9/11: A Boeing 757 Struck the Pentagon

Originally posted by Damned The inner wall is solid concrete, reinforced with steel rebar.

Those would be the exterior walls. 10" of concrete faced with limestone and backed with unreinforced brick, to be exact. There's also a geotextile mesh and steel framing in there for added strength. The mesh is important, as it is similar to a gigantic bulletproof vest which catches inflying debris. The "inner" walls are steel framed concrete without the added reinforcements of the exterior walls. -B. former civilian contractor for PENREN Wedge 1

Look atthe piture above, the exterior wall into the inner ring is a simple masonry wall. This building was built durring WWII. They used as litle steel as they could.

Originally posted by HowardRoark Look atthe piture above, the exterior wall into the inner ring is a simple masonry wall. This building was built durring WWII. They used as litle steel as they could.

'twas one of the renovated walls, HR. They used little steel during the initial construction of the Pentagon but used plenty during the renovation project (PENREN). Mind you, the non-exterior walls are steel framed, which is why you can't see the beams in the picture up there. IOW, the non-exterior walls are much weaker in a blast/impact situation than the exteriors. (I'm agreeing with you here. )

Having read through the posts, it seems to me that you are forgetting the possibility that the hole was caused by the explosive force of the aircraft hitting the structure. The resultant explosion would seek out the weakest places for a blow through, which could explain the shape and size of the hole. Just my .02 worth.

if there is debris that survived then surely the black box must of survived... no i dont know what hit the pentagon, probably never will for sure, but if some debris survived than surely the indestructable black box definately must have, but did not. If a plane did hit the pentagon and disintergrated on impact, indestructable black box included, steel rolls royce engines also. How was it proved that it was a plane by the dna of the passengers, dna will disintergrate at alot lower temparatures than steel engines and black boxes It is as simple ass releasing the pictures from seized security cameras to be proven it was a plane that hit the pentagon. If this was os why has it not been done, how can it be a matter of national security to keep the tapes unless there is something to hide

Originally posted by scorchio123 if there is debris that survived then surely the black box must of survived... no

What? Thanks, I am saving that one for my Quotes of Fame file.

i dont know what hit the pentagon, probably never will for sure, but if some debris survived than surely the indestructable black box definately must have, but did not. If a plane did hit the pentagon and disintergrated on impact, indestructable black box included, steel rolls royce engines also. How was it proved that it was a plane by the dna of the passengers, dna will disintergrate at alot lower temparatures than steel engines and black boxes

How can �debris� survive anything? By definition, debris is material that did not remain intact from the force of the crash. As for the engines, I believe that there are pictures of engine parts in the beginning of this thread, but since you are too lazy to go look for them I will repost one here; and Now, let me ask you this, What do you thing happens when you take a jet turbine engine, run it a full throttle, and slam it into a wall? Actually The [url=http://www.pentagon.mil/news/Sep2001/n09142001_200109142.html] did recover the two black boxes from the pentagon crash. The FBI has just never released any of the information contained therein.

do you not find it quite convient that the information on the black boxes was just not released, just as the video tapes that were seized are not released why are they not released, so it can be proved that a plane hit the pentagon, what can be more of a matter of national security than knowing what actually happened. i have read the whole post and seen the pictures, just pointing out what i see to be inconsistancies, what is your view on the dna that was found

Why should they need to �prove� a plane hit the pentagon, they know a plane hit. They have the pieces.

they may know a plane hit the pentagon, so why not release the seized video footage confirming this.

WHAT A GREAT AND INTERESTING POST!! but as the others say : why have they not released any videos apart from a crappy still framed one. Surley the worlds most advanced military CENTER (correct me if im worng pleez) would have a faster cam?. Maybe there would be some charred bodies? a few non charred bodies? oh yeah and a few plane wings.

So, the pieces of the plane strewned about the hole in the side of the Pentagon is not enough for some people to believe it was a plane? Where are the wings? Where is the fuel stored in the plane?

Originally posted by Frosty Where are the wings? Where is the fuel stored in the plane?

Wings = fragile, thin aluminum Pentagon walls =

Originally posted by Banshee 10" of concrete faced with limestone and backed with unreinforced brick, to be exact. There's also a geotextile mesh and steel framing in there for added strength. The mesh is important, as it is similar to a gigantic bulletproof vest which catches inflying debris.

The comparitively fragile wings effectively disintigrated on impact. And the fuel? Did you notice the fire that burned for days at the Pentagon? The smell was truly awful.

Originally posted by scorchio123 why are they not released, so it can be proved that a plane hit the pentagon

Unfortunately, they believed humans were intelligent enough to figure that out. They were wrong. 4 planes went missing, 2 were flown into the twin towers, 1 crashed in Penn. People saw the other one flying low heading in the direction of the pentagon, but...that plane may have dissappeared into thin air and a missle may have hit instead No one had incentive to hide that anything other than a plane hit. If a missle or something hit, then they would have said so, and gave us all the more reason to kick their a$$.

I've said it before and I'm saying it again.... People, watched the plane fly into the pentagon.... there were eye witnesses.... I think even Skeptic's brother or someone was there and saw it. My company had people working at the Pentagon that day, one saw a plane, thats right, an airplane fly very low over the highway and then saw an explosion and the smoke... he was outside on one of the other sides of the building, he did not actually see impact... it was a plane people....

