Greece 'a breath away from ground zero', PM warns

reply to post by Vitchilo


Thanks I found the link.
The whole interview with a Greek economist is interesting. The bit about Greece buying weapons from Germany comes after 26.00
rt.com...

Originally posted by mobiusmale

Originally posted by lacrimaererum
The fact that this scum used the term 'ground zero' to threaten the people of the country he is suppposed to be serving is a disgrace. He is merely an enforcer for the criminal IMF and EU.

This person has made his position quite clear forr what is about to unfold.

This is simply propaganda-speak.

How is this man, with (as far as I know) a spotless record of achievement in international finance and economics, "scum"? Based on what, do you make this personal insult?

..."the criminal IMF and EU"? So the International Monetary Fund is a criminal organization now...as is the entire European Union?

I would suggest that perhaps you have some kind of an agenda, and that you are attempting to put it forcefully forth, by the use of incendiary, term-bending, language...in place of reasoned argument.

I know that everything in Greece is now for sale.

My own country is also in the vice of the IMF and EU.

Soon we will be in the same situation. Everything will be sold off.

This is all happening to save banks.

the only people content with the EU and IMF are people who have financal interests they want protected.

People are tired of reasoned argument my friend. People are tired. People have been pushed too far.People have lost everything. People have nothing left to loose.

No more. This stops now.

It is strange this comes out because over here in Aus we have a paper called the financial review usually pretty good at looking at things and stated that Greece will shut the state down no one can enter or leave and internet will be severed and not one will be able to transfer Euros from the state. Then when they have this in place all Euros in the country will be stamped Greek Euro and untill they have all the Euros in that part of the union stamped they will open the borders will try and find the story on their website

Originally posted by nocollegeonsunday
The Greeks need to stop fighting and need to start thinking about how they intend to pay back the billions of pounds of English taxpayers money they have squandered.

A nuclear submarine parked off their coastline conducting testing of the weapons should make this easier.

how about looking at OUR British leaders for squandering our own money!

THis quantitative easing nonsense- if they had paid that DIRECTLY to the families in Britain instead of into the black hole of the banks it would have worked out around £15k per household- that would have cut debt and increased spending power, the economy would have had a massive boost!

Originally posted by lacrimaererum

I know that everything in Greece is now for sale.

My own country is also in the vice of the IMF and EU.

Soon we will be in the same situation. Everything will be sold off.

This is all happening to save banks.

the only people content with the EU and IMF are people who have financal interests they want protected.

People are tired of reasoned argument my friend. People are tired. People have been pushed too far.People have lost everything. People have nothing left to loose.

No more. This stops now.

Well, I can certainly sense your anger and outrage.

What Country are you referring to, when you say "we will be in the same situation"?

...and what people have lost everything because of the IMF and the EU?

Just by the way, on a personal note, I have always felt that the European Union was a bit of a "lofty idea", with limited chance of long-term success...given the enormous differences in culture, history and the relative economic strengths of the constituent members.

The Euro itself, while providing economic harbour of a sort, to the weaker members of the Union, at the same time removes the flexibility that individual nations have to balance inflation against debt-service.

In other words, if a nation has their own currency it has the option of "printing money" for a while...while flirting with the inflationary impact of doing so...to ensure that it can live up to its financial obligations. Greece has not had this flexibility, because it adopted the Euro...and must now pay its debts solely out of its own actual economic production (real GDP).

Originally posted by mobiusmale

Originally posted by lacrimaererum
The fact that this scum used the term 'ground zero' to threaten the people of the country he is suppposed to be serving is a disgrace. He is merely an enforcer for the criminal IMF and EU.

This person has made his position quite clear forr what is about to unfold.

This is simply propaganda-speak.

How is this man, with (as far as I know) a spotless record of achievement in international finance and economics, "scum"? Based on what, do you make this personal insult?

..."the criminal IMF and EU"? So the International Monetary Fund is a criminal organization now...as is the entire European Union?

I would suggest that perhaps you have some kind of an agenda, and that you are attempting to put it forcefully forth, by the use of incendiary, term-bending, language...in place of reasoned argument.

It depends what you would qualify as "criminal". Technically they are within the bounds of the law in their official capacity. So if you want to nitpick over words, you could settle with tyrannical and oppressive. One monetary policy over all of the countries in the EU is insanity. Countries like Greece and Portugal being bound to the same policy as Germany and France is nothing but a scam.

Boom, bust, collect. Nothing new.

The current monetary system is a fraud and is inherently corrupt. Blame the ruling banking elite for this.

The mission is The NWO and total slavery of mankind.
"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world". Carol Q Rothschild

They designed it this way to indebt and control countries and thus their citizens.

