OWS camp in NYC getting raided - Now .

Well if the owner wants them to go.. they should go.. and occupy public property if they want,

No need to offend the owners of the property.. their probably worried about liability.

reply to post by thatonedude


Well let me just say that I don't agree with you that a peaceful change is not possible. I think enough blood has already been shed and the system that exists today can work and can be reformed. I think that the politicians are on the edge of their seats watching very closely which way the majority of the people are leaning.

Many of the hard lines that were drawn by the Banks have been withdrawn and are they are trying to do damage control. The people can still be effective without using violence. One problem is that less and less people are actually voting.

What I hope for is that the new political party that springs from this movement will inspire people to get back out there and occupy the voting booths again. In the most recent elections voter turnout was down. Which is a shame and a big part of the problem. Their is no one we want to vote for so we just give up our right to vote. People say things like I don't want to be a part of it.

A new political party that speaks to the issues brought forth by this movement might at least put a few more people in the elections worth voting for and in turn might put a few more people back in the voting booths. If all else fails I am ready for what ever it takes. I just don't think we're at the stage of using a last resort technique like a violent revolution.

+

MSM is reporting no comment from owners of Zuccotti. What's strange though, is that the mayor's office is saying that this move is "only temporary."

"Occupants of Zuccotti should temporarily leave and remove tents and tarps. Protestors can return after the Park is cleared," the mayor's office said in a tweet at 1:34 a.m.

Source

reply to post by MathiasAndrew

Many of the hard lines that were drawn by the Banks have been withdrawn and are they are trying to do damage control. The people can still be effective without using violence. One problem is that less and less people are actually voting.

This is one of the reasons I feel we are beyond a peaceful solution.
The peoples voices are being muted too fast to make a difference and some type of intervention must change this.
Whats the point of lining up in the streets and protesting if the media makes you out to be the bad guys?
I don't advocate violence I just realize it's necessity in changing the human will.

reply to post by nick112


The same thing has taken place in Occupy Oakland. They have removed the tents. They do not want people using tents, doing outdoor cooking and camping. They have said that they will allow protesters back onto the Frank Ogawa Plaza in Oakland.

But they are going to increase the police presence and try to prevent any occupiers from rebuilding a tent city. This seems to be a Nationwide coordinated effort to remove to junk and clean up the areas that were being occupied. They are testing the will of the protesters and also somewhat removing the health issues and criminal elements that were starting to become a problem at the occupy encampments.

It's time for phase two of this movement. It's time to regroup and create the goals and agenda that was lacking during the first phase. It's time to take the issues to poles and Occupy the voting booths

reply to post by thatonedude

This is one of the reasons I feel we are beyond a peaceful solution.
The peoples voices are being muted too fast to make a difference and some type of intervention must change this.
Whats the point of lining up in the streets and protesting if the media makes you out to be the bad guys?
I don't advocate violence I just realize it's necessity in changing the human will.

TPTB want us to abandon our system. They would love for to over throw our Government. Their whole agenda is to dismantle the American political system and enact Marshall Law. They want to create a Globalist society and eliminate the US Constitution.

We would be falling right into their trap if we were to revolt. TPTB know what's happening before we do. They monitor internet chatter and can be prepared for any movement of the people. There is no way violence will work in this situation. I believe what you're talking about is a Martyr.

Maybe you believe a few people need to be sacrificed in a sense and become Martyrs. I don't think someone needs to die or fight or be injured to inspire people to speak out and vote for change. The peaceful protest movements of the past have been effective in creating change. The civil rights movement, women's rights movement, the things that Ghandi and Martin Luther King Jr stood for were some of the biggest and most effective. There was violence during those movements but it was not the protesters who started the violence in most cases.

I would like to hear your plan and ideas in more detail. Please describe the actions and outcomes and amounts of violence necessary for efficient change. What change do you want and who should the violence be directed at.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
Excellent point. People who are trying to bring socialist Utopia not liking their property taken by the State while they yet occupy the property donated to the city by private citizens, rather ironic.

It is not even donated. The land is owned wholly by a private entity for the purposes of public use. Such action does not warrent nor give a blank check to the protestors that are "ALLOWED" to camp upon those grounds.

reply to post by ownbestenemy


There is a problem that exist in our current society. Local governments are becoming bankrupt. They can not afford to pay for the basic public services that we all are accustomed to. The schools system is broke, police and firefighting agencies are being cut back. Roads are and bridges are not being kept up to safe standards.All kinds of infrastructure can not be sustained at the current pace. Social security, government pensions all going broke.

