Jesus is NOT a copy from Pagan religions! Those are lies! Do research and do not believe!

reply to post by GmoS719


*laughs* that is not evidence.

I will go and make a youtube video telling you how your wrong so I can use it as proof. It is made by me and has my opinions, so therefore it must be true.

So tell me........


What site are you all coming from that you go back and round up your friends to come and preach to ATS?

Originally posted by boymonkey74
reply to post by arpgme

 

Links and proof please it's fine just having an opinion but proof please.....
Iam not going to search for any proof against if you can't be bothered to back up your claims.

edit on 2-12-2011 by boymonkey74 because: (no reason given)

Couldn't have said it better, boymonkey74. We see these guys all the time, don't we? OP, do realize that more than a few of us have actually read the book, done the research, and looked up the root words and translations. I too will be happy to
debate you on these theories. Make your case.

Originally posted by arpgme
I would also like to point out, for those who don't know... the bible isn't a book, it is a cannon. It is a COLLECTION of books and letters and scribes and scrolls from different sources all admitting to the reality of Jesus all put into one book..

In other words, there is more evidence for the existence of Jesus than some other people that we claim to be true in history...

Well, it is a Canon, not "cannon," but it is used like a piece of artillery sometimes. And sorry to have to inform you, but there is little real evidence Jesus ever existed. Phio never mentioned him at all, and the paragraph in the writings of Titus Flavius Josephus was surely put there at a later time, but someone else.
Philo of Alexandria would have been in the best position to have known about such a man, and having know, would have written about him.

Originally posted by nixie_nox
Another thread from a member of the newly formed ATS Bible Brigade.

Seriously, back up your claims with real data, youtube videos don't count.

That must mean everything on youtube is false and even if it's possibly real it's still false because it's "youtube".

Originally posted by CoffeeMonster
reply to post by britelite1971

 

Why do you need a intelligent response to a stupid fairytale belief?
explain that one to me? Oh right, high horse xtian opinions.... riiiight.
nvm, dont need to reply.

No need to reply?? Afraid I might embarrass you or something? Why fight so hard to disprove a fairy tale? If its just a fairy tale why do you care? Hmmmm now let's see if I can bring myself to care about what you think of my spiritual beliefs....nothing yet....nope still nothin. Strange! Just doesn't seem to be happening!

That's a good start. Try looking up what the perpetual sacrifice means as spoken in Daniel. This might help

reply to post by fusionhunter


I know that having to get information from reliable sources like universities and the AP is so tedious and limiting, but if you want to convince people of something, that is how it works.

So private and unknown use submitted content doesn't fall into that category.

The internet barely existed when I went to college and they taught you those rules, they don't teach you that anymore?

If you tried to submit that information on a research paper it would be an automatic fail.





Or else someone could photoshop a ufo into a picture and you and half of ats would accept it as evidence......oh wait.

Oh people
Jesus was a man, a peaceful and most likely very intelligent one but a man non the least.
If you believe in a god then we are all son’s and daughters of him it or her.
“Do onto others”.
Is just a good way to live god or no god

Originally posted by boymonkey74
reply to post by GmoS719

 

Yup I walk away because what is the point of arguing with someone who will never change their mind?
Evidence? how can it be evidence when it is made by someone who is already Religious and believes in God, that's the thing isnt it we never see detailed evidence on this subject who start's off from a neutral standpoint do we?
I could make a video on you tube with fancy graphics people in suits who say they are this or that to argue every point he has made, doesnt mean it's right does it?

Ever heard of a genetic fallacy? How about poisoning the well?

Originally posted by nixie_nox
reply to post by fusionhunter

 

I know that having to get information from reliable sources like universities and the AP is so tedious and limiting, but if you want to convince people of something, that is how it works.

So private and unknown use submitted content doesn't fall into that category.

The internet barely existed when I went to college and they taught you those rules, they don't teach you that anymore?

If you tried to submit that information on a research paper it would be an automatic fail.

Or else someone could photoshop a ufo into a picture and you and half of ats would accept it as evidence......oh wait.

But that doesn't prove the information from every youtube video is false. I don't care how they present it just once they can prove it.
Also we're not presenting papers into college we're on a forum board so that doesn't exactly matter does it.

reply to post by fusionhunter


No, they are not all false. But they are not an accepted source. To prove a youtube video is accurate, you would still have to go an accurate source.