This Boeing 757 theory is bullshit. Ok, yes there is plane wreckage there, THERE IS NO DENYING IT. PEOPLE SAW AN AIRCRAFT APPROACHING THE PENTAGON, AGAIN THERE IS NO DENYING THAT (AT LEAST BEYOND REASONABLE DOUBT.) Ok, but is the damage to the pentagon consistent with a Boeing 757 ? Fuck no, a Boeing 757 cannot punch through 3 walls (9 feet) of reinforced concrete and steel, and no i dont buy your liquidfied theory, if the planes contents turned into liquid, how come there is no debri outside the hole? Is it also likely the plane would of managed to avoid all the columns, ill tell you now f**k NO! My conclusion it WAS a missile which caused the punch out hole, your probably think hey man you just said an air craft hit the pentagon, yeh i did, and yes an aircraft did hit the pentagon. I'm sure alot of you are familar with LetsRoll911.Org, on the site numerous pages detailing what hit the WTC, what hit the WTC has a military aircraft, however it had a missile pod attached to it. An aircraft did hit the pentagon, but it shot a missile into the building before doing so, that is why they refuse to release the films and why they cut out 5 frames or what ever from footage they did release, just like the WTC you would of seen the missile and possibly the missile pod. Check out LetsRoll911, go to the forums and look at the pictures and evidence of the what REALLY hit the WTC. I have solved your problems, it was both an aircraft and a missile.

Originally posted by scorchio123 if there is debris that survived then surely the black box must of survived... no

Supposedly, they found it. They're just not letting anyone in on what it recorded.

Originally posted by zen You dishonor them with your fantasies.

No, the government dishonors them with it's secrecy.

Originally posted by HowardRoark As for the engines, I believe that there are pictures of engine parts in the beginning of this thread, but since you are too lazy to go look for them I will repost one here

Yes, engines that have yet to be accurately identified by even their supposed manufacturers. How is this so?

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird 4 planes went missing, 2 were flown into the twin towers, 1 crashed in Penn.

According to AA, 2 planes were never recorded as departing that day. 1 of them hit the Pentagon. Sure, it may appear obvious, but what would be the harm in comfirming this is what actually happened? There are plenty of reasons to question this, IMO. [edit on 1-12-2004 by Damned]

Originally posted by aelphaeis_mangarae a Boeing 757 cannot punch through 3 walls (9 feet) of reinforced concrete and steel,

You know, part of the problem that happens when a thread gets this long is tha few people ever bother to read through the previous 25 or more pages, so they keep posting the same things over and over again even after they have been shown to be wrong. As posted just a few posts ago:

Originally posted by Banshee 10" of concrete faced with limestone and backed with unreinforced brick, to be exact. There's also a geotextile mesh and steel framing in there for added strength. The mesh is important, as it is similar to a gigantic bulletproof vest which catches inflying debris.

So you actually have a veneer of limestone panels (which I believe were 4� thick) 10� of concrete, and about 6� of unreinforced brick on the outer wall, and about 8� of unreinforced brick on the C ring exterior wall into the inner courtyard. Please explain by what application of �new math� do you use to get 9 feet out of that? Now there were probably some interior buildout walls on the ground floor, but the majority of these would have been simple drywall on studs. You might have had a plaster lath wall or two, but I don�t think these would have withstood much either. There were, however a significant number of columns that were damaged or destroyed by the impact. (edit: Please note also that the size of the columns in that drawing are clearly not to scale!!) Columns, however are not the same thing as walls. With its high forward momentum, the debris would have flowed around the columns in its forward movement. Besides, as you can see, except for the relatively small amount of debris that went through that last wall, the majority of the planes mass remained inside the building. [edit on 1-12-2004 by HowardRoark]

As I've said three hundred times, if not more, what would be the harm in showing us the video and letting us hear the recording? Is that going to have such an impact on people that they just won't be able to handle the stress? I don't know about you, but I'll never support the government's insistence that I am a complete idiot, incapable of handling the truth. [edit on 1-12-2004 by Damned]

I haven't read all 35 pages of this thread so I am sorry if I am repeating stuff. This is the best website I've found about 911 www.cooperativeresearch.org... When I first saw the accusations on "no plane" presentations/websites I was taken in but the more research I did the more ridiculous they became. I rekon there are enough unanswered questions about 911 Project for a new american century www.newamericancentury.org... Dealings with the Taliban(Unocal/Bridas) www.worldpress.org... The Anthrax attacks All these things are connected. Also ask yourself, do you think that you could, after flying nothing more than a small flying school plane and a few flight simulators, fly a large pasenger jet into one of those buildings. They hit 3 out of 3 targets. Its possible but....

3 out of 4 actually. And it wasn't like they were small targets. I mean, you'd have to be legally blind to miss.

My conclusion it WAS a missile which caused the punch out hole, your probably think hey man you just said an air craft hit the pentagon, yeh i did, and yes an aircraft did hit the pentagon. I'm sure alot of you are familar with LetsRoll911.Org, on the site numerous pages detailing what hit the WTC, what hit the WTC has a military aircraft, however it had a missile pod attached to it. An aircraft did hit the pentagon, but it shot a missile into the building before doing so, that is why they refuse to release the films and why they cut out 5 frames or what ever from footage they did release, just like the WTC you would of seen the missile and possibly the missile pod.

Suggestion - Check out the Ignorance is Winning on ATS thread. Another suggestion - 1. check where you get your info from. 2. don't be so easily influenced by conspiricy sites like LetsRoll. That's not healthy.