HC's Ancient Aliens MINDBLOWING episode "The NASA Connection".

I'd like to point out one thing really... to me it's moot. Erich Von Daniken introduced many people to the possibility of Ancient Astronauts/Aliens whatever you wish to call them.

I don't recall him saying ALIENS did anything, he certainly IMPLIES it, he has a way of using QUESTION MARKS, go (re)read "Chariots of the gods", there's over 150 (approx) question marks to each of his so called STATEMENTS.

I'm taking a break from reading about stuff like this, but this thread caught my eye. Sometimes I need to step back, look around, and hope to catch a glimpse of the big picture.

Peace.

Once again, most of the skeptics and debunkers here are using a quite effective form of subterfuge.

First, the AA theory IS quite scientific, thank you.

Every hypothesis is unproven, and starts with a bias. You are looking for the answer to a specific question. You can only measure that which you have the tools for measuring. The fact is that every evidence has been provided, many studied in human labs ad nauseum. You see only what you are looking at.

Only if there is any meat to it can a hypothesis even BECOME a theory.

Which unequivocally proves that there IS meat to it. This episode is just that, AN episode.

Consider, just for a moment, the fact that this theory, as a whole, is the only theory that makes any sense whatsoever when you factor in all of the otherwise IGNORED historical anomalies in our collective cultural record.

No one can provide you with proof. Find you own.

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by Sly1one

 

The thing I don't understand is why everybody brings up cranes when they mention these structures. If something's heavy it much easier to push it than lift it. This also explains why pyramids are so prevalent throughout the world. If you are pushing large blocks then you will need ramps to get the blocks to a higher level. If you use the ramps the natural shape your structure will take is that of a pyramid. To me this seems like the most rational explanation to these mysteries and it doesn't involve the use of high-technology or aliens.

I think the cranes are brought up to illiustrate the insane size and weight of the stones and what exactly it takes to move them...I didn't necesarrily mean they NEEDED cranes and only cranes to do the job...just that we would have difficulty even today with our best technology duplicating what the ancients have.

Wasn't even getting into the pyramids...was talking about Baalbek. The Egpytian pyramid ramps seem like a silly idea because

A) a straight ramp would have been an engeneering wonder in and of itself and there is absolutely no evidence of there ever being a ramp of that magnitude being utilized to creat a pyramid.

B) a spiral ramp is somewhat the same deal, although more efficient the ramp itself would have been a construction process in and of itself that makes the whole notion impractical for the period of time the pyramids were said to have been built in.

Anyway my ideas about the ancients aren't based solely off the pyramids or baalbek, its the culmination of ancient structures and engeneerign that constantly illustrates a very sophisticated ability to cut, move, manipulate extremely large and varying pieces of stone.

Anciencts who were apparently not supposed to be in contact with eachother were building pyramids all over the world...

I mean the list goes on and on and at the very least mainstream history isn't willing to account for and address some of these HUGE wrenches in their gears regarding the mainstream view of ancient history...I don't know what our history was really like but the current model put forth doesn't make one bit of sense at all...to me anyway.

I too found the episode mildly interestingly old news and have heard all this from the parties involved...before.

Sadly, each part and person in that episode have their own de-bunkers as to their crediblility, and have been hacked apart and put thru the ringer many times before too.

Personally, I believe the facts, but you have to be careful with TV and video. It was no way a form of "disclosure", and was and is produced for "entertainment-purposes" only, and was/is/does not show anything, that wasnt commercially motivated to sell products.

For that purpose alone...it will be hacked, whacked and sacked apart by those wont will not accept it because of that. Sadly...thats like believing the Sesame Street characters are real...because they are on tv.

Now if we can get a couple country's Presidents, scientists, astronauts etc to break into your radio, web and tv programming to make an official "disclosure" finally at-last...that would be better...but still wont be taken as matter-of-fact.....BECAUSE it was on tv, radio, web and in your newspaper.

Remember. "Ancient Aliens" is heavily commercial and making millions in advertising revenue for the products they are selling during the show...and that is the producers intent. Not to get out any "breaking news!" or fantastic "revelations"...just to sell "Gieko Insurance" or "Sham-wow" cleaning products..or those pans that dont stick.

And thats the only reason shows exist...is to sell you "products" and "on-line Colleges".

Because of that...we have to take everything with one eye squinting....

Originally posted by babybunnies
SOME of what this show has to say is of minor passing interest, hardly mindblowing.

