The Bible has been changed ( rewritten )

reply to post by Devino

If you feel that this is wrong then lets discuss the source of the links and the context therein and forget about Dan Brown.

Ok Devino, Can you show me by this, where the Bible once said this, but now it says something else ? Can you prove that the words with'in the bindings do not convey the same message God wanted us to have ?

First of all, anyone who's read the whole Bible will know that many scriptures are repeated over and over again, making it difficult to change the overall message without it being noticed.

God makes himself known to everyone through the "seen" and "unseen". If you choose not to recognize it, that's your individual choice to make.

Romans 1:16-20

" 16) For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17) For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

18) For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19) Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse."

For those who have tried to change the message, the Bible clearly states that God will deal with them on his terms.

Revelation 22:18-19

18) I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book, 19) and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book."

For anyone who believes in God, why would you limit his abilities to get his message across regardless of whether or not there have been attempts to change it? Do you really give him that little credit?

The answer can be found in your "Spirit", not your mind. Pray and ask for the Spirit to guide you. For those who rely on man for all of the answers, you're wasting your time. Don't you find it rather silly that man would be telling you not to believe in a book that they claim was written by man? If that's the case, you shouldn't be listening to anything they tell you either!

So, don't listen to what I've said, experience it for yourself through the Spirit.

Pretty easy to cut this down to 2 categories:

Fools who are willing to believe Zeitgiest to be more accurate than the most analized Book in civilization EVER,

Or people defending the unseen Faith.

Stand where you will, but when all comes to fruition, see the results.

reply to post by IronArm


You're unaware that "Zeitgiest" was unmercifully debunked and thrashed here in these forums??

Originally posted by d1g1talgangster
We could go back and forth about the validity of "this" and "that" book or scripture, but the bottom line is, YOU (referring to anyone other than myself) cannot prove anything to me about belief...it is my choice to make. I happen to be a follower of Jesus Christ, but I accept that some are not...I was not always myself. My point is, my belief comes not from an accurate copyright on the contents page on my KJV or NIV...it comes from somewhere inside me, from some part of me that is sparked and intrigued and made to feel alive when I not only read scripture, but apply it to my life. And you can tell me all day that I am wrong, but I look at it like this...I have never been sky-diving, so if someone who is an avid sky-diver explains the sport/hobby to me, I have no choice but to take them at their word. I could argue based on this documentary or that manual...but in the end...A person with an argument is ALWAYS at the mercy of a person with an experience. Just my two cents.

Great point! I agree! In the end, only a personal experience or relationship with God (or lack thereof) will make that final determination for each of us.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by Boomer1941
Anyone know why it took over FIFTY YEARS to translate the Dead Sea Scrolls???...lol

One of the scholars who translated the Dead Sea Scrolls, and who knew many secrets of the Vatican also left us a warning.

It is obvious that there is much that those in power don't want the regular people to know, because much of that knowledge would cause worldwide panic.

Work and ordination

Father Martin took part in the research of the Dead Sea Scrolls, and published twenty four articles on Semitic paleography in various journals.[9][10] He did archeological research and worked extensively on the Byblos syllabary in Byblos,[11] in Tyre,[12] both in Lebanon, and in the Sinai Peninsula. Martin assisted in his first exorcism while staying in Egypt for archeological research. It was upon a Muslim.[4] He published a work in two volumes, The Scribal Character of the Dead Sea Scrolls, in 1958.[13]
...Father Malachi Martin was also part of the inner circle of the Vatican and knew secrets that only a few can say they know.

He was actually one of the few people who knew, since he is dead, the Third secret of fatima among other secrets.

Bingo!
Malachi Martin's cause of death has also been questionable and debated in some circles.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


I believe you completely let that statement flow over your head. People who are willing to believe something such as Zeitgiest are foolish. Mayhaps you missed the obviousness of that.

reply to post by Hydroman


It was a harmless rant. I doubt your working for anyone. ~SheopleNation

Originally posted by IronArm
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

I believe you completely let that statement flow over your head. People who are willing to believe something such as Zeitgiest are foolish. Mayhaps you missed the obviousness of that.

