Why is it "so" important for Christians to confess Jesus as their Lord?

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

If we don't believe yet in Christ, why would we fear in the Hell He created????

I'm sure you would like to quote a verse saying God (or Jesus, according to you) created Hell for people.

edit on 1-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

Where did I say Hell was created for people in my post above that you quoted?

reply to post by FugitiveSoul


Thanks for sharing your thoughts. This is none of my business, and I respect you completely if you don't wish to answer because it really is none of my business, but I am wondering if you are a New Ager?

I only ask, because a lot of what you are saying sounds like that.

Originally posted by LaughingatHumanity
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

According the the gnostic gospels which were conveniently stricken from the good book during the council of Nicaea all souls within hell were released via christ and hell ceased to exist from that point.

Kind of hard to keep people obedient when your own scripture chased out the bogeymen, so they just left that part out.

The Council of Nicea addressed the Arian heresy. Everyone voted against Arius and his heretical claims about Christ except two people. Also a date for Easter was decided upon. There is no record whatsoever that the books of the Bible were discussed at Nicea.

Where do people pick this nonsense up at???

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

"Gird up your loins" is a safe, flowery way to say. "Stop crapping your pants."

In the same way when the Lord addressed King Cyrus He told him that he would "Loose the loins of kings".

Did you get this from one of your YouTube videos?

What happens when your loins are loosed? To "gird" is the opposite of to "loose". It could also imply the urinating of oneself, same concept, fear.

Christ is in the name of Christian, without Jesus/Christ, there is no Christian religion.

Jews believe the messiah has not come, Christians believe the messiah came, and it was Jesus.

reply to post by sacgamer25

If I say that I am at peace and at rest then why would you want me to believe anything else. I have found the rest that Christ Promised. You are still searching all over the place and have no rest. This is why I pray for you.

You could have a psychological need to feel you are right, like a survival instinct so that your kids trust you.
I don't expect anyone to be looking up to me for anything like reassurance that everything is fine and that I have it all well in hand.

You are adding an extra dimension to this Abraham thing that does not otherwise exist.
You should think about the conversation Jesus had with the Jews about their attachment to Abraham.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

If we don't believe yet in Christ, why would we fear in the Hell He created????

I'm sure you would like to quote a verse saying God (or Jesus, according to you) created Hell for people.

edit on 1-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

Where did I say Hell was created for people in my post above that you quoted?

OK, then back to your old tricks, then, ignoring what I just quoted and pretending you never said that, all the while creating a distraction from the actual topic because you are a compulsive poster and write things without even thinking about them.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

The Council of Nicea addressed the Arian heresy. Everyone voted against Arius and his heretical claims about Christ except two people. Also a date for Easter was decided upon. There is no record whatsoever that the books of the Bible were discussed at Nicea.

I'm sure you would love to present some documentation that this in fact occurred, this vote about Arius.

Originally posted by Frira

Wow did I love your post! There really is so much in there for me right now.

Jesus is God-- the second Person of the Holy Trinity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit-- One God in three Persons.

I still don't understand the full concept of the Trinity. It is something I need to put a lot of work into soon, or maybe I am just not ready to hear it yet. It will come soon I am sure, I have only just begun

I believe what you are noticing is the fairly recent emphasis-- particularly among fundamentalist evangelicals (fairly recent as a identifiable group of Christians)-- confessing Jesus as Lord and seeking to persuade others to do likewise. That emphasis ought not be to the exclusion of the confession of God the Holy Spirit and God the Father-- but it sure comes off that way.

Yes there is a lot of "sure comes off that way" stuff I am seeing as of lately. A lot of that could be just my own ignorance, assumptions, and bias. That is why I put this post up, because I am picking up a lot of clues from a lot of you. Some of you that I would of never of thought are really speaking volumes to me right now, including this great post you put up!

Whether it is meant in such a way, it seems very much to have that American "individualism" as its tone in a sort of "It is all about Jesus and me-- and it can be about Jesus and you" leaving little, if any, room for an "us."

There is something in here that I can't quite see clearly yet. I need to think about this for a while.

