” $2.5-trillion cost estimate a “doozy” of a “hysterical Republican whopper.” Not only is he incorrect, he doesn’t seem to realize that Gregg and I are correcting for different budget gimmicks; it’s just a coincidence that we happened to reach the same number.

When we correct for both gimmicks, counting both on- and off-budget costs over the first 10 years of implementation, the total cost of ObamaCare reaches — I’m so sorry about this — $6.25 trillion. That’s not a precise estimate. It’s just far closer to the truth than President Obama and congressional Democrats want the debate to be.

www.cato-at-liberty.org...