A Trip Back To July, 1952, For Those Who Say UFO's/ET Are Not real

reply to post by MysticPearl

I think it's interesting in the last news clip, the expert doesn't deny that they are UFO's and concludes that they are not from deep space but rather from Earth, he just doesn't know where on Earth. I've always believed these UFO's are terrestrial objects, or beings, coming from somewhere within the Earth and with the availability of video recorders and cameras everywhere that these are being documented more being filmed near where they enter/exit the Earth/water.

reply to post by romanmel


Personally, I think this is just semantics really. In most cases I love a good semantic argument, but I think this sort of division harms UFOlogy.

What difference does it make where they came from as long as it's not here? They could be from another planet, another dimension, another time, or another something else altogether. The point is that they're most likely from a different (and therefore alien to us) civilisation. It doesn't matter where that civilisation exists, as long as it's a civilisation other than ours, they are alien visitors.

Sure, it's an interesting thought - but it doesn't really change the impact of them being here.

The Washington Merry-Go-Round, as the case came to be known in its' day, is one of the most famous and compelling cases ever recorded. It is also the only UFO case that led directly to a definitively documented White House meeting, clearly substantiated on President Harry S. Truman's calendar.

reply to post by TheStev


I agree man.

It seems silly to argue over whether or not they are ET's or ED's. The implications are still basically the same.

Let's say they are beings from Earth that were an advanced civilization 10's of thousands of years ago...... the implications are still the same ..... they are still just as alien to us as beings from another world.

The 50's are when people started taking a major interest in UFOs, It was also just after the first A-Bombs had been detonated, many speculate a link to the increase in UFO activity.

One Gem I can think of is the 1948(?) Estimate of the situation document.

Now there is no hard proof the thing exists, but Major Donald Keyhoe, among others confirmed the papers existence.

Wiki-link

Along the same lines, but later on and published, available to the public,

The famous COMETA report, coming to the conclusion that the ET hypothesis, is the most likley.

COMETA

Now back then, they may not have considered the Extra Dimensional option, and I think that or ET are the only possible explanations.

Keep searching,

One day we will crack it

The thing I have to say about this now is the thing I have always said about it..

... So what?

So there were lights in the sky 60 years ago that weren't explained and influential people saw them... and?

I starred & flagged, because simply as a collection of historical documents, your OP is worth a look. But what is going to come of 60 year old evidence of funny lights in the sky? Most likely the same thing that comes from current pictures of funny lights in the sky.

reply to post by MysticPearl

It seems clear these could not have been enemy craft of unknown type from earth. The reason is that they flew so well and yet as the years have gone by where are they?They would have progressed to regular use and the next generation of them developed. To me this proves they are not German or some other countries craft.

So that leaves unknown intelligence in earth or under the seas, multidimensional or outer space visitors. the sightings were way more near world wars so i would say they have an interest in our development and use of mass destruction weapons.

Originally posted by Furbs
The thing I have to say about this now is the thing I have always said about it..

... So what?

So there were lights in the sky 60 years ago that weren't explained and influential people saw them... and?

I starred & flagged, because simply as a collection of historical documents, your OP is worth a look. But what is going to come of 60 year old evidence of funny lights in the sky? Most likely the same thing that comes from current pictures of funny lights in the sky.

First it's interesting and informative, most of the information I have not seen.
Secondly, lot's of people have been stating ET's or UFO's are not real at all in any shape or form, the OP Addressed that.
Third, this is a forum where these types of discussions are welcomed and many people would like to discuss it.

So....That's what!

Very interesting read will look into this more tonight.

Originally posted by horseplay
In 1950 Harry Truman said

“I can assure you the flying saucers, given that they exist, are not constructed by any power on Earth.”

and I believe it was President Reagan that said something to the effect of "Can you imagine the chaos if the governments admitted that UFO's are real" (I'm quoting from memory so I'm probably just kind of close)

Even US presidents throughout history have hinted at the reality or belief of extraterrestrial life, JFK, Carter.

I think we'll all know soon enough.

Love the old clips and photos !

and to romanmel...

They indeed could just as easily be ED's

absolutely, good point.

edit on 29-11-2011 by horseplay because: romanmel

Actually i think Reagan said, we would all come together as a world if alien threat arrived.

