Are Liberals REALLY More Intelligent Than Conservatives?

reply to post by seabag


of course #ing of course. they were telling, not asking.

an experiment. take your regular neo-con and your regular
mainstream liberal (the "intelligent" one), sit them in front of
a tv screen and let them watch tv footage from 9.1.2001.

observe.

interesting, isn't it?

reply to post by HangTheTraitors


and most of them will follow party lines , no matter what !

reply to post by seabag


The only problem with liberals is that eventually they run out of other peoples' money to spend.

If we remove 8 zeros from the figures and if we treat the US government as a family,

Its annual income would be $21,700
The family would spend $38,200
New debt on the credit card $16,500
Outstanding balance on the credit card $142,710
Total cuts agreed in the last Obama spending cuts $385

liberalism is a conspiracy to make the public significantly more retarded.

Originally posted by ollncasino
reply to post by seabag

 

The only problem with liberals is that eventually they run out of other peoples' money to spend.

If we remove 8 zeros from the figures and if we treat the US government as a family,

Its annual income would be $21,700
The family would spend $38,200
New debt on the credit card $16,500
Outstanding balance on the credit card $142,710
Total cuts agreed in the last Obama spending cuts $385

Only problem is conservatives talk a whole lot of spending, but spent just the same and then
point their finger when they booted out of office...

I will say right now..I did not read all of the posts.

I went to college in the 80's. I never witnessed this indoctrination of the "left" as I have heard claimed many times.
Not once not ever.

Seems funny that the ones screaming the most about this indoctrination are those that didn't attend college...or if they had, they too would be leftists, correct?

Peace

I think there is a magnitude of knowledge on both sides. The problem is that knowledge is useless without wisdom. Very few on either side are wise.

Schools are indoctrination centers?

Sure, that was the argument from the Right in the '80s, and since then they've removed Civics lessons, PE, and politicized history. The Vietnam war was "controversial", we don't know why the S&L crisis occurred, and of course, JFK was killed by a single bullet that struck 3 people.

The "elite higher education" institutions, have always been a target for religious groups in the US, because it's an observable and consistent fact that the more education a person has in College, the less likely they are to be religious. Understandings of Cause and Effect seem to remove superstitions. Though the Universe is miraculous to me -- I rarely see anything we interact with that's unexplainable.

>> I recognize that this topic is flame-bate to begin with. Nobody wants to think that THEY are the person getting fooled.

However eloquently the OP strings together big words, I have to look at certain World Views as being more or less civilized -- that is; self-preservation is the most primitive motivation, and as a species, society and creature evolves, reactions to fear and to self interest are suppressed. In the case of hive insects, however, we can see that there are exceptions to the rule.

The basic psychological motivations that develop in human's are explained in a classic study called "Maslov's Hierarchy of Needs." In this study, it was found that if a person at the most basic level, never feels safe, they never develop higher level emotions beyond fear. They do not feel compassion, or love. If a person has safety, then they need to have consistent food or they don't feel safe. If they never have affection they never develop compassion. All these developments are of course, on a sliding scale -- it's rare that someone NEVER feels security or affection. The point is, that basic needs have to be met before any Higher functions like education are going to produce a compassionate and decent person. So someone can actually learn to be a top engineer at a University, but not understand the need for compassion.

Statistically, however, the more fear-based people are likely NOT to have higher level emotions, and though they might have good memory for facts and data, they may not process information in a rational way, because their primary motivations are fear based. Unless you remove fear from kids -- they don't have a capacity to be rational later in life, and love is like showing a rainbow to a dog -- they don't even understand that they can't see what they don't understand.

The presence of fear and insecurity in early development, has been shown to change structures in the brain. The numerous studies showing a statistical difference between the brains of evangelicals and Conservative leaning people and those of other people NOT in those groups, is significant and provable.

Gay men have shown differences in brain structure, and people with ADHD have shown different patterns of brain activity (not structures, but differences in oxygen and blood flow patterns).

It is what it is, and sometimes, we have to accept that we might have been given the short end of the stick. "Liberalism" is being defined by the reactionary and fearful by people who want to manipulate the reactionary and fearful into whatever is necessary to drive them.

This is just anecdotal... but valid nonetheless...

Of ALL of the people I've ever met, the most intelligent people (well-rounded intelligence) tend to be liberal or even far-left (myself included).

