Friends who have lost faith, please, don't be blind. Look.

Originally posted by 547000


Or maybe believers just have as strong minds but have had their faith confirmed by miracles? Then it's ignorance that makes an unbeliever claim there is no God, ignorance that can be cured if they only bothered to ask God if He existed first and to give them the ability to believe.

Is there any proof of that, or do we just have to *believe* people's reports ? Do you think that we understand the reality of things 100% or even the human brain 100% to be able to certify that we know for sure that what they saw or they thought they saw was exactly what they think or you think it really was ?

I am not a believer, but i am not an atheist either. I am agnostic, and it means (at least for me) that i don't feel the need to believe. I accept the ignorance, i don't reject it and replace it with something that i feel comfortable with.

I'm talking about personal experiences, actual human contact with the divine. If you don't trust your senses you might as well go all the way and be an existentialist. Some people have the fortune of knowing God exists but most people are apathetic or against God, and so have the terror of not knowing Him.

Originally posted by biggmoneyme
reply to post by lonewolf19792000

 

all identifications are like smudges on the screen, this includes the beliefs you attach yourself too. you can't see clearly with them.

Wrong again. What part of your beliefs are your preception do you not get? It's as clear as you want it to be or as incomprehensible. It is not for you to say whose perception is right and whose is wrong, that is to be determined by the eye of the beholder.

Originally posted by 547000
I'm talking about personal experiences, actual human contact with the divine. If you don't trust your senses you might as well go all the way and be an existentialist. Some people have the fortune of knowing God exists but most people are apathetic or against God, and so have the terror of not knowing Him.

It's the vanity of man that makes him think he has a direct line with the creator of the universe (if something like that even exists). Things would be very different if mankind wasn't the most intelligent species on earth ..

reply to post by gosseyn

Things would be very different if mankind wasn't the most intelligent species on earth ..

We aren't. Mice and then dolphins are more intelligent than we are.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Yes of course, and that's why mice launch satellites into space like us, they have medicine, they can discuss any matter instantly through the whole world. Yes, of course.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by gosseyn

 

Things would be very different if mankind wasn't the most intelligent species on earth ..

We aren't. Mice and then dolphins are more intelligent than we are.

I have heard about the dolphins, but not the mice.
Care to enlighten us?

Originally posted by gosseyn
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Yes of course, and that's why mice launch satellites into space like us, they have medicine, they can discuss any matter instantly through the whole world. Yes, of course.

I said they are more intelligent, not that they have the capability to do the work of men. They are not men. Mice use the most of their available brain capacity, dolphins are 2nd, humans are 3rd. "Intelligence" can be compared to the processor speed on your computer. "Knowledge" would compare to the memory space available in the computer.

Two different things.

You've never heard the old saying " That man is educated way beyond his intelligence."

reply to post by Sorgmodig


maybe this will help clear some things up

CHRISTIANS - THE MOST PERSECUTED PEOPLE GROUP ON EARTH
ausprayernet.org.au...

But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
Galatians4

reply to post by Rustami


Not to mention the recent bombings against Christians in Nigeria. We are not weak, but instead we try to be as innocent as a lamb in front of the wolves but realistically stronger in every other manor than the wolves intended.

reply to post by jdmmade


your in Nigeria?

Originally posted by Rustami
reply to post by jdmmade

 

your in Nigeria?

I believe he means "we" as in we Christians, not as in we Nigerians.

Riveting tale, chap.

Originally posted by Sorgmodig
Christians, i bet, have about the same IQ as a mouse- but I doubt they have the same as a dolphin.
How can you worship a god that commanded that guy on the mountain to kill his own son?
God is good. yeah, sure...

I could explain that easily, but I'm not convinced you'd take the time to listen.

Seems we have nothing left to discuss, I wish you a happy new year. God bless.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Rustami
reply to post by jdmmade

 

your in Nigeria?