This thread is kind of a catch-all for early UFOs. Every single one of these incidents has been analyzed to death on ATS over many years. There are probably a hundred threads on the Battle of Los Angeles alone, another hundred on Roswell. Books have been written about all these incidents. The title of this thread seems somewhat naive to me.

Of course UFOs "exist." I don't know anyone, skeptic, debunker, or believer who claims otherwise. By definition, they exist. They are real. Where we get into trouble is guessing what they are. I also have a problem associating the word "believer" with UFOs (as I just did, cough.) It turns the whole issue into a religious argument. It ought to be a scientific, rational question where most of us can admit that we don't actually know exactly what UFOs are.

We know what SOME of them are. They've been exposed as everything from birds, lens flares, airplanes, SECRET airplanes, balloons, lanterns, helicopters, lights from cars, the Moon & Venus, fires, lamps and other lights, and outright fraud.

This latter category is particularly troubling. A certain segment of the population delights in defruading the rest of us. Whether it is the not-so-clever Billy Meier photograps, "Dr." Kenneth Read storing an alien in a refrigerator, the drone hoax, Project Camelot, or Truman Bethurum claiming the planet Clarion was on the other side of the Moon with aliens who looked just like us, spoke perfect English, and all went to church on Sundays, the fact is, we are innundated with quite a lot of untruth to sift through. That's an unfortunate fact we have to deal with.

When you get through this mass of mis-identifications, intentional disinformation, frauds, charlatans, and religious freaks, we are left with a certain number of UFOs that remain unidentified.

Okay. Admitted. That's fine, but what we do not want to do is leap to conclusions. Just because people have seen lights in the sky, or that pilots have "chased" something, does not mean aliens from outer space are visiting earth in flying saucers. That kind of conclusion is a projection reflecting our thoughts on the nature of the universe onto the objects we are seeing, but don't understand.

Pointing out a few newspaper articles from over half a century ago doesn't change that.

Originally posted by dplum517
reply to post by TheStev

 

I agree man.

It seems silly to argue over whether or not they are ET's or ED's. The implications are still basically the same.

Let's say they are beings from Earth that were an advanced civilization 10's of thousands of years ago...... the implications are still the same ..... they are still just as alien to us as beings from another world.

No, it's not the same. It's not even close.

I don't think there's anyone out there who would say that UFO's don't exist. All a UFO is a flying object that we can't classify as a specific type of aircraft. The argument starts when saying a UFO is from another planet or galaxy when that is only one (far fetched) conclusion that can be reached. The simplest solution is people on earth have advanced technology they aren't sharing.

Case closed.

reply to post by jjkenobi


You're missing the point. Here are the options:

1. Extraterrestrials
2. Extradimensionals
3. Human time travellers
4. Ancient humans come home

5. Humans with hidden technology

We're saying it doesn't matter whether it's any of the 1-4 options, because those are the same in terms of what it means for the human race. In all of those options they're from another civilisation.

If it's option 5 (which personally I don't think accounts for all the sightings but that's by the by) then clearly it's different.

Originally posted by EspyderMan

Originally posted by Furbs
The thing I have to say about this now is the thing I have always said about it..

... So what?

So there were lights in the sky 60 years ago that weren't explained and influential people saw them... and?

I starred & flagged, because simply as a collection of historical documents, your OP is worth a look. But what is going to come of 60 year old evidence of funny lights in the sky? Most likely the same thing that comes from current pictures of funny lights in the sky.

First it's interesting and informative, most of the information I have not seen.
Secondly, lot's of people have been stating ET's or UFO's are not real at all in any shape or form, the OP Addressed that.
Third, this is a forum where these types of discussions are welcomed and many people would like to discuss it.

So....That's what!

Very interesting read will look into this more tonight.

edit on 29-11-2011 by EspyderMan because: (no reason given)

To take you point by point..

1. As I stated, I S&F BECAUSE it was interesting as a historical document.
2. The OP didn't actually address it. He acknowledged that people think that and went on to produce a bunch of 60 year old grainy pictures and anecdotes.
3. What kinds of discussion are welcomed? Discussion over 60 year old grainy photos? Yeah, I know it is.. because without ambiguous evidence, there wouldn't be much to discuss, would there?