So if I understand this correctly, if one has God 100% in his life, his head, his heart, and his actions. Has freed himself from the bondage of self, lives a righteous life, is of services to others, carries the word of God not just in his own words, but mainly in his actions, and loves all through God.

I don't know that such is correct-- formulas such as those will vary from one person and another based upon wisdom, gifts, experiences and such.

And trying to define a formula for getting into Heaven may be problematic. To start with-- How would one have God 100% in his or her life? Playing Abraham, I tease by asking, "what if only 90%... how about 50%...?"

When I initially posted yesterday, my thoughts are different already today. Even as I am replying to you it is changing as I think about it. The OP was poorly worded from where my thoughts are already today. We possibly couldn't have God 100% in our life otherwise we wouldn't be in the 3D world any longer. I seem to be stuck on this word "wilderness" right now also, and the only thing I can use to describe it. If we were fully following Christ/God 100%, I suppose this world would be impossible for us. I am sure I am not making any sense though.

It is not "bondage to self," but "bondage to sin" which is most often considered. A somewhat high spirituality often attempts to minimize the ego so that true and spiritual self may emerge, but that is a whole different topic-- but a good one.

I would love to hear that topic if you ever feel inclined to get it going. If you do, shoot me a PM with a link.

That when he get's upstairs and meets the Big Man, the Big Man is going to say, "you have lived a very good life, done well, but because you never called Christ your savior, Shepard, etc... I have to send you to hell..." then pulls the big lever and the trap door opens beneath him?

No. To the contrary.

Jesus told us that some who confess His Name will be told by him "Depart from me... I never knew you;" and to the great delight and surprise of others who have never heard of Jesus, He says, "Come! O blessed of my Father!"

I have a lot of thoughts on this, but sadly no vocabulary to get them out at the moment properly. (I think) I completely understand what you mean though.

Honestly, I am torn as to which is better. I believe I have a "personal relationship with Christ" but it is very difficult work-- more difficult than loving an enemy-- which anyone can do-- Christian or otherwise. To a large degree, it hurts. But the relationship is worthwhile. Even if I had a guarantee of salvation-- which I do not-- I would rather live a life in misery knowing Him than not.

It is very difficult work isn't it?? I can't say from experience at all, but I "saw something" which showed me a clear path of what it takes. My immediate response was there was no way I could do this. It's way to much for me. It scared me, left me confused, and it left me in a pretty awful place at first. Like I can't take this path, but when I turn around and look back, I realize there is no possible way I can take "that" path back either.

"I would rather live a life in misery knowing Him than not." I understand what this means now. I don't know how I do, but I do.

continued...

reply to post by sacgamer25


So non-believers are judged for not believing in an all powerful entity that refuses to provide proof of it's existence.

Pretty awesome god you got there!

reply to post by Frira

Nor is it a good evangelical tool for North American ears to be told, "Blessed are the poor" or "Blessed are those who mourn" as it goes against the "American way." Certainly, "It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of God" will cause pews to empty in some churches-- or at least cause quite a bit of squirming.

Sadly, I understand very specifically what you mean in here as I am typing this. A couple of times my instinct from your post is to defend North America/U.S kind of thing because that is what I was programmed to do at one point. I have been sitting with this one quote for about 20 minutes now rewording it, thinking about it, rewording it, walking away from it, rewording it...etc. There is nothing I can put into language that will explain to anyone what is in my head right now that others will hear. "We certainly are sitting inside the middle of a big melting pot right now" is all I can find. I am looking around thinking, "what have we done?" It is causing me a lot of pain and sadness. That isn't an Anti-American statement at all either for those that can not hear. It really is breaking my heart though looking around at what we have created. It has for some time now, but it just came to full light as I am typing this to you

I am not the product of a church which emphasizes public declarations as a form of evangelizing. There is a very private component which is emphasized-- "work, prayer, and study" come to mind as a "rule of life" I have followed.

I absolutely love this statement! Except, I would like to add to it "service and love" to the three words you have used. Wait....now that I think about it, the words I would add are probably a "result" of the three words you used. Guess I shouldn't change it then, not that I am trying to change your thoughts at all. It's obvious they don't need to be.