So you are implying that people shouldn't be required to prove information and that we should take whatever information is presented to us as an accurate source?

So you are publicly admitting that you think it is ok to spread misinformation?

I don't care if it is just a forum. If you want to spread any kind of idea, you should be doing it accurately.

My research has lead me to belive that Jesus was a Buddhist. He went East and came back with some new ideas.

reply to post by earthdude


Yep I’d agree

I have a major problem with the bipolarity of the bible.In the beginning god was a vengeful smitey sort of chap that liked the odd genocide and blood purge, and miraculously gave holy permission to the claim of the philistine land to a bunch of sheep herding nomads because he said so.

Then halfway through the story god changes from a jealous monotheistic deity who will give you piles and weeping sores,to a nice sort of chap who now seems to be a triumvirate who you would like to have tea and crumpets with on a lazy Sunday afternoon after service(though if you miss high tea,he could get miffed).

Think I'll stick with my Douglas Adams...

reply to post by earthdude

Watch and find this movie www.imdb.com...
The man from earth really really good film and has a little of what you are saying in it.

reply to post by arpgme

He Arpgme -

Not to burst your fantasy-bubble or anything...but...

Actually, the name of the savior-god-man of ‘the Christians’ was a Daviddic Pretender named R. Yehoshua bar Yosef the Galilean Nazir – a Palestinian Jew who lived somewhere between BCE 12 - 36 CE, who ‘armed his disciples with swords (see Luke 22:35-36) and was promptly executed during the 100th anniversary of the Roman Invasion (which took place in 63 BCE under General Pompey) by the Roman Authority, technically for breach of Lex Maiestatis and for armed sedition against the Rule of the ‘divine’ Emperor Tiberius who did not like Pretenders.

You did know, didn’t you, that the Roman Emperors after Augustus were considered gods and god-men with their own temples and priesthoods?

That some of their titles included ‘son of the gods’ and ‘high priest’. Certainly there are MANY older more ancient pagan parallels to the Christian images of ‘Iesous’ which were shaped and formed by pagan myth-hero stories – take a close look at all the miracle myths in the canonical (‘council approved’) Greek gospels of ‘Matthew, ‘Mark’ ‘Luke’ & ‘John’ whoever they were – the gospels circulated for more than 100 years without titles or attributions – in other words they were designed ‘to be read in the churches’ to promote faith i.e. as propaganda tracts, not as ‘history’ in the modern sense of the word – e.g. ‘these things were written so that you might believe that Iesous is the Christos…’ – not exactly the phraseology of a modern historian !

In fact the canonical Greek gospels are not history at all but a form of Hellenistic-Judaeic Hagaddic Midrash used for propaganda purposes – i.e. ‘my god did THAT too…and more!’)

Here are a couple of pagan parallels that PRE-DATE R. Yeshoshua in Palestine – to the Shock & Awe of persons such as Justin Martyr who just could not bring himself to believe that pagans could out-Christ the Christian Iesous, centuries before he even lived – the Devil must be behind all this trickery !!!’- or so Justin naively believed...

Read all about the pagan wine-god Dionysos (who had not only a Mystery religion centuries before R. Yehoshua was even born but also his own pagan mystery temple in 1st century CANA as it turned out, talk about your Shock and Awe !!) - Dionysious (aka the Roman Bachhus) turned water into wine at HIS OWN wedding—with Ariadne – see the citations in Walter Otto in his Dionysos: Myth and Cult, p.98, - the story is also mentioned in Seneca's famous play 'Oedipus' - still widely performed even to-day throughout the world.

Also we have dozens of pre-Chrsitian 'pagan' parallels which the 'Christians' had stolen (or more politely, 'adapted') from their major competing Mystery Religion of MITHRAISM (introduced into Rome c. 79 BCE) - Roman version of the Iranian-Persian sun-god Mitra (aka Mithras) one of whose titles was ‘Sun of Righteousness’ who was born on 25th December each year and called ‘The Mediator between Heaven and Earth’ and ‘The Saviour of Mankind…’ among other titles.

Here is a phrase from the Eucharist of Mithras c. 79 BCE long before ‘Iesous’ was even thought of…

"And Mithras said, He who will not eat of my body and drink of my blood, so that he will be made one with me and I with him, the same shall not know Salvation…"

Sound familiar? No wonder our deluded Justin Martyr had to go about making all those lame excuses !!!!

