ATS: We Have Failed!

Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by beezzer

 

If the idea is true then why does it need a leader?

We don't need a collective, we need more people adding to the pool of ideas. ATS has many good ideas but many sat on their butts and complained.

I agree. What was OWS's idea?

And complain or criticize?

There is a wee difference.

reply to post by JibbyJedi
Reading your posts, it appears that you want to take it to the next level.

Um. . . . okay.

While I think that is riskier than speaking as an individual, that is your right to do so.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by JibbyJedi

 

Reading your posts, it appears that you want to take it to the next level.

Um. . . . okay.

While I think that is riskier than speaking as an individual, that is your right to do so.

I fly through video games and puzzles, I'm all about getting to the next level vs. stagnant growth and evolution. Where's the "risk" if I got 500 angry, awake & aware patriotic citizens standing right behind me as I offer people like Dick Cheney a choice to surrender peacefully or be taken into custody by force. That's a better deal than the police would offer us for forgetting to pay a parking ticket. His crimes ruined 1000s of lives and killed millions. And he's just one name among many who need to be brought to justice.

If we let one of them get away with crimes against humanity, then the rest will follow that example. We need to set standards for our leaders, currently they think and do get away with murder.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


Knowledge only goes so far...Educating people only goes so far...walking around in circles with signs only goes so far...Occupy could/would only go so far. The "Occupy" phase may be nearing its end but I don't think the war is "over". A new Phase will take root somehow, somewhere and in some different way in which people ACT on the knowledge they gained.

The way I see it "Occupy" was nothing but "advertisement" to "issues" in general. People got curious about the protests and because of that they asked questions. Because there were SOOO many different "issues" that were being brought up many people "learned something new" but as I said, this all can only go so far...the next step it to put it to the test and "occupying" is now obsolete...

Occupy has served its purpose and the next step is "boycott" and refusal to participate in certain parts of society, until the point is made and is made very clear. The point being nothing mysterious and very common knowledge...the "PEOPLE" make the world go around...This point can be illustrated no better than to refuse to participate. There is no violence in saying "NO!" and that should be the first inalienable human right, to say "NO".

One thing I think isn't acknowledged and brought to the forefront enough is the fact a vast majority of "LAWS" that keep people in line and participating are in and of themselves unconstitutional and there for void.

When predominately people who never/rarely participated in the machine (OWS) try to bring the machine down with their protest the machine takes no notice because they were never part of the machine in the first place, they were never accounted for. BUT, when people who DO participate in the machine protest the machine, it has to take notice for there would be no machine without them...

This is the most effective approach. The people who work, pay their taxes, take out loans, pay back loans, have investment accounts and retirement funds sitting in some obscure account at the whim of wall-street...THEY are the only ones who will bring this machine down non-violently. The middle-working class have all the power but are afraid to death to dare exert it because they fear the lower-class. That's the only reason the lower-class exists is to scare the hell out of the middle-class enough so they won't take risks, will fall in line, and play by the book and continue to take it in the A$$ because hey, "at least we aren't poor"...

OWS is only two months old be patient.

This all began in north Africa, then as predicted it spread to Europe, now less than a year later there are anti government protests WorldWide.

When Europe collapses this will become something much much bigger, we will have social unrest the likes of which we have never seen before, eventually all peoples will unite Globally and we will not stop until we "Stick it to the Man"

Tragic irony or poetic justice ?

reply to post by Sly1one


You make a very good point. That idea is something we can all get behind.

Thanks for adding to the discussion!

reply to post by JudgeDeath
Do you believe that the US needs to collapse before we all stand together, or will Europe be the catalyst?

reply to post by sheepslayer247

Once the proverbial dominoes start falling in the Euro zone we will see Anarchy.

The Netherlands Germany France England Italy are all racial powder kegs just waiting for that Spark.

The economic contagion will then reach the USA within weeks if not days.

Here's what I think, and you might hate me for saying this, but all that is happening in the US is nothing more than history repeating itself.

If you study world history carefully you'd see that Empires have come and gone. But whenever they grew far too big and large, with the greed to take over other lands, they ignored the problems brewing on their own soil, which caused their demise.

Its nothing more than that. The Empire of the USofA is collapsing as we speak. Its just resisting like all Empires did. And once that happens, the proverbial Sh!t will not hit the fan like you crazy paranoid people of ATS proclaim on here. Life will go on in a form or another, things will become expensive, the world will switch from the US Dollar to some other currency as its main reserve and you will all look back at these days and say: I was alive and saw this history.

Well, some amount of looting might happen, but people will come to realize this is their country and they will not loot in great numbers. Small events might happen here and there but you people who have computers and sanity will be fine. I can't speak on behalf of the crazy mofos who hoard tons of weaponry like the zombies are going to come after them though.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


Occupy was just the beginning, the real movement hasnt even started yet IMO. This is going to get far worse, a few thousand people with tents is a statement, but we need more than a statement, we need a real threat to the government, threats are the only thing that will make yhe government realise we will not go quietly into the night.

Protesting is never going to work, we know this to be true. We have seen protests of millions in the uk before and it changed absolutely nothing. Protesting will never work. The only thing that will work is taking our countries back by creating a direct threat to those in power. Once thos in power are backed into a corner thy will curl up and start crying, at which point we can bring those responsible for genocide to justice.