I believe he means "we" as in we Christians, not as in we Nigerians.

thank you Counsel
now on to the next question shall we

Originally posted by gosseyn

Originally posted by 547000
I'm talking about personal experiences, actual human contact with the divine. If you don't trust your senses you might as well go all the way and be an existentialist. Some people have the fortune of knowing God exists but most people are apathetic or against God, and so have the terror of not knowing Him.

It's the vanity of man that makes him think he has a direct line with the creator of the universe (if something like that even exists). Things would be very different if mankind wasn't the most intelligent species on earth ..

It's precisely pride and vanity why men cannot find God.

The proud cannot bring themselves to hold out empty hands to God, they insist on offering virtues, good works, self denials, anything in order not to have nothing. They want to be beautiful for him from their own resources, whereas we are beautiful only because God looks on us and makes us beautiful. God cannot give himself to us unless our hands are empty to receive him. The deepest reason why so few of us are saints is because we will not let God love us. To be loved means a naked, defenseless surrender to all God is. It means a glad acceptance of our nothingness, a look fixed only on the God who gives, taking no account of the nothing to whom the gift is made. To lose ourselves like this is the most radical of despoliations because the last shred of self-importance is discarded.

Originally posted by 547000
It's precisely pride and vanity why men cannot find God.

The proud cannot bring themselves to hold out empty hands to God, they insist on offering virtues, good works, self denials, anything in order not to have nothing. They want to be beautiful for him from their own resources, whereas we are beautiful only because God looks on us and makes us beautiful. God cannot give himself to us unless our hands are empty to receive him. The deepest reason why so few of us are saints is because we will not let God love us. To be loved means a naked, defenseless surrender to all God is. It means a glad acceptance of our nothingness, a look fixed only on the God who gives, taking no account of the nothing to whom the gift is made. To lose ourselves like this is the most radical of despoliations because the last shred of self-importance is discarded.

The reverse may also be true,

It is precisely pride and vanity why men presume to know, speak or act on behalf of their God.

The proud take on the hands of God, insisting that nothing but faith can make us beautiful. God wants our will. The most common reason why there are so few good people is because all we need is Love, not God. To love means to understand and encourage the good in ourselves and others. It means a practice of trying to be humble, a selfless virtue of giving, taking nothing in return. To better ourselves this way is the most gratiying of despoliations because it encourages others to better themselves and to discard their pride by example.
_____________________________________________________________________________________

Two versions to be humble, while they maybe similar in someways, they can also be miles apart.

Some can better themselves by themselves, others need to surrender their souls to God in-order to better themselves.

Should their choice of God turn out to be something else, besides their orginal perception of how or what God should be, they become the instrument of that something else, whatever religion it may turn up to be...

The truly humble have no need for the souls of others. But I am not that humble, you can pass your soul to me if you want to, I won't coerce or deceive you or others for it...

Originally posted by 547000

It's precisely pride and vanity why men cannot find God.

The vanity i am talking about is in the fact that you think you are important enough compared to the infinite vastness and deep mystery of the universe for the creator of all that exists to look upon you and give you his love. Do you think you are that important? Between you and me, you are the most proud and with an idea of self-importance, not me. I am as proud as a rock or as proud as water, because i know that what constitute this rock or that water is also constituting me.

Also, what makes you think the creator of the universe - if something like that exist and if that something is a unique and separated entity with a consciousness - thinks like you ? What make you think that he thinks in terms of love and other manly emotions? Again, you show vanity by thinking that god is like you, that he thinks like you, while he could be 100000000000000 others things that we have never heard about.

Humility is in my camp, because i know that i don't know.

I know that I know. Because you do not know, you falsely assume it is unknowable. All you would have to do to know is throw the world into the garbage can and start seeking God. What He gives to those who seek Him is a treasure beyond the vanity of being considered wise among men. How can you say you have humility or love the truth if you still do not know the truth or are lifted up by God from nothing? If you love the truth you would throw out the presumption that God is unknowable and start seeking from there.

The world tells you such things are unknowable, but this is not so. All you have to do is seek the truth without presumption. God resists the proud heart, but no one will admit to being proud. It is only with hindsight that one admits to being proud.