Many 'pagan mystery religion' words are found attributed to Saul/Paul's letters (a man who 'historically' of course never met R. Yehoshua in the flesh, but only in dreams and visions, a little like my cook !) who was born in TARSUS the capital of the Roman province of Cilicia (and certainly NOT in Palestine !) - which is highly significant since Tarsian Pirates in Cilicia were the ones who brought the cult of the Iranian MITRA to Rome (where he became MITHRAS) c. 79 CE about 100 years before Chrstianiity began to spread among the slave classes in the Roman Empire.

To-day's 'Christians' rarely know ANYTHING intelligent ref these ‘pagan myth’ parallels (there are in fact over 100 major parallels that exist between the images used in the Graeco-Roman Mystery Religions and the miracles of the early Christian Greek gospels – google the 'Mystery Cults' of e.g. Attis & Kubaba, Demeter & Kore (the Eleusian Mysteries), Mithras, Dionysius, Orpheus, Adonis (aka Attanuzzi the dying and rising vegetation god aka ‘Tammuz’ of Hezekiel), Wusir-Kheru (formed between the gods Osiris & Horus into one god, aka ‘Serapis’), Herakles, Aset (Isis) & Wusir (Osiris) and many others.

Christianity was not a new and unique Revelation but actually a midrashic Jewish adaptation of several ancient Pagan Mystery Religions wwith whom Christianity was COMPETING in the market-place of religious ideas throughout the Roman Empire - where converts = cash offerings !!

I'm not even religious but I agree, that the Horus connection is incorrect. I studied it and all those comparisons are not completely true.

Originally posted by nixie_nox
reply to post by fusionhunter

 

No, they are not all false. But they are not an accepted source. To prove a youtube video is accurate, you would still have to go an accurate source.

So you are implying that people shouldn't be required to prove information and that we should take whatever information is presented to us as an accurate source?

So you are publicly admitting that you think it is ok to spread misinformation?

I don't care if it is just a forum. If you want to spread any kind of idea, you should be doing it accurately.

edit on 2-12-2011 by nixie_nox because: (no reason given)

I can see where your coming from with the op just posting videos as his sources but it's what the op is getting at is zeitgeist is false information and those videos prove that with facts but you want him to prove the facts are actual facts instead of posting just posting videos. My point is those most of those videos are pretty solid especial the zeitgeist refuted video which does it word for word.

Originally posted by britelite1971
reply to post by arpgme

 

Thanks for this post! You could show some people all the proof in the world and they would still not believe. Don't let the flamers get you down.

The OP has not shown any proof of anything. He didn't even have any links. It was all his opinion.

He just said that "Zeitgeist was wrong, therefore the Bible is right."

That's pretty poor logic. Excellent Christian logic, but poor logic for for anyone else.

One day everyone will know that Jesus is the Saviour but it would be much better for them if they wake up now.

Subtly threatening. I suppose the "Prince of Peace" will have an excellent time torturing the non-believers.

It does make sense in a Caucasian sort of way.

reply to post by arpgme


I was going to take a little time and provide a nice rebuttal with some decent source e material then I thought, what the hell is the point. It's like every ten minutes another deluded xtian pops up with supposedly new info / conformation of the existence of the existence of the jesus that appears in the bibles.

Dude, the ATS search tool is your friend, every conceivable christian argument has been done on ATS But let's say your right for just a minute.

Let's say there was a jesus born of a virgin and let's say he did do some healing and some magik with some bread, fish wine etc and let's say yes he was crucified and came back to life, and you can have his birth on xmas if you want.

OK let's say we give you all of that and I surely hope that would make you feel a lot better .
But my friend so what ?

If this in anyway somehow proves the divinity of this particular jesus then I'm sorry to say you still have all your work ahead of you before my children are forced to bow down to this outrageous contempt of freedom of thought called the christian religion.


Indeed, so what if you are correct on every point you argue what does it prove ?

History is replete with superman born of virgins sons of gods blah blah nothing new there.

Even your own bible books tell how magik was common place, and apparently great healers have never stopped healing.

A dead man resurrecting ? Nothing new there either again, even your own bible tells how dead men rose from their grave and nipped onto town for a walk.


There was a Jesus almost on every block around the first century and written accounts of a jesus being crucified, not your jesus I know but just for a bit we'll let you have him, and of course there were more messiahs than you could shake a stick at.


So my friend if we give you all of that, pray tell, what exactly makes your man divine ?