Investigation into this system revels the fact that debt even with fiscally responsible parties can never ever be repaid.
"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes her laws."
Mayer Amschel Rothschild

The "only" outcome is enormous debt and bankruptcy. This can never be avoided.

Because of this unpayable debt, the Bankers now own us...
"The ability to deal with people is as purchasable a commodity as sugar or coffee and I will pay more for that ability than for any other under the sun." J D rockefeller

War and thus chaos is one of their most profitable income streams...
"The way to make money is to buy when blood is running in the streets." John D Rockefeller

The only winners in this system are the bankers.
"History records that the money changers have used every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling the money and its issuance." J M Rothschild

No country is immune to this..
"I care not what puppet is placed on the throne of England to rule the Empire, ...The man that controls Britain's money supply controls the British Empire. And I control the money supply." Baron N M Rothschild

There is only one outcome to all this..... Worldwide Financial Collapse..

For the first time in its history, Western Civilization is in danger of being destroyed internally by a corrupt, criminal ruling cabal which is centered around the Rockefeller interests, which include elements from the Morgan, Brown, Rothschild, Du Pont, Harriman, Kuhn-Loeb, and other groupings as well. This junta took control of the political, financial, and cultural life of America in the first two decades of the twentieth century.

Greece is just the start of it.

"The few who could understand the system will either be so interested in its profits, or so dependent on its favours, that there will be no opposition from that class, while on the other hand, the great body of the people mentally incapable of comprehending the tremendous advantage that capital derives from the system, will bear its burdens without complaint, and perhaps without even suspecting that the system is inimical to their interests" J S Rothschild.

reply to post by starchild10

I watched the video from your link and I must say that this Dr. Varoufakis is dead wrong about the German public, although he is right about the effects of the austerity measures and the flow of money to the banks of course.

No one here thinks "Oh look the Greeks are bleeding, let's give them more loans" and I can assure you that no one is "appeased that Merkel is doing all she can to commit an act of horror to these greek people". (starting around 19 minutes... in the video)

That's just stupid.

Originally posted by dontshoot

It depends what you would qualify as "criminal". Technically they are within the bounds of the law in their official capacity. So if you want to nitpick over words, you could settle with tyrannical and oppressive. One monetary policy over all of the countries in the EU is insanity. Countries like Greece and Portugal being bound to the same policy as Germany and France is nothing but a scam.

Boom, bust, collect. Nothing new.

Well..I think that "criminal" means an activity that is outside of the law. Nothing really technical about it.

As per my previous post, I would agree that one monetary policy for all of the Countries of Europe is ill-advised...but not necessarily "insanity". All Unions have to start somewhere...in the beginning it might have seemed crazy to have the same monetary policy for New York as Nebraska - or the same policy for Ontario as Newfoundland.

Sorry to nitpick on words again...but how is the EU a "scam"?

reply to post by Lexx790


I confess...I am not a student of the whole NWO...Rothschild...Rockefeller...conspiracy thing.

So please, if you will, explain to me how it is to a banker's advantage to have all nations forced into bankruptcy?

It would seem to me more logical that they would want to keep the various national entities alive, but on life-support, so that they would remain dependent on the supply of more money (so that the bankers keep making their own money).

If you are a pusher...with only 200 or so possible clients for your drug (in this case money)...why would you want to kill them all off?

I must be missing something here...

"Banking was conceived in iniquity and was born in sin. The Bankers own the earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create deposits, and with the flick of the pen they will create enough deposits to buy it back again. However, take it away from them, and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear, for this would be a happier and better world to live in. But, if you wish to remain the slaves of Bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create deposits." Sir Josiah Stamp

Greece should Default and print their own money again.....

Its all going to fall like a house of cards...

The US money system's heading for collapse...and it's going to take the rest of the world with it...
goldnews.bullionvault.com...

reply to post by mobiusmale




that reference does not make sense, prior to the Euro there were functioning countries with their own currency, this was clearly not the case in the formation of the states or Canada

Originally posted by mobiusmale
reply to post by Lexx790

 

I confess...I am not a student of the whole NWO...Rothschild...Rockefeller...conspiracy thing.

So please, if you will, explain to me how it is to a banker's advantage to have all nations forced into bankruptcy?

It would seem to me more logical that they would want to keep the various national entities alive, but on life-support, so that they would remain dependent on the supply of more money (so that the bankers keep making their own money).

If you are a pusher...with only 200 or so possible clients for your drug (in this case money)...why would you want to kill them all off?

I must be missing something here...

In simple terms, so anyone can understand : once a nation / nations / WHOLE WORLD is bankrupt...IT IS CHEAPER TO BUY THEM !

