OWS Hipster Vs Ex-Marine/Retired NYPD - Guess who won

Originally posted by muzzleflash
"A time and place for 1st Amendment"?????
Every Time and Every Place? Hello?

None of you deserve liberty because you support it being trampled.

That is one of the most asinine statements I have heard today. You make a generalized dumb**s remark just because not everyone agrees with you... Are you 12 or are you 13 years of age?

Let's pat this authoritarian cop on the back for a job well done! That's one less freedom to worry about! Bravo!

Whether you agree with it or not, he did the job he was supposed to do. So,yeah, a pat on the back is a good thing here.

I don't like what you say so you will be forcibly removed physically.'
Right.

If he was breaking the law, he probably deserved what he got for his trouble.

And yes, you do have a right to be a jerk. But you don't have a right to touch people and pull them around because you disagree with them.

NO you don't... If you are being disruptive in a public place, you reserve the right to get what they want to give you. You obviously don't remember that it works two ways. It's not all about OWS dummies. It's about both sides.

If the fellow had done something illegal, he is liable to local laws, state laws, perhaps Federal Laws, and the possibility of being sued and owned by the poor little fellow who was being a dork.

reply to post by sigung86


You're quite right about one thing.. the retired cop is liable both criminally and civilly.



salut

There are no "ex-Marines."

The first amendment right is to free speech, but, sometimes, hecklers are not about being heard-- but about making sure another is not heard, in which case the heckler was violating the rights of others.

I understand the sentiment of the man who dragged the heckler out, but don't think I like the method.

I wasn't there.

"There is a time and place to exercise your First Amendment rights,’’ said Hiltunen"

Yep there is. All the time, everywhere. With this comment he is essentially advocating both free speech zones and free speech time slots. Which I find despicable.

Originally posted by GringoViejo
So... are you saying the person being swore in didn't have a right to speak? The people in the crowd didn't have the right to listen? Only the protester?

What about "no exceptions?"

This is a thin line, and if I were a part of OWS I wouldn't be defending this idiot. Being rude is exactly the right way to alienate potential support.

I'm sorry to the arm-chair patriots, but free speech doesn't give you carte blanche to say whatever you wish, whenever you wish. Other people have rights as well, which you have to respect. If you don't, this is what happens.

edit on 14-11-2011 by GringoViejo because: (no reason given)

which came first the chicken or the egg? She could have shut up and listened to the protester just as easily as he could have shut up and listened to her...

Why does she suddenly have more "legitimacy" to a voice on any location on earth at any time compared to this other man? Oh that's right because some people put her up on a pedestal because they are disillusioned to think she is better than some and thus her voice more important and legitimate.

If Patton interrupted one of Hitler's speeches it would be justified if he got smacked around by an SS storm trooper right?

I mean where people "draw the line' that you are referring to is based solely upon their personal opinion on who has more "right" to speak than the other. Its not common sense because its based off of interpretation...the RIGHT to free speech doesn't mean based on a "Marines" interpretation of who has MORE RIGHT to speak.

The right to free speech is all encompassing and doesn't recognize individual interpretation/application. It means I have a right for my voice to be heard PERIOD, no If's and's or but's about it. The Marine and the pedestal puppet had their right to shout back as much as they wanted...but physically/forcibly doing something to someone else is indeed a true rights violation.

Having said that, ya the guy was being a douche and was irritating and obviously isn't going to get his message across that way. But that doesn't mean I (or anyone else) suddenly gets to amend the constitution on a whim and violate the mans right for his voice to be heard.

99% of the time you can avoid having people interrupt you rudely and what not by simply being an honest person who "hears them out" the FIRST time...which NONE of these pedestal puppets do...so of course people are going to lose their cool and act a fool...

I agree with Muzzleflash on this one.

Were one step away from having justified rights in place of inalienable rights. The problem with "justified rights" rights is who gets to determine whats "justified"???? The PEOPLE??? a DEMOCRACY?

Im sorry but this country and its failures to secure even the foundation it was built on (constitution) is proof enough for me to know that majority rule democracy is ineffective in the hands of imbeciles who cant even adhere to the foundation everything else was built on.

As much as people like to see an annoying/irritating/douchy loudmouth shut up by a marine...it sets a precedent that its ok to "shut people up' if everyone else "thinks its ok".

Everyone else in the south thought "slavery" was ok...Everyone else in Nazi Germany thought "justified genocide" was ok...so because everyone thinks its ok "hey its OK!" your moral/ethical values better transcend FADS and TRENDS otherwise you will find yourself a SS storm trooper or KKK member just because its "in this season' with the "majority"...

/rant

reply to post by CREAM


OWS isn't a liberal movement?

George Soros is pulling the strings at OWS. Last time I checked, Soros was a socialist and supported Obama not Ron Paul. 

Link

Watch out New York City. The Occupy anti-capitalist movement is preparing to serve a three-course meal of so-called direct action that apparently includes the blocking of subways and bridges as well as shutting down the stock market. The attempt to cause mass chaos, slated for Thursday, is tied to the Tides Center, the George Soros-financed group that funds far-left causes. Tides grantees have been helping to direct Occupy from the onset of the anti-Wall Street movement. Occupy Wall Street is currently holding "Direct Action Preparation and Training" courses today and tomorrow in downtown Manhattan to gear up for Thursday's round of riots.

