Missouri teen girl gets 'life' for killing 9yr girl to 'find out what it felt like'...

Doesn't surprise me a little girl would commit cold blooded murder, considering the way parents raise their kids these days.

Originally posted by Glass
There is an alternative to prison; life in a psychiatric institution. In my opinion she should be institutionalized, but not in prison. She needs proper psychiatric care. Plus, psychologists could use her as a case study to help learn what happened to drive her to killing an innocent child, which could help prevent others from following in her footsteps.

Prison will change this girl. Being surrounded by other killers and psychopaths for 25+ years will set her on the path to becoming a professional killer. A lot of gangs do their recruiting in prisons. In 25 years time she will have met hundreds of contacts who could get her working for the toughest crimelords in the country.

Imagine it, you're 40 years old, fresh out of prison. Your whole life has passed you by, and the one memory you have of your childhood is the exhilaration of commiting cold blooded murder. What do you think you want to do for the rest of your life?

I absolutely agree with this. At fifteen, she should know better. However, from the sound of it, this girl already had some major issues and Prozac is known for doing really odd things to people. Yes, she should be locked away, but prison will make her worse. A psychiatric hospital for criminals seems more appropriate.

reply to post by getreadyalready

I saw my wife completely misdiagnosed repeatedly, and a family practitioner change her anti-depressents wildly, with no regard for the ramp up and ramp down and drug interactions. She had some mild depression over a disappointment in not getting into law school, and a half-ass doctor turned it into a life and death struggle that cost her a marriage and nearly cost her career, and on at least 2 occasions her life!

Hi getready....
I thought you just said earlier you are 18!
(which surprised me).

I don't mean to mislead. Clearly the doc involved with your wife's condition was not aware of the ramp-up and ramp-down requirements.

You are correct, many docs simply listen to the pharma sales people and prescribe the drug because they got a nifty pen or a yongo coffee cup or keychain for doing so. That is why it is SO CRITICAL to interview the doc before committing to their 'authority.'

Anyone considering taking medication, or undergoing any procedure, should do their own research; at the very least seek a second opinion.

Surely you would agree that a prescription drug specifically designed in a similar manner could be far more damaging to one's psyche than mere alcohol. Surely you can agree it has a factor in these cases.

Well, I would have to say 'mere' is not a word I would attach to alcohol.
So much depends on the client's brain chemistry, family history, genetic makeup, hormone levels. For some people, alcohol is not an issue. For others, it causes chaos.

It is a very delicate thing, deciding and trying and monitoring a person's reactions or responses to ANY chemical. The doc in the case of your wife was negligent, absolutely.
Any prescription can backfire, wreak havoc....it depends on the basic action of the substance on what process in the body/brain; and what predisposed or existing (co-morbid) conditions are present. Also, with time, a person's brain 'adjusts' to the newly introduced substance. One has to consider 'tolerance', and 'adaptability' of the brain.

Every person is wired differently. Every person's heritage, inherited characteristics, early environment and interaction, is unique. A skilled and competent practitioner does not 'willy-nilly' put some on a med and then just waltz away.

A doctor's job is to assess the patient's functioning in several areas, arrive at a level that includes the client's immediate circumstance, chronic problems, life issues, medical issues, and basic subjective effectiveness in dealing with their lives, BEFORE deciding which med or therapy or behavioral change to recommend.

Originally posted by L00kingGlass
Doesn't surprise me a little girl would commit cold blooded murder, considering the way parents raise their kids these days.

'These days'? Rose tinted glasses?

Originally posted by n00bUK
This is yet another example of why there needs to be an alternative to prison.

I have nothing else to say other than I think story's like this should touch everybody's soul and make them realize that the system we have now has major faults. Prison wont change this girl, it will institutionalize her and give her a very distort her view on reality at a young age. There is ways of helping this girl, prison not been one of them.

My thoughts go out with the family, on both sides.