You think is that the whole world goes bankrupt...the life ends? Nope, its just going to be RESTARTED, but in a way that is much more convinient for bankers.If the bankers (and their political minions) want to buy NOW the whole factories, small businneses, work force and land at CURRENT prices, well, they CANNOT.
But, once banckruptcy hits, they will buy everything at 10% or 5% or even FOR FREE.

You probably still think that power = money, thats why you can't comprehend the ideea why the elite wants the world go bankrupt.
Well, power is power and money is money.In simple terms, if you have now 100 BILLION US $ and i have now land worth 100 billion US $, i am MUCH MORE POWERFULL THAN YOU, because :
-i have the power over ANYONE on my land or ANYTHING above / under my land (buildings,agriculture or minerals, oil);
-you have only paper money that willgo puff after bancruptcy hits.

BUT, if you are one of the BANKSTERS, you can, after bancruptcy, buy MY LAND for a fraction of current value.
STILL , i can REFUSE to sell it, because, you know, ITS MY LAND.
But, if the land is STATE PROPERTY, and the STATE also goes puff, and the STATE is bankrupt, and the STATE is on banksters PAYROLL...the banksters will buy the land owned by the state, because, LAND with everything on / under it is MUCH MORE VALUABLE than money.

This is why the banksters and the elite want us to go banckrupt : TO BUY US , AND TO BECOME THEIR SLAVES.
And this is the REAL POWER : OWN THE PEOPLE.

Originally posted by ColCurious
reply to post by starchild10

 

I watched the video from your link and I must say that this Dr. Varoufakis is dead wrong about the German public, although he is right about the effects of the austerity measures and the flow of money to the banks of course.

No one here thinks "Oh look the Greeks are bleeding, let's give them more loans" and I can assure you that no one is "appeased that Merkel is doing all she can to commit an act of horror to these greek people". (starting around 19 minutes... in the video)

That's just stupid.

He says that this is Merkel's strategy which isn't the same as saying the people are buying it. That's how I read it anyway.

reply to post by mobiusmale


So just answer this simple question.

What will you do when YOUR country is asked to change it's constitution to pay for debts first? When the IMF controls YOUR economy and your government CANNOT say anything about it? When your pensions are cut by 20%? When the minimum salary is cut by 20%? When your taxes rise and when government services go down the drain? All that while the banks are getting hundreds of billions to pay for the fraud they have done?

What will YOU DO?? I bet you will be pissed and rightfully so.

So stop SHILLING for the banksters. If you want it or not, YOU ARE IN THE SAME BOAT AS THEM.

reply to post by mobiusmale


Im not sure what will come after the Bankruptcy of a country, that could be up to the creditors ( I know what happens when an individual is bankrupted) Printing their own money is the most logical step to start with but will it ultimately work ?( going to do some more study on this)
But the point is at the moment once one country falls the rest will follow like a house of cards..

Heres a couple of links....
www.drschoon.com...

And overview of the history of the Federal Reserve.
www.scionofzion.com...

An overview of the monetary system and the NWO ( and some idealism ) worth downloading if you havnt seen it before...Watch movie 1 and 4
zeitgeistmovie.com...

There is much more info out there on this subject..Im reading as much about this as I can and will contribute
more when I know more...All I know for certain is that the worlds financial system will collapse and it is becoming more obvious every month.....

reply to post by mobiusmale

It is not the "banksters" who got Greece into this mess...it is the Greeks themselves who have been living way beyond their means.

I am not blaming you for believing that. After all, those stereotypes concerning Greece, been portrayed daily for the last 2 years.

It is time for them to step back and get their house in order.

Did you know that the deal was voted and sealed with IMF, but at the last moment Merkel-EU demanded additional measures? We are more than willing, to get our house in order, but not under "Financial Terrorism". And i am quite sure that the mainstream media will make it look, like it´s Greece´s fault.

It astounds me that so many of the Greek people - and apparently a whole lot of other people - think that the proper way to respond to these offers of assistance is to refuse to pay back the money they have already borrowed to support their bloated lifestyles...

Refuse to pay back ? Let me ask you a question. How can a country pay back loans, if the same country cannot generate growth ? How can a country pay back loans, if the austernity measures, that been imposed are only killing growth, instead of restarting it.?

and to "threaten" to turn down additional funds that would serve to keep their families fed whiles they re-organize and re-chart their nation's economic course.

Really, is that so? To turn down additional funds, that only killing the growth, is the most sane thing to do.

But, a little bit of medicine is going to have to be swallowed along with all the sugar.

The Greeks swallowing the medicine, for the last 2 years, and now we are forced to swallow "sugarcoated slavery". You might willing to do so, but the normal Greek can not. Which is why they are protesting.

Peace

Originally posted by Recollector

In simple terms, so anyone can understand : once a nation / nations / WHOLE WORLD is bankrupt...IT IS CHEAPER TO BUY THEM !