This is the way that public land becomes private. In a desperate attempt to pay the debt and interest on that debt. Cities, Counties and States are selling off public land to large Corporations willing to invest. They buy a public park and promise to keep it a public park for 5 or 10 years. Then after a certain amount of time has passed since the transfer of the property from public to private has taken place. The company or corporation can develop that land and do what ever they want with it.

It's happening all over the place. Hasn't anyone heard of Agenda 21 ? Gas, electricity, sewer, water systems all becoming owned by private companies and corporations. Which will lead to higher rates for all citizens and more debt for the cities and counties that use those services. We need to stop the selling of public land to pay off our debts. The interest rates at which our governments have been borrowing money is crippling our economy.

It's not because of a few lazy hippies why the housing markets crashed and almost everybody who owned property now owes more than the property is worth. It's not the fault of a bunch of lazy hippies, why our government has borrowed huge amounts of money that just disappears into the military war machine. Please be careful about accepting the ideas of public land being sold off to private corporations. That is a dangerous road and soon our National Parks and entire infrastructure will be at the mercy of the big banks.

reply to post by MegasAlexandros


dont make me laugh, this is not a real attempt at anything other than providing the proof that these people cannot think for themselves, that they are herd animals, and that they can be easily manipulated.
I'm angry that so many savvy people have let themselves be used.

And before you start, if and when an event of natural conception begins, that looks and sounds genuine, i will be there, i am nobodys puppet.
OWS will not get anything done, all it is doing is making people forget what you should be asking for.
The genuine event will be something unexpected, caused by revulsion en masse of something so abhorrent the government will not be able to hide it.
That would be genuine, the OWS does not affect the magic 35% (the number of citizens in a population who need to be moved into organising together to change things without asking for change) and it won't ever because it is not genuine revulsion people are feeling.

The next false flag, that might get it done, if we are bright enough to see it for what it is.

reply to post by Swills


Wait till spring this isnt over

Originally posted by The X
reply to post by MegasAlexandros

 

dont make me laugh, this is not a real attempt at anything other than providing the proof that these people cannot think for themselves, that they are herd animals, and that they can be easily manipulated.
I'm angry that so many savvy people have let themselves be used.

And before you start, if and when an event of natural conception begins, that looks and sounds genuine, i will be there, i am nobodys puppet.
OWS will not get anything done, all it is doing is making people forget what you should be asking for.
The genuine event will be something unexpected, caused by revulsion en masse of something so abhorrent the government will not be able to hide it.
That would be genuine, the OWS does not affect the magic 35% (the number of citizens in a population who need to be moved into organising together to change things without asking for change) and it won't ever because it is not genuine revulsion people are feeling.

The next false flag, that might get it done, if we are bright enough to see it for what it is.

"the OWS does not affect the magic 35% (the number of citizens in a population who need to be moved into organising together to change things without asking for change) and it won't ever because it is not genuine revulsion people are feeling."

I can't believe people actually still believe the Propaganda Machine on TV

You don't get it, it's not going to end! Everyone is the 99%- The only ones who don't realize it are the ones who still watch TV!!!





I laugh at you, not to be mean but I am literally laughing out loud. The funny thing is, we know God is our side and the revolution WILL succeed.

occupywallst.org...

Originally posted by MegasAlexandros
When our posterity look back in history, they will say thousands watched as their brothers, sisters, children, grandchildren, parents, and grandparents were defeated in their final attempt to secure freedom.

Say good bye to future protests, because any future protests people organize will be lamblasted after this debacle regardless of the cause.

Good Job knuckle heads. The government has won

Originally posted by thatonedude

This is one of the reasons I feel we are beyond a peaceful solution.
The peoples voices are being muted too fast to make a difference and some type of intervention must change this.
Whats the point of lining up in the streets and protesting if the media makes you out to be the bad guys?
I don't advocate violence I just realize it's necessity in changing the human will.

Starred.

There will be no peaceful change friend, when you have Americans, our own brethren, siding with the corporations and bankers, you can see that too much of the public has been poisoned by the rhetoric and propaganda that has been beaten into our hides over the last god knows how many years.

This government will end just how it began: in bloodshed. People don't want to hear that, but there's no such thing as peaceful change. TPTB, the elite, the bankers that run government, whoever you want to look at as our collective enemy, will NOT hand the country back to the people by peaceful means. You are delusional if you think that working through a compromised government to enact change will work. You are delusional if you don't think that there will not be madness in the streets of the US once the SHTF economically.