Ex-cop needs to keep his authoritarian hands to himself. Counter the protester's free speech with free speech of your own. What he did was assault. So, if ows protesters grabbed the politician and dragged him away for being a pos, it would be ok? Nah, that would be assault and you'd see a pack of pigs coming after the protesters. Why does the free speech right of the politician, a man like any other, trump the free speech of an ows protester to the point of physical violence? Obviously laws are extremely flexible to the authoritarian pigs and ex-pigs when it comes to the upper and lower classes.
Anyhow, if the politician doesnt want to be heckled then he should get rent a building and give his speeches there protest free or face the possibility of someone in the crowd not agreeing with the snake oil he's peddling. Also, he could stop being a criminal pos and do something worthwhile for society and actually EARN praise not simply demand it. "Time and place for First Amendment rights"? Wtf is this ex-pig scum thinking? He is obviously all for free speech zone as long as it is not his speech restricted. Wasn't he taught in school to speak with his mouth not with his hands? Hands to yourself ya pos! /rant

the disinfo attempts are priceless, really thought out to

i'd just like to register my appreciation that the article linked in the OP
is so balanced and neutral
good to see this divisiveness and name-calling come to an end.



@seabag; Soros? still? YAWN.

reply to post by SirMike

congressman’s swearing-in ceremony....

....historic occasion

Cool Story Bro.

Originally posted by muzzleflash

Originally posted by shadowreborn89
well they time and place is now. but ratically going in and screaming could be a lil wrong ><

Which is worse? Some crazy guy screaming?

Or living in a world where no one can scream because the authoritarians will silence you by force through battery?

Voicing opinion in public = Legal.
Battery to remove protester = Illegal.

I fully agree with OWS, I fully agree with the right to free speech. But I'm afraid you are mistaken in your assertion here. Look at it from a different angle. If, as you state, it is your right to express your disagreement to the point where the the original speaker cannot be heard then surely if you TRULY believe in that freedom then the reverse is true. Your voice can be drowned out by the calls of those who disagree with you, it is their right.

The problem then is that the very voices you wish to be heard (anti government if you like) can be legitimately drowned out by those agreeing with government (or paid for that matter).

This will instantly suppress your freedom EVERYWHERE.

The above situation keeps your freedom to be heard BUT NOT to supress others to be heard.

Your opinion is dangerous and could lead to genuine protest being supressed but your agitated anger prevents you from thinking clearly.

Someone finally starts to protest the government and he is dragged.

Originally posted by SpeachM1litant
"There is a time and place to exercise your First Amendment rights,’’ said Hiltunen"

Yep there is. All the time, everywhere. With this comment he is essentially advocating both free speech zones and free speech time slots. Which I find despicable.

Exactly.

Its amazing to see on a conspiracy website that we have so many authoritarian loving pigs trolling about on here. Makes you wonder if some posts are being forwarded to spooks and IPs are being logged by anyone who speaks differently.

The hipster punk got what he deserved. Those people have no respect for anyone and do what they please.

Originally posted by decepticonLaura
i'd just like to register my appreciation that the article linked in the OP
is so balanced and neutral
good to see this divisiveness and name-calling come to an end.



@seabag; Soros? still? YAWN.

edit on 15-11-2011 by decepticonLaura because: typographical instabilities

What do you know about fair and balanced? Please give us an example. While you're at it, maybe you can share with us all that OWS has accomplished since we last discussed it. Oh wait...just chaos, nothing has changed. 

And Yes, Soros. Not still....again! More evidence that the richest socialist in the world is pulling the strings of OWS. It won't go away. Its tough to shake the truth. Now he's preparing his sheeple to cause more chaos. 

The attempt to cause mass chaos, slated for Thursday, is tied to the Tides Center, the George Soros-financed group that funds far-left causes. Tides grantees have been helping to direct Occupy from the onset of the anti-Wall Street movement.

Who won?
Brute force. Intimidation. Police state. Authoritarianism. NWO. Wall Street. Status Quo. Their muzzle.
Who lost?
You. Me. Passive resistance. Representation. Fairness. Main Street. Real Change. Your voice..

Originally posted by el1jah
Makes me think of that guy who was heckling Niel Armstrong. Protesting is just, but you cant be obnoxious and expect to be heard.

Exactly...your pursuit of happiness and your rights should not interfere with others and their ability to enjoy life.

While OWS does make sense on paper, nothing is ever won on paper........


I say....back to the drawing board because this thing is getting taken over by people who most of us would rather have not represent us.


Most of the OWS people don't represent most Americans. The people who started had a good idea but it got hijacked weeks ago.


Think..ows....what would be hijack proof......Cause wise.....they need a better plan

Originally posted by muzzleflash
"A time and place for 1st Amendment"?????
Every Time and Every Place? Hello?

None of you deserve liberty because you support it being trampled.

Let's pat this authoritarian cop on the back for a job well done! That's one less freedom to worry about! Bravo!

'I don't like what you say so you will be forcibly removed physically.'
Right.

And yes, you do have a right to be a jerk. But you don't have a right to touch people and pull them around because you disagree with them.

What if i walked into your job and started protesting....( assuming your job was at a public place ) , and I was disrupting you from doing your job.


Those people have been apoointed to do a job and this man is interfering with them trying to WORK.

Kind of makes him look like a jack ash right ?

Complaining about no jobs.....and then harassing those that are still trying to do theirs ?

Kinda moronic..

The best way is always the smart way.....he was not smart.

Originally posted by LucidDreamer85

What if i walked into your job and started protesting....

Big difference.

A "Job" is usually at a privately owned location. Therefore the protest must remain outside on public property.

This event I am led to believe occurred on public property, therefore it is a different situation all together.