My spiritual gifts may include being a good teacher; but they almost certainly do not include being an evangelist-- so you can see where my objection to that emphasis instead of one of teaching, may persuade me to oppose it as a "formula."

A good teacher helps his pupils outgrow their teacher. There is no reason to be a evangelist. I think Jesus would have never wanted it to be that way, although many people perceive it that way because they can't hear, only read. When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. All of the sudden I can see many of you. In your post, you have taught me. I thank you for that. I suppose it came from all the hard work you have put into work, study, and prayer. I can see that hard work you have put in.

Thank you for being my teacher...I hope many more appear.

reply to post by Awoken4Ever


Knowledge is power, But Belief is what empowers and fuels it
The Will is the only thing that a person truly possess that cannot be taken from them by anything or one
Thy Will (ones Will power) can only be manipulated, deceived, sold, or freely given up to something.
Those who think Knowledge is Power would be wise to understand the knowledge of truth.
Which First requires the Knowledge of Wisdom,

Socrates– “The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.”

Because anything you know and believe can and will be used against you by someone who can take your truth and use it as means to their ends.

Since people often find it easier to be a result of the past than a cause of the future.

All history is hidden by the power of Darkness or Lack of information
and also
by the overloading of (dis)Information much like a Blinding Light that few if any can look past.

Those who have Mastered the knowledge of Truth use this understanding for the good of all things and benefit everyone non above or below another, seeking to preserve truth (Preserver of Truth)

Those Masters of truth who use this power to bend truth to their will and using it for reasons of their own self-interests (Manipulators of truth)

Exploiting the divisions present in humanities groups and sub-groups using false or incomplete truth(s) that filter and/or reinforce aspects that support their goals(know or hidden) by using the truth they control as the means effect their followers and believers. All those who believe in the group and choose the answers of others over seeking truth and asking questions of themselves, give power and strength to those that they relinquish their will to becoming soulless zombies in self induced mental slavery based on History, Science like Physics, Biology, Physiology and the math and books backing it up, But never really researching for themselves by asking if whats known to be true is or is not, since most never want to ask themselves why and or why not. Being fundamental to really understanding and comprehend something rather then only knowing the correct answer

In the 1950s at Swarthmore College, Pennsylvania, Solomon Asch conducted experiments into conformity, which demonstrated that, in simple tests comparing three vertical lines, most people would rather give an obviously wrong answer that kept them in a group than a correct answer that would make them outsiders.


The majority of humanity whose desire to belong within the group(herd/nations/gangs/political party) giving a person peace of mind by providing safety in numbers and answers to the questions they seek to give a sense of reality from a self-centered outlook, think only about their problems and how it effects them and what is best for them and theirs which means most seek answers that simply explain and back up what they feel they think, each individual limits the complexity of their world, choosing what makes them feel best, whether that’s not knowing that Santa Clause doesn’t exist or knowing just enough to feel secure that the group knows best and trusting the Leadership, "experts" or any individual viewed as an authority and dictates the groups understanding of what is truth Laying the foundation of how they interpret and interact with other people animals and the environment in the world, this provides those with the control of information to influence the beliefs and the will power of those who believe, but like all power it can be easily corrupted.


Now
God The All, The Brahman, The Cause, or The Force is all things, The one immortal soul all are part of. Nothing is everything, But everything is not nothing.

Einstein said: "As I have said so many times, God doesn't play dice with the world."

I agree God doesn't play dice, But the Devil sure as hel does and you cant have One god without its polar-opposite otherwise the Universe wouldn't work just like you cant have God the father cough out Knowledge saying let there be light without something or someone like The Goddess Mother of wisdom listening to him speak and taking it all in as wise ears do. If dude-god with the knowledge of game wants to create anything first he has to serenade a Sexy-goddess before he gets some, right

The only way to foresee the end of date whether disaster strikes you out or success and a happily ever after is to intelligibly plan it out and act it out, all while making it seem spontaneous and magical to fix a moment to in the future that is unavoidable is to deceive others for your own gains and/or control of a situation.

Originally posted by Awoken4Ever
God is the big picture, not Christ. Christ is secondary,

Well, really its a trinity. I don't know about the rest since I haven't been on ATS for ages, maybe there's more to talk about Jesus then God in some ways.