Lets keep it real with ourselves. Holding a sign and chanting only spreads awareness. The United States did not become free from the British by holding signs and signing kumbaya.

I'm not advocating violent revolution, I am telling you with the way things are going, it is an inevitability especially once those of us who are still sitting pretty are knocked down to the level of the very poor and unemployed that they have been holding their noses up at.

reply to post by sonnny1


Now you need to prove that the owners of the private property want them gone. If the owners do not want them gone, then double SHAME.

Any future protests that take place can be ridiculed and any number of reasons can be brought forth to discredit it. Like even if their held on public property, they are violating the rights of others with their loud noises. You can count on it.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus

Originally posted by ownbestenemy
reply to post by mayabong

 

Overall, one must remember that Zuccotti Park is a privately-owned public space. If the developer wishes to "evict" the people within it is their right to do so to protect their investment. But be damned private property rights right?!

Post Script: This shouldn't be construed to be an endorsement of questionable police tactics; but if the developer wants to press charges on all the protesters that choose to stay within the park; I am for that.

edit on 15-11-2011 by ownbestenemy because: (no reason given)

Excellent point. People who are trying to bring socialist Utopia not liking their property taken by the State while they yet occupy the property donated to the city by private citizends, rather ironic.

Originally posted by jacobe001
Any future protests that take place can be ridiculed and any number of reasons can be brought forth to discredit it. Like even if their held on public property, they are violating the rights of others with their loud noises. You can count on it.

Ridiculed by who? Cowards? Shills for the elite? Who will ridicule future protests, especially if economic conditions continue to deteriorate and the corruption continues?

Explain that. Who will be ridiculing? You?

Originally posted by illuminatislave
Starred.

There will be no peaceful change friend, when you have Americans, our own brethren, siding with the corporations and bankers, you can see that too much of the public has been poisoned by the rhetoric and propaganda that has been beaten into our hides over the last god knows how many years.

This government will end just how it began: in bloodshed. People don't want to hear that, but there's no such thing as peaceful change. TPTB, the elite, the bankers that run government, whoever you want to look at as our collective enemy, will NOT hand the country back to the people by peaceful means. You are delusional if you think that working through a compromised government to enact change will work. You are delusional if you don't think that there will not be madness in the streets of the US once the SHTF economically.

Lets keep it real with ourselves. Holding a sign and chanting only spreads awareness. The United States did not become free from the British by holding signs and signing kumbaya.

I'm not advocating violent revolution, I am telling you with the way things are going, it is an inevitability especially once those of us who are still sitting pretty are knocked down to the level of the very poor and unemployed that they have been holding their noses up at.

It's a fact, the American Warlords will be beheaded soon enough!!!

That's why they are scared.

OWS is a global revolution!



They can only hire so many police... until we raid the castle!

And those of you talking about private property...funny how some Americans are quick to defend the private property rights of corporations, but say nothing when the private property rights of civilians are violated by the police.

They have brainwashed this country into believing that the elite and their corporations are better than us, the citizens of the United States, when in reality, the elite would be the ones running for the hills and begging for mercy like Muammar Gaddafi did when the people finally got their hands on him.

Keep thinking that this kind of stuff won't happen here. There are several figures in government who would be wise to seek asylum elsewhere when SHTF.

reply to post by illuminatislave

And those of you talking about private property...funny how some Americans are quick to defend the private property rights of corporations, but say nothing when the private property rights of civilians are violated by the police.

Really? When did this happen?

Im pretty sure that the same people screaming for the rights of private property owners here on ATS are the same ones screaming and posting threads when private citizens private property rights are violated......

Want to back that accusation up?

If it seems like the "elite" arent concerned its because they ARENT , you guys sitting in parks and running around with signs are no threat to them............

You know who is? People of ACTION, walking around with signs and camping out is not ACTION, its the illusion of action...........

Action is petitioning, action is voting, action is calling your congressmen, action is DOING something.......

Action is cutting their funding...........

They are not afraid of OWS........

Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by illuminatislave

 

And those of you talking about private property...funny how some Americans are quick to defend the private property rights of corporations, but say nothing when the private property rights of civilians are violated by the police.

Really? When did this happen?

Im pretty sure that the same people screaming for the rights of private property owners here on ATS are the same ones screaming and posting threads when private citizens private property rights are violated......

Want to back that accusation up?

Lol....

Homie, this is a revolution not a protest. You don't get it....

The laws don't matter anymore (well, they have been temporarily suspended) because we no longer consider the people "occupying" DC to be our government.

The people are the government....

occupywallst.org...

TURN OFF THE TV