If it was "obvious" you wouldn't be wasting bandwith trying to explain what you meant. It was salvageable for the most part.

reply to post by randyvs

Ok Devino, Can you show me by this, where the Bible once said this, but now it says something else ?

Like you, I am not a biblical scholar so I do not have the knowledge of when the word "God" was changed from "elohiym". More importantly I do not know what the original intention was for the meaning of elohiym.

I am basing my opinion on the definition from Strong's Concordance. I would also like to point out that I do not know what others think of Strong's work nor if it has been shown to be inaccurate in part or in its entirety. What I did was present evidence that the word "God" comes from 'elohiym which has a plural and androgynous definition. Also notice that the word 'elohiym and 'elowahh are lower case.

Can you prove that the words with'in the bindings do not convey the same message God wanted us to have ?

It would be wrong of me to dare to assume what God wants. I have my own faith of God and what "he" wants yet I cannot prove this to you or anyone else. 'Faith' and 'proof' are mutually exclusive.

If you ever want to destroy someones faith, prove it to them as fact.

If you feel your faith resides on the Bible being the unchanged written word of God then I feel sorrow. My faith resides within my heart. The Bible could be proven, without a doubt, to be complete and utter garbage yet my faith would remain. I cannot change how I feel, it has become a part of me.


I would like to embed a video that I found interesting. Watch it for your pleasure and take it for what it is.

Originally posted by SheopleNation
It was a harmless rant. I doubt your working for anyone.

~SheopleNation

Oh, I do have a job, it just doesn't have anything to do with anything on these forums. I make hydro-electric power, hence the name Hydroman.

reply to post by Hydroman


I didn't mean that you didn't have a job. I meant that I didn't really believe that you were working for some agenda. Anyway, Hydro-electrics? Sounds like a good occupation. ~SheopleNation

Originally posted by Boomer1941


Bingo!
Malachi Martin's cause of death has also been questionable and debated in some circles.

Yeah, I have written about his questionable death throughout the years in this forum.

He was pushed, I mean he fell down a flight of stairs which supposedly caused a heart attack when he was in good health...

He was also good in bringing out the skeletons in the closet of certain powerful vatican circles, plus the fact that he started to open up to the public about the secrets of the Vatican which he knew about were probably the real reason for his death.

reply to post by randyvs


Let's see. The first example is the 1st Council of Nicea that began in 325. In short, the theology of Athanasius and the differing theology of Arius were debated. Athanasius' views were declared Orthodox(True Opinion..from Greek) and today is known as Roman Catholicism/Greek Orthodox(back then they were one). What happened to Arius and his followers? Sadly, their views, known as Arianism, were declared heretical and the beliefs of the followers of Arius were suppressed, sometimes with violence. Why? Oh, they merely disagreed over the nature of the trinity. Yes, that means their respective bibles were different, if only slightly.

The same thing happened to Celtic christianity in the 660's. It was called the Synod of Whitby. There, the backers of Roman Catholicism and their Celtic counterparts debated their beliefs. Roman Catholicism was held to be Orthodox and Celtic Christianity began to vanish from England, Scotland, and Ireland.

These are merely two examples. In both cases True, Sincere followers of the teachings of Jesus were suppressed for political and egotistical reasons.

You could also take a look at the Apocrypha. It is very interesting reading regarding Christianity that was deemed unfit to be put into the bible. Primarily for control reasons.

Oh yes let's not forget this indisputable fact. Many of the stories in the early old testament are merely stories from older civilizations that were adopted by the Hebrews for themselves. Names of people, places and things were changed but they retained the general moral of the story. The stories of Noah and Adam & Eve were taken directly from the Epic of Gilgamesh. The concept of the so called eternal struggle between good and evil was also adopted by the Hebrews. This time, they used Zoroastrianism as the source material.