Originally posted by TheStev
reply to post by jjkenobi

 

You're missing the point. Here are the options:

1. Extraterrestrials
2. Extradimensionals
3. Human time travellers
4. Ancient humans come home

5. Humans with hidden technology

We're saying it doesn't matter whether it's any of the 1-4 options, because those are the same in terms of what it means for the human race. In all of those options they're from another civilisation.

If it's option 5 (which personally I don't think accounts for all the sightings but that's by the by) then clearly it's different.

Don't forget..

6. Unknown Naturally Occurring Phenomenon created from within our atmosphere.
7. Known but misidentified Naturally Occurring Phenomenon created from within our atmosphere.
8. Unknown Naturally Occurring Phenomenon created from outside of our atmosphere.
9. Known but misidentified Naturally Occurring Phenomenon created from outside of our atmosphere.

and for the religious among us..

10. God did it.

In terms of "Extraterrestrial" & "Unidentified Flying Object" are real, but the green or any "flesh" creature from outer space are un-believable.

Originally posted by loves a conspiricy
I read a lot in the news that is fabricated, untrue or full of mistruths and propaganda....why in 1952 would it be any different???

Remember..this was just 3 months after pearl harbor....the 1942 one

edit on 28-11-2011 by loves a conspiricy because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-11-2011 by loves a conspiricy because: (no reason given)

By all means...don't believe. Stay right where you're at. Only...if it does come to pass, and it IS real...types with your mentality will be one of the first people soiling their underwear, begging the government for protection, and causing chaos amongst your friends and family because you weren't able to accept the REALITY that you're in infinity...where EVERYTHING is possible. Do you REALLY think that this little, teeny, globe of life is the only thing going on in the far reaches of light-year infinity??? Even more important...Do you REALLY think that we represent the "most intelligent life?" To be honest, I see evidence all around us which clearly state that - We're not really that advanced at all...in fact, we're pretty stagnant. The General Global IQ is dropping. Americans' knowledge of world politics and the awareness of their surroundings is abysmal at best. -Need I bring up the standardized scores that Americans average? So, let me say this...the "average American's IQ rests at about 90-98. Critical thinking skills have dropped and our children are scoring worse than every other industrialized nation in the world on ISTEPS, SATs, and other tests which measure our intellectual capacity. -I would imagine that since I am speaking to a representative sample of America's very fine product, then there's a 75% chance that the person that I am responding to falls into the above category. -THIS IS NOT AN INSULT. THIS IS AN OBSERVATION from demonstrable facts taken by professional surveyors and statisticians.

Here's a bit of information that may help you look outside the box. Earth isn't a homebase for normality. But, it does seem to be a homebase for the egocentric and the self-made expert, who is neither informed, nor educated about the issues that they regularly choose to comment on. I am not accusing you of being one of these people, its just that mathematically speaking, the probability that I am responding to an average American is pretty strong. Just like, the chances that extraterrestrials exist within infinity, is also quite strong.
en.wikipedia.org...

Nonetheless, If I were you, I'd leave that mind of yours open so that way, when something comes along that might not be very explainable, that you don't have a meltdown when you find out that its real. -Again, this is advice and not some sort of veiled insult.-

Eternal LOVE and have a very nice evening...

I see lots of evidence for UFO's and No evidence for ET's

cheers for the news paper clip. It made me laugh with the russian headlines. todays papers are a copy and paste but with the muslim world.

Originally posted by TheStev
reply to post by romanmel

 

Personally, I think this is just semantics really. In most cases I love a good semantic argument, but I think this sort of division harms UFOlogy.

What difference does it make where they came from as long as it's not here? They could be from another planet, another dimension, another time, or another something else altogether. The point is that they're most likely from a different (and therefore alien to us) civilisation. It doesn't matter where that civilisation exists, as long as it's a civilisation other than ours, they are alien visitors.

Sure, it's an interesting thought - but it doesn't really change the impact of them being here.

Thanks for your observation.

To an extent I agree with you. I was responding to the fact that the OP's only explanation was ET's. This is done in the popular press including shows such as "Ancient Aliens" and the writings of Von Danikin where UFOs = ETs in every case, with almost no other possibilities considered.

This paints one into a corner by making a leap of faith that should not be made in the favor of honesty. One should always opt for truth and the truth is we just don't know wheather the occupants of UFOs are ET, ED, Human or Ancient pre-Adamic intellegent being. We may agree that "it doesn't matter" to us, But I think it would matter to the general public.