The dumbest people I've ever met have been a mix, but a mix that leans more towards the right.

Of course, I've seen great intelligence and complete idiocy of both political persuasions, don't get me wrong.

I am absolutely not making this up, the most intelligent people on the planet tend to be left-wing or far-left-wing.

This would explain why SCIENTISTS, and COLLEGE PROFESSORS, and INTELLECTUALS, and REVOLUTIONARIES, and JOURNALISTS, and GREAT THINKERS, and so on tend to be left-wing... it's not because there's some conspiracy, it's very simply because, the more you learn about the world, the more liberal you become. Liberalism is a generally informed/enlightened position (and NO THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE AUTHORITARIAN STATE-COMMUNISM) that favors science, logic, tolerance, empathy, Democracy, diversity, understanding, peace, openness, humility, anti-state, anti-capitalist, anti-fascist, anti-racist/sexist, equality, environmentalist, philosophical, novelty-chasing, futurist, etc. values/mindsets. And of course, this is a generalization, however, it fits the left far more than it fits the right... and the right cannot become many of these things without also becoming left-wing, it's just reality.


Some studies/articles on the matter:


Liberals and Atheists Smarter? Intelligent People Have Values Novel in Human Evolutionary History, Study Finds


Liberalism, atheism, male sexual exclusivity linked to IQ


Why Liberals and Atheists Are More Intelligent


Your Brain on Politics: The Cognitive Neuroscience of Liberals and Conservatives


Fox News Viewers Uninformed, NPR Listeners Not, Poll Suggests

What is ignored here is that there are several different types of intelligence, and different ideological groups on both sides of the spectrum that think differently from each other- so it's a complex subject to break down to a punchline.

Generally liberalism allows creativity and new ideas while conservatism fosters learning systems well that have already been determined. I knew a lot of competent people in the military who had no idea of what was happening in the world outside of the military and who's minds couldn't accept simple concepts like religious beliefs being manipulated to influence peoples' votes.

I would say that that christianity has severely dumbed down the population so there are probably more unintelligent republicans than democrats, but there are plenty of both sides.

Originally posted by NoHierarchy
Of ALL of the people I've ever met, the most intelligent people (well-rounded intelligence) tend to be liberal or even far-left (myself included).

The dumbest people I've ever met have been a mix, but a mix that leans more towards the right.

Of course, I've seen great intelligence and complete idiocy of both political persuasions, don't get me wrong.

These are exactly the conclusion I come down to with my own life experience.

I have seen a lot more conservatives think that everyone around them are stupid except themselves and people thinking everyone else is stupid compared to themselves are the stupidest of the bunch.

This in no way says that left is and right is stupid, it just happens due to my limited life experience till now, that liberals seem to be smarter in overall intelligence. I've met some absurdly dumb leftists, no worries.

Intelligence really comes down to the individual first hand.

Originally posted by spav5
I will say right now..I did not read all of the posts.

I went to college in the 80's. I never witnessed this indoctrination of the "left" as I have heard claimed many times.
Not once not ever.

Seems funny that the ones screaming the most about this indoctrination are those that didn't attend college...or if they had, they too would be leftists, correct?

Peace

Well, I have been indoctrinated; I've been told that the USA is the "good guys" and that Capitalism has been behind all the great progress in history. ON my own, I discovered that money is the worst motivation, and at my company, they spent money trying to make people feel good about their jobs, in exchange for raises.

It wasn't some Hippy pot-fueled teepee where I learned that Capitalism and the USA might not be the best they could be -- it was by living in the world of capitalists and READING and using my own eyes.

>> The "Hate America First" -- was never my inclination. It's was my disappointment in something I cared about. Learning of what the Reagan-ear government was doing in Latin America -- their support of drug cartels, their assassinations of Union organizers and people who pushed a non-capitalist agenda on numerous occasions, and their exploitation of workers in all cases is the REASON I started wondering what other lies I was told.

I started in an advanced school in kindergarten, came to the South in first grade, and by third grade I was put in a "short school bus" school because they suspected I was dyslexic and could not read. Then someone helped me use phonics, and in two weeks I was at a college level, I then entered an Episcopal school in 5th grade, and did better, and they gave me an IQ test and realized I was actually just bored so they put me in an advanced academy in 6th grade.