You think is that the whole world goes bankrupt...the life ends? Nope, its just going to be RESTARTED, but in a way that is much more convinient for bankers.If the bankers (and their political minions) want to buy NOW the whole factories, small businneses, work force and land at CURRENT prices, well, they CANNOT.
But, once banckruptcy hits, they will buy everything at 10% or 5% or even FOR FREE.

Actually...if the bank already holds the mortgage on a property, or the secured loans on a business, they are already in the driver's seat. And if you have noticed, after foreclosure, the first thing a bank does is try is try to unload their newly acquired property (or business) to a third party - usually at a substantial loss to the bank.

They do not try to hold on to the asset, or to run the business...or, for that matter, try to make the owners or employees into their "slaves".

Bankruptcies are bad for banks - and can, and do, lead to the failure of the bank itself.

You probably still think that power = money, that's why you can't comprehend the idea why the elite wants the world go bankrupt.
Well, power is power and money is money. In simple terms, if you have now 100 BILLION US $ and I have now land worth 100 billion US $, I am MUCH MORE POWERFUL THAN YOU, because : - I have the power over ANYONE on my land or ANYTHING above / under my land (buildings,agriculture or minerals, oil);
-you have only paper money that will go puff after bankruptcy hits.

BUT, if you are one of the BANKSTERS, you can, after bankruptcy, buy MY LAND for a fraction of current value.
STILL , i can REFUSE to sell it, because, you know, ITS MY LAND.

There are some very big problems with your logic here.

First, the reason you "own" the land is because a Bank put up the money to buy it. You might have paid in 10% or 20% as a down payment...but a Bank paid the former owner the balance of 80-90%. They are out the money until you pay them back (with interest of course).

Until you pay the money back, the Bank actually really owns the property (under a mortgage agreement). If you fail to repay, the banks stands to lose a large portion of their 80-90% investment. You will lose your 20% (plus interest you have paid to date).

If you are in foreclosure, you do not have the right to "refuse" to sell. If you have already repaid your debt to the Bank, foreclosure is not an issue anyway...you finally do own the land.

But, if the land is STATE PROPERTY, and the STATE also goes puff, and the STATE is bankrupt, and the STATE is on banksters PAYROLL...the banksters will buy the land owned by the state, because, LAND with everything on / under it is MUCH MORE VALUABLE than money.

Trust me on this. The Bank itself will go bankrupt long before the "state" itself does...or coincident with it. And anyway, most national debt is in the form of Bonds and Notes that are not attached to Real Property...they are basically unsecured debts that would leave the lender with nothing if the Country itself defaulted.

The "Bank" would have nothing to claim against...

This is why the banksters and the elite want us to go banckrupt : TO BUY US , AND TO BECOME THEIR SLAVES.
And this is the REAL POWER : OWN THE PEOPLE.

Great hysterical rhetoric...based on nothing.

Originally posted by mobiusmale
Looks to me like he is a guy who is completely qualified, and has the personal international network, to deal with a national scale economic crisis...

This is non sequitur. If Papademos is this knowledgeable then why didn't he intercept the problem or raise awareness given his broad and extensive background. How can someone who is privy to the banking situation, and a national to boot, help lead his own people to such despair ? Sounds more like a class A douche and money grubbing worm as opposed to someone who would hold Greece's best interest at heart. He's one individual of course and not solely to blame but it sure as hell looks like he was helping to steer this ship aground. I'm sure the payouts were nice. I certainly do agree that the people of Greece heavily contributed to the problem as well and now have a responsibility.

brill

reply to post by Seed76

Refuse to pay back ? Let me ask you a question. How can a country pay back loans, if the same country cannot generate growth ? How can a country pay back loans, if the austernity measures, that been imposed are only killing growth, instead of restarting it.?

Look at it in terms of your own family finances. If your parents say that they will lend you some money, so that you can pay back some other debts - but that they will only do so if you cut back on your spending.

Does this mean you will have to cut back on your lifestyle? Yes. Does it mean that you will eventually be able to stand on your own two feet again? Also, yes.

Really, is that so? To turn down additional funds, that only killing the growth, is the most sane thing to do.

Well...go ahead and turn down the funds, while defaulting on your current debts. Let's see how much growth you will have in the Greek economy. Let's see if anybody wants to invest in Greece for the next 20 years or so.

The Greeks swallowing the medicine, for the last 2 years, and now we are forced to swallow "sugarcoated slavery". You might willing to do so, but the normal Greek can not. Which is why they are protesting.

Look...I get the anger, and the reluctance to "face the music". However, neither people or nations can go on forever spending more than they earn. At some point, the bill collectors will come to call.

And the consequences are usually less than pleasant or convenient.


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