The proof is out there for you to find....when you are ready for it. Your request is so very typical of a great many christians today. You demand knowledge and have the gall to require that people provide proof? I REFUSE. I do not bow down to arrogant demands. This is exacerbated by the fact that people have given you sound advice on this thread. What is it that you do? You disregard what is said and demand your precious proof once again. If you were truly curious you would not act in such a manner. I wonder what your true motivations are...

reply to post by My_Reality


Wonder no more ! The truth of my motivation in it's purest form is simply No.1 to see if the claims made in the video would hold up under scrutiny. No. 2 To show that there are good reasons for us to believe this is the message God meant us to have. See if it is allowed to rest in the Bible ? It must be what he wants us to hear.

The proof is out there for you to find....when you are ready for it. Your request is so very typical of a great many christians today. You demand knowledge and have the gall to require that people provide proof? I REFUSE. I do not bow down to arrogant demands. This is exacerbated by the fact that people have given you sound advice on this thread. What is it that you do? You disregard what is said and demand your precious proof once again. If you were truly curious you would not act in such a manner. I wonder what your true motivations are...

Alright! I'll admit I came on strong with my" demands " for proof. Yet I do sight reasons for my doing so.

reply to post by randyvs

The proof is out there for you to find....when you are ready for it. Your request is so very typical of a great many christians today.

So if we are non-Christians we're allowed to shift the burden of proof, is that what I'm supposed to get out of this post? lol

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by IronArm

 

You're unaware that "Zeitgiest" was unmercifully debunked and thrashed here in these forums??

au contraire, i was merciful. it would take pages of corrections to
debunk it properly. well, maybe not merciful but lazy. lol

reply to post by My_Reality


arianism stated that jesus was just a man. that's a big leap from "disagreements about the trinity" to the divinity of jesus. i mean why can't he be god? there are certainly tons of other god men in the 4000 years of civilization preceeding his arrival.

and the apocrypha is in the catholic bible but not the protestant one. although protestant pastors no doubt have read it, as well as other hebrew pseudopigraphia (the book of enoch, the book of giants, book of jasher, etc) and countless related texts.

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by My_Reality

 

arianism stated that jesus was just a man.

that's a big leap from "disagreements about the trinity" to the divinity of jesus. i mean why can't he be god? there are certainly tons of other god men in the 4000 years of civilization preceeding his arrival.

and the apocrypha is in the catholic bible but not the protestant one. although protestant pastors no doubt have read it, as well as other hebrew pseudopigraphia (the book of enoch, the book of giants, book of jasher, etc) and countless related texts.

Comparing world views in search of an explaination for existence. A Creator God, makes the most sense and despite the fantastic tales in the Bible ? Once you accept the possibility of the sentient existence of a spiritual nature ? As being part of another dimension ? That makes up a reality that is more real than the one we are limited to here and now. I see nothing that is so outlandish or immpossible ( from any other world views ) that
could give anyone much reason to doubt that there is a deity capable of transcending space and time even dimensions.

So again I see the only reason for people not accepting a Creator view ? Is mostly because of the authority complex. No doubt many would rather burn in hell denying truth.

Jesus is God ? Even from the neutral, highly propable. From a view of faith ? He's all there is.

I see a drastic flaw in your OP. The Bible was written by men. It was not burnt into rock by a divine being, for all to see and carbon date.

As such, it is open to manipulation by man. God's word is indestructible you state.. if this were truly the case, any attempt to write the Bible originally would have been impossible, because man was penning it, not God.

Futile attempt to trolololol the ATS forums. Simple logic and sense tear your statement to pieces OP.

The only way you could even attempt to "prove" that the Bible was real, based on real events, would be to time travel back in time and witness them yourself and then somehow convey your own visual memories to the world. That in itself is open to criticism as we all chose to "see" what we wish to, and visual memory isn't fact either... so still a very tenuous truth.

Man wrote the Bible, not God. Simple statement. Prove that wrong and you're on to a winner.

Oh and one additional point. You seem to completely avoid the fact that centuries prior to "Jesus" there were other civilisations writing about completely different gods. How do you explain that? How could it be that predating the Bible are other accounts of divine beings? Hmmm.. really complex right?

T