I skipped grades 7,8,9, and went into tenth grade. I went to a liberal arts and engineering school because I wanted to be a writer and scientist. Then I went to an art school and graduated Deans List, then I went to two more years of school to get a degree in Computer Information Systems at a normal state college. Why do I cover this eclectic and diverse education background?

>> In all that time, I'd never ONCE had anyone in my class try to tell me to vote one way or another, or tell me about the evils of America or in any way disparage religion. We just don't talk about this crap.

The only time I was slightly political was in art school -- and in rebellion to overly Liberal sentiments. Though some people really do treat animals rights as a religion -- it's not really a huge part of the really diverse group that comprises the Left in the USA. I think for a few years I might have been slightly Conservative.

I had been listening to Neal Bortz up until that time on the radio -- for entertainment purposes -- and I realized that everything I knew was wrong. I didn't respond to this realization by getting angry at the truth teller -- I stopped listening to the shill who had lied to me. Boortz and people like Limbaugh, were appealing to my white, middle class male vanity and insecurities, and they try to explain the world as being messed up because it isn't exactly like you.

Finally, I worked at an office with a very brilliant and perhaps crazy Jewish guy (he looked almost exactly like Karl Sagan) who explained that the "voucher system" was merely a ruse to destroy public education. He explained that the Drug Trade was infiltrated and controlled by the CIA. He explained that there was one faction of Jews called the Likudniks who wanted to "Purify" the Hebrew race -- and something about Ashkenazi and other factions -- which I really balked at, so I don't remember much. He told me about a lot of crazy things ... and all of them ended up being proven true over time, as I learned more about how the world really works. I'm glossing over a lot of things that I won't PROVE to people by merely mentioning them -- it's just that, with a few hints and the right questions -- my entire world view was of my own discovery and after the age of 25 when I'd finished my formal education.


I'd say I was indoctrinated to become a consumer, and to believe that this country didn't shoot first or torture, and that we supported Democracy around the world. I discovered that I was wrong -- and my head did not explode. You don't have to be clue-less to be a Conservative, but you probably have to be hard-headed to remain one in the age of the Internet and the dissemination of "inconvenient truths" that used to be rare.

Any 20-something growing up and reading a blog like Digg on a daily basis, has to be really committed to ignorance to keep buying into the nonsense Conservatives tell them.

I'd say I was indoctrinated to become a consumer

And that's all most of us can ever be thanks to the evil rich corporate scum that run our country.

I think those on the right may believe they are "right" on many topics, but they don't seem to think that as a group, they are always more intelligent. On the right, I think the level of intelligence is considered pretty much equal between the two...and I agree. However, I think the left believe they are more intelligent. Much like they think their $@#t doesn't stink. That is why they believe that they know better what should be forced upon the people, regardless what the people want, while the right believes they stand for the wants of half of the people.

Originally posted by User8911

Originally posted by NoHierarchy
Of ALL of the people I've ever met, the most intelligent people (well-rounded intelligence) tend to be liberal or even far-left (myself included).

The dumbest people I've ever met have been a mix, but a mix that leans more towards the right.

Of course, I've seen great intelligence and complete idiocy of both political persuasions, don't get me wrong.

These are exactly the conclusion I come down to with my own life experience.

I have seen a lot more conservatives think that everyone around them are stupid except themselves and people thinking everyone else is stupid compared to themselves are the stupidest of the bunch.

This in no way says that left is and right is stupid, it just happens due to my limited life experience till now, that liberals seem to be smarter in overall intelligence. I've met some absurdly dumb leftists, no worries.

Intelligence really comes down to the individual first hand.

>> Sure, there is no IQ test to join either party. There are plenty of people who joined one group or the other because they happened to be standing in the line at the time, or it was peer pressure, or some hot-button issue.

Statistically, however, the reason why Universities and "media" are called Liberal, is that Liberals are over-represented amongst people with more education. Journalism is a college major that requires good grades in English -- that's the NUMBER ONE factor that skews the stats so that some could say the Media is Liberal. The MESSAGES we get on the News are not, however Liberal-- they are influenced by the owners and sponsors of the News Station.

