Rising gas prices are due to free market forces...

reply to post by hawkiye


IMO, Free Enterprise does exist. Free Markets do not exist. There is a clear distinction.

You are free to engage in what ever enterprise you choose, including criminal endeavors.

The market system, the exchange of goods and services, does not function unless considerable effort is put into preventing criminal activities.

Who watches the watchers?

Keynesianism assumes the whole world should be run by experts, that it can be run better by experts. It is a totalitarian system.

Free market assumes that people can make good decisions (A prerequisite of democratic anything) and because the people making desicions know their local conditions better than a non-big-brother surveilience state, the economy will be more efficient.

Do you think the system will care about you more that you care about youself?

Rockefeller got his startup money from provisioning the Union during the Civil War (government cause), made his monopoly by using the railroads (government subsidy), and kept his monopoly by Prohibition preventing the developement of an alternate fuel, butanol.(goverment cause)

Part of big oil's monopoly was just plain luck that the waste products from the home lamp oil industry turned out to be more valuable than the original reason that the industry started.

Cultivating fast growing hemp for industrial fiber, chemicals, and oils to replace petrochemicals is illegal. (goverment cause)
The alcohol industry was stunted by prohibition.(government cause)

score
greed 1
luck 1
goverment 5


Airlines have alot of regular customers from the corporate and government worlds. Many independant taxi drivers derive all of their income from shuttling regular customers to the airport

Originally posted by Semicollegiate
Who watches the watchers?

Now here is a very valid point, it is the best point you have made IMO.


Keynesianism assumes the whole world should be run by experts, that it can be run better by experts. It is a totalitarian system.


Free market assumes that people can make good decisions (A prerequisite of democratic anything) and because the people making desicions know their local conditions better than a non-big-brother surveilience state, the economy will be more efficient.

This is why I am for local and small scale things being unregulated. Another good point

Do you think the system will care about you more that you care about youself?

No, but I do think that this means that I can win any dispute with a billion dollar organization.
I that the invisible hand (that doesn't exist) will extinguish fraud, prevent abuse, usury, collusion
or market making.

Rockefeller got his startup money from provisioning the Union during the Civil War (government cause), made his monopoly by using the railroads (government subsidy), and kept his monopoly by Prohibition preventing alternate fuel, buterol, developement.(goverment cause)

Part of big oil's monopoly was just plain luck that the waste products from the home lamp oil industry turned out to be more valuable than the original reason that the industry started.

Cultivating fast growing hemp for industrial fiber, chemicals, and oils to replace petrochemicals is illegal. (goverment cause)
The alcohol industry was stunted by prohibition.(government cause)

score
greed 1
luck 1
goverment 5

those are great examples of infiltration of a private force into the government -

If free market politicians talked about de stigmatizing Hemp I might think they and their
cause had merit. But they seem to think tax breaks for Billionaires are the be all end all
of free market ambition.

Airlines have alot of regular customers from the corporate and government worlds. Many independant taxi drivers derive all of their income from shuttling regular customers to the airport

Well I think Airlines are a very bad example to use as a free market success as it is the most regulated
industry in America, literally manned and regulated 24 hours a day. What is the point I'm missing?

reply to post by mastahunta


I think airline prices are low because they have dependable customer base. I wouldn't be suprised if the airlines recieve subsidies or favorable legislation. Historically, air power has been a United States forte, the best single technological reason for winning WW2. Air power is very American. Just an observation.

Those "free market politicians" claim to be free market. Don't beliebve them.
Hypothetically a free market person could run for office but he would have a free market life and so would not, as a rule, ever run for reeelction. Governmnet jobs should be no brainers that have to be done, like a fire watch.

Now they are closing refineries down to stifle supply and raise prices further.

Free market at work... they are free to act like criminals, so they do

Originally posted by mastahunta
Now they are closing refineries down to stifle supply and raise prices further.

Free market at work... they are free to act like criminals, so they do

If you had access to a finite material, and could charge more for your material if you lowered the amount that you made available, how is it criminal to do so?

Originally posted by Furbs

Originally posted by mastahunta
Now they are closing refineries down to stifle supply and raise prices further.

Free market at work... they are free to act like criminals, so they do

If you had access to a finite material, and could charge more for your material if you lowered the amount that you made available, how is it criminal to do so?

Furbs, if you are saying that America should eat PEE PEE so that the industry and billionaires can
further gouge the public, let's not go there. It is a vital resource, it is the blood of humanity, so
enjoy your position.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by hawkiye

 

IMO, Free Enterprise does exist. Free Markets do not exist. There is a clear distinction.

You are free to engage in what ever enterprise you choose, including criminal endeavors.

The market system, the exchange of goods and services, does not function unless considerable effort is put into preventing criminal activities.

What a ridiculous statement! There is no free enterprise without free markets! Without free and open markets there is no freedom to be enterprising and no free markets to operate in which is why the economy is tanking and jobs are dwindling. I can think of a half a dozen businesses I would consider trying if it were not for government regulation preventing me from even having a shot at being competitive or successful.

Originally posted by mastahunta

Originally posted by Furbs

Originally posted by mastahunta
Now they are closing refineries down to stifle supply and raise prices further.

Free market at work... they are free to act like criminals, so they do

If you had access to a finite material, and could charge more for your material if you lowered the amount that you made available, how is it criminal to do so?

Furbs, if you are saying that America should eat PEE PEE so that the industry and billionaires can
further gouge the public, let's not go there. It is a vital resource, it is the blood of humanity, so
enjoy your position.

edit on 18-3-2012 by mastahunta because: (no reason given)

edit on 18-3-2012 by mastahunta because: (no reason given)

I didn't 'say' anything. I asked a question.

Are you going to answer it or sidestep it?

Originally posted by hawkiye

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by hawkiye

 

IMO, Free Enterprise does exist. Free Markets do not exist. There is a clear distinction.

You are free to engage in what ever enterprise you choose, including criminal endeavors.

The market system, the exchange of goods and services, does not function unless considerable effort is put into preventing criminal activities.

What a ridiculous statement! There is no free enterprise without free markets! Without free and open markets there is no freedom to be enterprising and no free markets to operate in which is why the economy is tanking and jobs are dwindling.

OK, since there aren't any free markets then you agree that the government should address the
problem on behalf of the American citizen and put a stop to any extortionist practices, correct?

Originally posted by Furbs

Originally posted by mastahunta

Originally posted by Furbs

Originally posted by mastahunta
Now they are closing refineries down to stifle supply and raise prices further.

Free market at work... they are free to act like criminals, so they do

If you had access to a finite material, and could charge more for your material if you lowered the amount that you made available, how is it criminal to do so?

Furbs, if you are saying that America should eat PEE PEE so that the industry and billionaires can
further gouge the public, let's not go there. It is a vital resource, it is the blood of humanity, so
enjoy your position.

edit on 18-3-2012 by mastahunta because: (no reason given)

edit on 18-3-2012 by mastahunta because: (no reason given)

I didn't 'say' anything. I asked a question.

Are you going to answer it or sidestep it?

Because it is unethical, it is called market making... It should be a high crime