The biggest problem with this show is that they through all proper scientific research methods out the window.

They start with the assumption that "everything has something to do with Aliens" and then try and persuade their viewers to their point of view. It's incredibly bad journalism.

Science and Journalism starts by observing phenomena and then tries to explain it.

this is where science has to be able to "jump off the page" and put things into context. If you break everything down to quanta you don't see the big picture. Science needs to grow up and admit its shortcomings.

reply to post by 1AnunnakiBastard

"lost" is nasa's way of saying "disposed".

Originally posted by Furbs
I am an educated pretentious prick. I got my Masters in Art History at Michigan State University, my wife got one of her undergrad degrees in Anthropology and is now working on her PhD. at UO. So between the two of us, we have kicked around the idea of "Ancient Aliens" a few times, and you know what?

It's bull#.

Wow, I guess you two are about as much important for ufology, as Pierre and Maria Curie were for chemistry.

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by Quibbler

 

And there's your argument from ignorance. They see that we don't have an answer to these mysteries and as a result they just say aliens did it. They have no proof for that though. All they have is, "We don't know. Therefore, aliens."

I think it's more like, "Our ancestors say literally it was aliens" and now today with scientific investigation of the physical evidence (such as the flower of life symbols at Abydos) we can conclude it took much more advanced technology to do these things. Then you guys argue from ignorance and say "Well you can't doubt our ancient human counterparts for their ingenuity, maybe they had some advanced technology that was forgotten?".

You guys need to grow up and accept the fact we are not alone.

yup great videos.

reply to post by kerazeesicko

We are not making a blind conclusion that it was aliens, the people who recorded the history TELL us it was aliens. What part of "from another world" do you not get?

Originally posted by Rockpuck

The government has a reason for the UFO cover up. I don't know what it is..

I think it has evolved from keeping us from panicking to them now wanting to keep free energy out of our hands. the technologies involved are light years beyond fossil fuels.

Originally posted by ThePhilosopherKing7
reply to post by Illustronic

 

What is 'alien'. exactly?

something smarter than us

reply to post by liejunkie01


did you also do a quick search on how high the crane can lift said weight...


don't know something? don't pretend to be an expert.

Originally posted by JimOberg

Originally posted by babybunnies
They start with the assumption that "everything has something to do with Aliens" and then try and persuade their viewers to their point of view. It's incredibly bad journalism. .

You have to realize it's not journalism or anything close.

These kinds of shows make money by guaranteeing advertisers an audience who will believe ANYthing.

Look at the ads. From them you can follow the money... and then the editorial guidance.

Ads?

Uhhmm, hands up all of you who seen these ads...

No...

Ok they must be dumber than a golfboll then to put ads..
They aint makin money on me...As im not one of the
"viewers" looking at ads...

Originally posted by kerazeesicko
The Ancient Astronaut Flaw and it’s not minor!

Came across this article by accident...if anyone is interested.

"The “laws” they instilled – Hammurabi’s code, for example and the Ten Commandments – have been eschewed by most of mankind, in practical application."

that's why they return after a period of time. When they return they usually punish a bunch of people (hopefully they do it to the people who are covering up these lies), have us build a couple temples in their honor and then throw us a bone with some technology or information and then they skee-dattle. Who knows where they go or IF they even go anywhere? They may just go into stealth mode watching us from behind the scenes. We're probably like pets to them. Hopefully they feel responsible for our well being.

Originally posted by Pauligirl

Originally posted by 1AnunnakiBastard

3,000 years before David Icke or any other reptilian-conspiracist have ever existed, ancient civilizations saw something that look like humanoid-reptile beings. It marked their lives so deeply and it was important enough to make them depict their images in carved reliefs, statues and even entire edifices... But waaait.....

They were all "hallucinating over fairy tales and anthropomorphizing elements of nature."

Why don't we hear about the humanoid-bovine beings? The Egyptians had statutes of them too.

Genetically engineered chimeras, the lab freaks of the Anunnaki were all over the Egypt and Mediterranean, despite scholars claim that they are nothing but myths. Satyrs, centaurs, gorgons, harpies, minotaurs, you name it. BUT according to some modern abductees, there's a humanoid-canine and a feline race in Sirius, what perhaps may be the origin of Anubis, Sekhmet and Bastet. I think they were actual extraterrestrials, not engineered beings.