And Happy New Year to everyone!!!

reply to post by iamaperson


Good work catching that. I missed that but would have said something earlier if I had noticed it.
I agree that such a statement is problematic. We really wouldn't know anything about God if not for Jesus.

reply to post by sacgamer25


You are no longer on an island by yourself Brother.

You have moved me mountains.

Do you remember what it was like when it "very first" happened?? It is happening now.

You are witnessing it, and sharing it with me.

People kept telling me "the truth is inside..." I hated hearing it because I couldn't understand what "exactly" they meant. I clearly understand now, and yet, I couldn't show another. It "is" setting me free. The link you provided was incredible. I could write pages alone to everything that was in there, but some how I can't touch it, and I think you understand why.

I have sooooo much work ahead of me...

"When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come."

All "they" have done is woken a sleeping giant.

What an awesome 2012 it is going to be!!!

The war has begun...
__________________________

You were right Ed...I can see the fruit now too. I think that week is over, or at least, I can only pray.

Originally posted by Awoken4Ever


"When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come."

Hear from WHOM exactly?

If it is the Holy Spirit, how come he would not speak on his own authority, but only what he "hears" from someone? After all Holy Spirit is God, isn't it not?

So, who is this "Spirit of truth" then? The one (in original greek he is referred to as "he" - masculine) who will not speak from himself, but he will speak whatever he hears from "someone", and he will guide us into the WHOLE TRUTH, and he will declare to us the things that are to come?

reply to post by Awoken4Ever


Yes I do, it is the most wonderfully indescribable feeling ever. And confusing

I must say one thing that the Spirit reminds me of daily.

Before you were given this gift you were a sinner. The gift was given you freely, not because of anything special you have done; always acknowledge this to other believers and non believers. Much of what you say will sound righteous it is hard not to sound that way. If you remember to acknowledge this and accept that you are no better than your brothers or unbelievers this will keep you away from judgment and lead you to always love others.

Now let the living word of God the bible and the Holy Spirit guide you down your path. All praise to our father in heaven.

reply to post by IblisLucifer


I don't know if you are insane, brilliant, something is talking through you, for you, or these are your actual words. I have read it a couple of times, and each time I go through it something changes. I need to leave it alone for now and come back to it. Tomorrow it will have new meaning I am sure.

Since people often find it easier to be a result of the past than a cause of the future.

My life story...period.

No more. Never again!

I am not a victim anymore.

reply to post by sacgamer25


Thank you

Ego is messing with me something horrible, and I am constantly having to put it back in check all day. Not in my words, but in my head. I feel so blessed and humbled, and then a moment later I am taking pride in it. Hope it isn't always like that.

I should change the title of the thread to "Come watch the Donkey have a spiritual experience..."

Who would of thought in a million years of all places, it would happen here at ATS!?!?! Can you seriously see the irony and humor in that??? God really does have a funny sense of humor!

Hee-haw

Originally posted by Awoken4Ever
reply to post by FugitiveSoul

 

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. This is none of my business, and I respect you completely if you don't wish to answer because it really is none of my business, but I am wondering if you are a New Ager?

I only ask, because a lot of what you are saying sounds like that.

Am I New Age? You know, I've honestly never thought about it. I draw on the moral beliefs of both Eastern and Western philosophies, I study metaphysics and psychology, practice holistic heath, and consider myself scholarly in the fields of quantum physics and consciousness research, so I suppose I am, though I hate labels as they pinhole people and place limitations on belief and acceptance, which is what makes those who follow Abrahamic religions such difficult people to reason with. There is no place for ideas that challenge their "god" in their religions, in fact there are threats of punishment, either in this world or the next, for breaking their laws.

I prefer a path that branches off, that allows for exploration and back tracking, that doesn't punish if you take the left trail instead of the right. I prefer the feeling of true freedom in my beliefs, which evolve as science and understanding evolve. I could never handle a cage, and labels have always seemed like cages to me, especially the labels under the banners of Abraham; the ones with the most restrictions and the least proof.

I hope that answers your question.