Society needs to look at what is triggering this type of behavior and instead of imprisoning them - deal with the problem, not put it on ice

There's an argument that rehabilitation could work for certain types of criminals. Cold blooded killers are not among them. I don't know what the answer is, but I do know that planning on releasing her someday should not even be considered. Make some prison room by releasing the 3-strike drug offenders?

some minds are just diseased. they ought to be taken out of society permanently.

What is it exactly that makes a killer 'cold blooded', as opposed to a
'warm blooded' killer?

reply to post by lampsalot

Well maybe you deserve to be executed too. You pay taxes right? So you are supporting murder of people in the Middle East.

I pay taxes at gunpoint. Coercion is a decent defense. There are plenty of people that fully support the wars in the ME, but there are plenty of others that entirely oppose those wars, and still have to pay taxes, because if we don't pay taxes, we go to jail.

I'm sorry for all the suffering around the world, but my own family comes first, and I need to stay out of jail to take care of my family, so I pay my taxes.

Someone committing cold-blooded murder, in person, intentionally, with no mitigating factors such as self-defense, is not safe to have among the living.

Originally posted by lampsalot
What is it exactly that makes a killer 'cold blooded', as opposed to a
'warm blooded' killer?

"I strangled them and slit their throat and stabbed them now they're dead," Bustamante wrote in her diary, which was read in court by a handwriting expert. "I don't know how to feel atm. It was ahmazing. As soon as you get over the 'ohmygawd I can't do this' feeling, it's pretty enjoyable. I'm kinda nervous and shaky though right now.

Originally posted by getreadyalready

Well maybe you deserve to be executed too. You pay taxes right? So you are supporting murder of people in the Middle East.

I pay taxes at gunpoint. Coercion is a decent defense. There are plenty of people that fully support the wars in the ME, but there are plenty of others that entirely oppose those wars, and still have to pay taxes, because if we don't pay taxes, we go to jail.

I'm sorry for all the suffering around the world, but my own family comes first, and I need to stay out of jail to take care of my family, so I pay my taxes.

Someone committing cold-blooded murder, in person, intentionally, with no mitigating factors such as self-defense, is not safe to have among the living.

Not really. Most people who evade taxes actually get away with it. Sure there is a chance you could go to jail. But it's pretty unlikely.

Now I'm not suggesting you evade taxes, I'm just saying that morally speaking, in a way anyone who does is a murderer too.

Originally posted by L00kingGlass

Originally posted by lampsalot
What is it exactly that makes a killer 'cold blooded', as opposed to a
'warm blooded' killer?

"I strangled them and slit their throat and stabbed them now they're dead," Bustamante wrote in her diary, which was read in court by a handwriting expert. "I don't know how to feel atm. It was ahmazing. As soon as you get over the 'ohmygawd I can't do this' feeling, it's pretty enjoyable. I'm kinda nervous and shaky though right now.

That sounds pretty passionate, ie hot blooded to me.

Why are crimes of passion more forgiven? I would argue that people kill in fits of rage are actually more dangerous to society than people who premeditate since they are more unpredictable.

Originally posted by biggmoneyme
some minds are just diseased. they ought to be taken out of society permanently.

If the death penalty worked so well, then how come almost the entire first world has completely abandoned it aside from the good ol' US of A and they have not become bastions of tolerance for evil?

It's completely unnecessary and is about nothing but vengeance.

Originally posted by lampsalot
What is it exactly that makes a killer 'cold blooded', as opposed to a
'warm blooded' killer?

I would say some sort of emotional attachment or detachment.

I've never heard of a "warm-blooded" killer, but I suppose it would be someone emotionally vested in the death of the other person. A crime of passion or revenge.

Whereas a "cold-blooded" killer is more dangerous and scary, because they kill indiscriminately, without rhyme or reason, simply to satisfy their own curiousity or need.

Originally posted by getreadyalready

Originally posted by lampsalot
What is it exactly that makes a killer 'cold blooded', as opposed to a
'warm blooded' killer?

I would say some sort of emotional attachment or detachment.

I've never heard of a "warm-blooded" killer, but I suppose it would be someone emotionally vested in the death of the other person. A crime of passion or revenge.