Personally I think this thread in very entertaining! Neither side can present proof other than "What I just said is TRUE, therefore you are all idiots!". The universe (of which we are part) is far more complex than will be satisfied and settled on either TV or in this forum. I'm not sure if we would even know the truth if we saw it, but threads like exercise the mind and provide an arena for developing critical reading and thinking skills. Keep it up!

While I believe NASA isn't telling us everything, these shows are too fast and loose with the facts.

One example, the Mercury mission patch:



They say this represents the ancient Egyptian Ankh symbol:



Well, not really, it represents the symbol for the planet Mercury:



en.wikipedia.org...

Someone posted something like this before, but the feeling I get watching these shows is:

Originally posted by nitro67

I am not insulted. Congratulations on your degree in art and I respect your opinion that the ancient astronaut theory is bull, at least you admit to being pretentious. Could you offer a few suggestions of books to counter the theories of someone like Childress or Daniken? Who, I assume, you would call "bad scientists" Please enlighten us on "the truth" What would the mainstream/what you are taught in school, people have to say about the ancients belief in the gods? Or the positioning of the pyramids of Egypt? Just superstition and coincedence? Deifying forces of nature.....

edit on 10-3-2012 by nitro67 because: (no reason given)

Do you know why there aren't a plethora of books to counter the theories of Childress or Daniken on the level they are trying to achieve? Because academics consider it a waste of time to even acknowledge the idiocy long enough to form an opinion on it. More than one credible scientist has been taken down by a reputation of acknowledging these faux-researchers in any respect higher than outcasts and showmen looking to make money.

When laymen can look at your theory and poke substantial holes in it with only the tiniest bit of effort, your theory could NEVER stand up to expert critical analysis. This is why a majority of the books written to blast Ancient Aliens theory are written by people with only limited education. Why would "Dr. Anthropology" take the time to write a 180 page paper on fraudulent claims that he knows will only gain him a reputation as someone who will suffer fools?

Sure, there are those in the scientific community who have taken on outlandish claims because the fly in the face of their particular branches of academia, like Ed Krupp. You will find books by others, especially up until the 80's when Academia realized that these guys weren't going to take criticisms of their theories seriously.

To answer a few of your questions;

Could you offer a few suggestions of books to counter the theories of someone like Childress or Daniken?

No, I cannot. I have not read any books that I would recommend to counter their theories. I am sure there are books out there that counter each point made by these charlatans, but I am not versed enough to offer you these titles. My advice would be to start a thread and ask for someone to offer some good counter argument books.

What would the mainstream/what you are taught in school, people have to say about the ancients belief in the gods?

Considering funerary practices are actually found to be older than our species, with neanderthal cremating and burying the dead, some theories have emerged suggesting that "Gods" came out of our earliest attempts at logical thinking.

Example.

Caveman Joe contemplates where that mountain came from and looks down at his son playing in the dirt. Caveboy has mounded some of the dirt and it dawns on Caveman Joe that it looks like a smaller version of the mountain in the distance. If a baby could make such a small mound, and Joe could make a bigger one, how big did the person have to be to create that mountain? Of course, couple that with dreams of seeing loved ones that had died and superstitions begin to take shape.

The Third Chimpanzee: The Evolution and Future of the Human Animal by Jared Diamond might be a good book for your to read if you are further interested in this question. His writing is both intricate and accessible.

Or the positioning of the pyramids of Egypt?

Not sure which positioning you are referring to, but if you mean the 'Orion correlation' Ed Krupp wrote about hat about 15 years ago, I think, forgive me if I'm not 100% on the time, just trying to narrow it down for your own research when looking for his rebuttal. It was co-authored, I remember that, but I don't recall the other chap.

I will throw you a bone, however,

In all of our discussions, there is one thing we keep coming back to as something without a solid answer.

Where did mammals come from?

Maybe not a smoking gun for alien visitation, but no presented theories really do it for a majority of Academia.

Originally posted by stainlesssteelrat

Originally posted by Furbs
I am an educated pretentious prick. I got my Masters in Art History at Michigan State University, my wife got one of her undergrad degrees in Anthropology and is now working on her PhD. at UO. So between the two of us, we have kicked around the idea of "Ancient Aliens" a few times, and you know what?

It's bull#.

Wow, I guess you two are about as much important for ufology, as Pierre and Maria Curie were for chemistry.

And what are you doing? Reading rehashed garbage and watching television? I applaud your efforts.