>> The political experts, constantly identify the social issues that will motivate people -- and the "window dressing" that spurs xenophobics to vote Republican, and bleeding hearts to vote Democratic, shouldn't be seen as the core of the belief system.

However, that said, today the Democratic party is a pro-corporate, slightly rational group that might as well be the Republicans from 15 years ago, and the Republicans are insane. I can understand how educated people can be in NEITHER party now -- as they've all left the rational norm, but I cannot understand how anyone with any sense could be a Republican.

Every loud-mouth jerk I've met who was a closet racist is a staunch Republican.

I actually met ONE bleeding heart liberal the other day, and I made her cry by objecting to the "puppy adoption clause" -- I told her that it isn't even remotely legally binding to sell us a puppy, and then say they can take it back and have someone sign that "take it or leave it contract." She must have looked at me as every person who ever abused a dog that came in limping to their shelter. She didn't hear that I was going to care about that puppy -- she didn't notice I was objecting to the concept of not being the Dog owner, but a "lease holder who feeds the dog". Even adoption agencies eventually make you the LEGAL GUARDIAN!

Anyway, I just thought I'd bring that up to be fair. That one sweet little lady who cares about puppies is the Powerful, Evil Bane of Society as described by Rush Limbaugh -- the one actual Bleeding Heart Liberal I've met all year.

So like, one "typical Liberal" vs. a thousand "typical Republicans". Yes, both sides have a point but they are not equivalent.

So you know what this means? Yep—each side is going to have to recognize that not everyone thinks like them, processes information like them, or values the same types of things. Each party is going to have to think of, i) what idea they are trying to communicate, ii) how that other group responds best to presentation of information (what turns them on or off), and iii) how to present it to that other group in a way that is both meaningful and non-threatening.

Yes, I know that’s asking a lot, but tough times call for tough measures. We have some scientific data here. It may not be perfect, but it’s a good start. With the state our country is in right now, I don’t think we have any choice but to cowboy up and do whatever needs to be done in order to reach some common ground.

blogs.discovermagazine.com...

Interesting study!

Originally posted by NoHierarchy
This would explain why SCIENTISTS, and COLLEGE PROFESSORS, and INTELLECTUALS, and REVOLUTIONARIES, and JOURNALISTS, and GREAT THINKERS, and so on tend to be left-wing... it's not because there's some conspiracy, it's very simply because, the more you learn about the world, the more liberal you become.

Revolutionaries are liberal?

I thought they had a tedancy to kill people who they disagreed with.

Journalists are also one of the least respected group in society, so perhaps they don't make a great poster boy for any argument extolling being left wing.

By the way, in light of right wingers consistantly out earning liberals, a less charitable view on college professors being liberal is that a 'fairer' society is just a way to redistribute resources into their pockets and their pet projects.

That one sweet little lady who cares about puppies is the Powerful, Evil Bane of Society as described by Rush Limbaugh

Rush Limbaugh is an evil degenerate that no one should listen to. He typifies everything that is wrong with the right side of the spectrum and America in general.

reply to post by VitriolAndAngst


I agree with much of what you say. I was speaking more specifically of left/right politics where personal ideologies of my professors were not expressed.

I see that you have not shaken the indoctrination against hippies : )


Peace

Originally posted by CB328
What is ignored here is that there are several different types of intelligence, and different ideological groups on both sides of the spectrum that think differently from each other- so it's a complex subject to break down to a punchline.

Generally liberalism allows creativity and new ideas while conservatism fosters learning systems well that have already been determined. I knew a lot of competent people in the military who had no idea of what was happening in the world outside of the military and who's minds couldn't accept simple concepts like religious beliefs being manipulated to influence peoples' votes.

I would say that that christianity has severely dumbed down the population so there are probably more unintelligent republicans than democrats, but there are plenty of both sides.

Yes, I would agree with your observed general pattern of "Generally liberalism allows creativity and new ideas while conservatism fosters learning systems well that have already been determined".

But in tying it in with an above post, I would say perhaps in those who for whatever reasons tend to *mainly* use the parts/systems of the brain that deal with creativity to get around in the world we might well find more 'liberal' political positions, wheras those that make their way around in the world by learning/existing systems that have been determined/established we might well find more conseratives. I think this makes perfect sense from a biological point of view and gives some credence to the idea that how we use our brains affects our choice of outlook which affects our political *choices*, IMO.