Whereas a "cold-blooded" killer is more dangerous and scary, because they kill indiscriminately, without rhyme or reason, simply to satisfy their own curiousity or need.

Yeah the thing is I would argue that a warm blooded killer is actually scarier and more unpredictable because a cold blooded killer tends to only kill a certain kind of person (such as say, prostitutes) or for a certain goal (sex, money, etc) while a warm blooded killer might just kill you because you pissed them off. Even if the crime was heinous, such as say their daughter being molested, most people would just take it to the law, someone actually murdering the offender would still be a murderer and would still be more dangerous than your average joe.

I might be weird. But these kind of stories never touch me much. To me they are nothing but the product of a completely sick, twisted, distorted and disconnected society. I actually feel more sorry for her having to spend her entire life between bars.
Is it such a surprise that these things happen? We are raised in a society that is essentially violent and romanticizes violence and murder. It's in the movies all the time, continuously. We are the most genocidal people on the planet, the worst oppressors. So a 9 year old girl is murdered. At the same time 24 000 kids died of starvation, because we exploit them to death. People are dying everywhere because of our violence. Why should this shock me more?

reply to post by wildtimes




No, not 18, too bad though! That was a good year!

I think I responded to Xcath about the girl in question now being 18.

My ex-wife eventually recovered, got remarried, and now has 2 children of her own, and I am remarried with 2 children of my own, and the whole ordeal eventually helped her break out of her shell and create a very successful career. SO, the meds eventually worked for her, but only after some very rocky times and some very close calls, and sans her husband (me).

The issue that drove me crazy with the whole thing, is sometimes people are supposed to be depressed! If you get a big disappointment in life, you work through it, you don't go get a pill. If you have a loss in a family, you experience the loss, you embrace it, you accept it, and you move on, you don't need to get a pill for it.

I feel people these days think they are supposed to never be unhappy or apprehensive anymore. It seems very dangerous to me. We are supposed to get butterflyes before a big speech, we are supposed to be sad when a loved one dies, we are supposed to experience, embrace, and evolve from these things, we are not supposed to mask them with drugs. Just my humble opinion.

Originally posted by dadgad
I might be weird. But these kind of stories never touch me much. To me they are nothing but the product of a completely sick, twisted, distorted and disconnected society. I actually feel more sorry for her having to spend her entire life between bars.
Is it such a surprise that these things happen? We are raised in a society that is essentially violent and romanticizes violence and murder. It's in the movies all the time, continuously. We are the most genocidal people on the planet, the worst oppressors. So a 9 year old girl is murdered. At the same time 24 000 kids died of starvation, because we exploit them to death. People are dying everywhere because of our violence. Why should this shock me more?

I feel the same way.

Has anyone ever thought that the main line of thinking here, that we should simply produce more suffering on the girl who did this, is the kind of thinking that caused her to commit the murder in the first place?

Honestly sometimes I feel like people are so cruel and unforgiving that they aren't worthy of forgiveness or kindness. But then I realize that if we are not kind to others who don't deserve it, then we can't ever change anything.

Personally I don't think the girl who killed that other girl, or any of you who think we should kill her to avenge the girl she killed, really deserve kindness. But I hope everyone receives kindness anyways.

reply to post by getreadyalready

I feel people these days think they are supposed to never be unhappy or apprehensive anymore. It seems very dangerous to me. We are supposed to get butterflyes before a big speech, we are supposed to be sad when a loved one dies, we are supposed to experience, embrace, and evolve from these things, we are not supposed to mask them with drugs. Just my humble opinion.

And a very wise opinion.
That's why I try to educate people, that numbing out is counterproductive. We are supposed to have those emotions, ride them out (or see them fade, depending on the pleasure-ability of the emotion. That's how we learn, and grow. Through feeling things, allowing those feelings, recognizing them, and then measuring or assessing our responses...

You are right, in my opinion. Being 'numbed' to any emotion is not living. It's robotics....bad thing.

reply to post by lampsalot


Yes I agree. And not to mention that the people we elect into office are all genocidal murderers, murderers by proxy, but that doesn't make them any better.