The problem is, I hear a lot of complaining and very few if any solutions. As a lefty myself, I have found the OWS movement a little embarrassing. We all know the system is messed up, we all know there are some huge injustices in the world, we all know that we are heading to huge financial crisis, the likes of which have never been experienced for a generation. Yet if after 2 months no solutions have been articulated, no demands put forward and no real organisation established, the movement is collapsing under it's own tactics.

These protests may die down , but as the economic situation kicks in, when America starts implementing it's Austerity measures and more people feel the pain, they will return bigger and probably with more anger.

This is bollocks, if you don't mind me saying that. Change starts with one person actually being honest with what they say and do. 99% of the (1%) are not honest as I'll show by issuing a challenge below.

You 'sheepslayer247' can still change the way you live and start your own revolution by giving away some of what you own to those less fortunate than yourself lest you become a hypocrite.

Otherwise all you are doing is becoming anti-something for the sake of it...(" I don;t like who I am so up the government") Most like protesting but never actually do themselves what they protest about. Green issue people are one example who use petrol, paper and plastic.

So how about you stand by your words. How much of what you own are you going to give away to stand by your own 'standards' ?.

And just in case you throw it back at me, I didn't start this post, you did. I didn't claim something about failing to start change, you did. You change first and show us what you did. and yes, I give about 12% every year and three years ago about 50% in case you are wondering.

reply to post by sheepslayer247

I sincerely believe that it's the job of places like this and GLP (definitely GLP) to ensure that people who start questioning the current corporatocracy regime never actually do anything. These places act as vents for alternative thought and when someone actually does do something (like OWS) a campaign is directed at them making people doubt in the veracity of the cause of make the movement out to be a conspiracy in itself.

I'm disgusted by the campaign waged on OWS by GLP. That place is ran by hideous right-wing idiots that keep the conversation on end of the world Nibiru type crap. Keep the masses scared and uninformed is the motto there. I have seen attempts to do the same here but the system in place at ATS ensures that real opinion floats to the top and the support for OWS is overwhelming.

However, revolution in the US is nowhere near. Medicare and unemployment benefit can be sliced in half and standard of living over there would still be higher than in Japan (where I live). In the world's second largest economy the average wage is half that of the US and cost of living is twice that of the US. The average blue collar worker over here gets less than $1500/mo - they are 4 times worse off than Joe Sixpack in teh US. The US has got a long way to slide before people start rioting against the system. The government will always allow the rats in the race a few morsels so their stomachs are full and the roof over their head is warm, they are not stupid.

So if anyone is expecting a 2nd American Revolution to come out of OWS you have absolutely ZERO chance of seeing that happen. Americans are apathetic sheep, even the ones that are awake. We all are.

THIS IS THE BEST WE CAN DO!!!!!!!

Get use to it.




Either that.... or start praying to God.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


Why not take the protesting to the gates of the Energy Firms?

This is where a lot of our hard earned cash goes too... it's not just banks who are profiting!! The big chiefs of these firms take 70% bonus at the end of the year, sometimes more and the put the prices up for us hard living people who already have enough to fork out!!

All these "movements" are bought and paid for by the corporate leaders that have enslaved you in the first place. The only way to force change on the U.S is via armed revolution, and that's a fight that sadly we cannot win.

Peaceful protesting, etc, won't get you anywhere against the reigning monarchy. Sure, it's great to fantasize about a million people marching on the capital, but it's not going to get you anywhere. Not anymore at least.

reply to post by Doomsday 2029

Epic Carlin. The man was truly awake. What a mind, what a loss.

You know, when I first heard about OWS I thought to myself "Hey, this looks like something I can get behind". Then the leftists, commies, and Michael Moore showed up. I read the list of demands, and the true colors came out. Bunch of free loaders pissed because they didn't get handed something, and have to actually pay their debt. Boo freakin Hoo.

At that point I decided to look a little deeper into the movement. Not my cup of tea. While I did not agree with their agenda, I did support the fact that they were exercising their Constitutional right to peaceably assemble. At least they got off of their butts and did something. Now if the movement had been directed at our leaders and the FED, with a message more in tune with bringing troops back to defend us, and not the rest of the world, then I would have jumped in with both feet.

Any movement that supports free loaders and socialists I will never stand behind. I stand behind those who demand we return to our Constitution and not this nanny/police state that currently exists. If we fix our government we fix the rest. You can't effect change with corporations without cutting their cash flow. That is all they understand. Until you change your buying habits, they will continue to pillage. Change the corrupt government, and now you have a fighting chance.

reply to post by LightAssassin

Research who pushed the Federal Reserve Act, the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act and to whose benefit both were enacted.
Read up on the Bretton Woods conference and in whose interests all of these steps were taken and you will find the real culprits behind all of this.

Did we expect a speech full of dramatic pauses from our Figurehead in Chief? "My fellow Americans....The congress....who naturally...works against me.....has agreed....with me....to enact sweeping....legislation...that will reform....our way of life. The anti agreed bill....insures there will be....high paying jobs....for the lowest workers....affordable housing....and 2 months of vacation. This path....will make me...unpopular....with the people...who line my pockets...and other powerful people. But....I am confident...loopholes will be found. As a rider...cereal commercials....are back. Please...enjoy the return...of commercialism....and entrepreneurship. Grunge is dead. Long live Disney."