This is what a police state looks like...

Before you flame, mind you that I am neither condoning or supporting the actions of the police in this video.

There are rules that have to be followed, both for those on the sides of the protestors and those on the sides of the police. We do not know what all is going on in this video, save that which it shows and only shows us, taking the entire situation out of context.

While the video shows aggressive force on the part of the police, it leads to questions as to what was the build up, the students were protesting surrounded by the police. Were they given fair warning, such as disperse, come no closer? That is not shown or heard on the video tape. Nor is the location mentioned at all, is this say a public park or a private establishment? Did they have the right to be there, or were they trespassing?

Those are the kinds of questions that need to be answered before we can make any sort of judgment as to who is right and who is wrong.

On the side of the protestors, the question is why did they not pull a Gandhi in this case, first group walks up, gets beaten, pulled away and the next group comes up, over and over? Or do a sit down and not move, going fully dead weight, making the police work twice as hard, why stand there and keep inching forward? Did they not think that the police would respond and what kind of response did they think that they would get, the police would just throw down their weapons and join them or let them pass?

The reality is that in our pursuit of law and order in our society, we have entrusted the keeping of such to the police. We ask much of them and demand that they act above the law. To that end they try, and like all humans are often subject to seeing the best and worst that humanity offers. We can not hear what all was being stated by the police to the people in front as the chanting drowned them out and thus an investigation would need to be conducted, along with testimony on the part of both the protestors who got hit and the police who did the striking. Should no warning was given before any of this, then the police was at fault, but if warning was given, then the police should be exonerated from charges.

Most police and law enforcement have procedures that they must follow, be it for the better or worse, and be it that we do or do not like those procedures they are there to protect both the innocent and the guilty alike. I for one would have liked to see any and all evidence in this instance before making judgment call.

I saw this video on the news this morning.

It is upsetting.

However, I'd like to have context before I condemn the police.
Where were the protestors?
Why did they have to be at that place?
What were the police instructed to do?

It seems to me, that the Occupy movement should be embracing the police as their brothers and sisters but instead, the Occupy movement keeps creating situations where the police are called in to stop what the Occupy people are doing.

The Occupy movement needs to get rid of the crazies and start to focus on how they can bring their message to the people and start to bring about the change that this country needs.

Here is a link to the abc coverage of this event.

ABC

Here is a description of the event from the article.

"BERKELEY, Calif. (KGO) -- Police and "Occupy Cal" protesters squared off Wednesday evening in front of Sproul Hall. UC Berkeley officials told the group they could not have tents and when some demonstrators started to defy those rules, police moved in to make arrests and remove the tents. Police also pushed the crowd off of the patch of grass the group was occupying. "

Did anyone else notice the cop down on the left looked like he was going to put the baton over that guys head to strangle him? He pulled back and hit him, but he definitely wanted to strangle him. WOW no matter what you feel about the protesting, there is absolutely no reason for the violence that these cops started.

Originally posted by IndigoValor

Watch the protesters do completely nothing. Then a woman gets jabbed in by a baton...Seriously?

At 0:41 watch the policeman in the bottom left corner...

edit on 9-11-2011 by IndigoValor because: (no reason given)

Gotta hand it to the crowd, the way they handled that, courageously, but without fighting back.

Did you see how many cops were lined up there? WTH?!!!

These are peaceful protestors!

That's terrible. I'm glad I'm not an American, or I'd have to get my ass down there, but being a mesomorph bodytype, I fear I might have thrown a cop, picked him right up and thrown him down on his head, and that's not like me as a compassionate Christian soul.

That made me angry watching that, and here I was just sitting here eating my egg mcmuffin with coffee, although I can't blame you for posting it.

We've been living in a Police State since the 1950's, when the civil rights movement started. Police have been doing what you see in this video for 60 years.

I have no idea why our nation holds citizens to a higher expectation of assault than the police. Police are allowed to assault citizens carte blanche, but citizens if so much as raise a finger at police, they get arrested for Assault of a Police Officer, Resisting Arrest, Disrupting the Peace, Interference of Police Business, etc....

reply to post by g146541

If anon does find out the names, they need to keep their addresses, phone numbers, and family out of it. It's getting ridiculous. A lot of these cops have children, who don't need to suffer from the mistakes of their parents. Some of those cops need to be investigated, but the sad thing is, nothing will be done.

Yea... wtf, these guys are psychopaths. Too bad that a lot of these a**holes are attracted to these kind of jobs. What a bunch of cowards man, they can only hurt defenseless people. Disgusting behaviour.

reply to post by sdcigarpig


There really is no grey area here. Sure, we didn't see everything that happened there and there, I'm sure, were certain circumstances that lead to police taking their actions...

however...

1. It takes two to Tango. The police had to show up in order for the beatings to begin.

2. The police come armed to the teeth. Their job is defined by violence and being paid by the State, only take the simple and uninspired, uncreative approach. In their minds only exist the thoughts of whether or not there will be violence. If you know anything about how your thoughts work, you'd know that what you think about, you become and it's why some say that police create the criminals they fight.

What goes on in the minds of the protestors are things like "this country needs to change in a peaceful way".

So peaceful protestors meet with violent minded police and there is only one outcome of that.

And you want to defend the police position that people were throwing rocks and bottles? They're wearing football gear! and are armed to the teeth!

They should actually absorb some of the violence to prove real strength. Like when your wife is pissed and hits you for some reason. If you are strong, you take the hit and move on.

Yet you see a policeman in full riot gear gets hit with some piece of trash and thinks the protestor needs to go to jail!

It's very simple and it's fundamental.

And you are saying that there are certain circumstances where you'll accept a policeman ramming a baton into the gut of a young woman?

Originally posted by Cryptonomicon
We've been living in a Police State since the 1950's, when the civil rights movement started. Police have been doing what you see in this video for 60 years.

I have no idea why our nation holds citizens to a higher expectation of assault than the police. Police are allowed to assault citizens carte blanche, but citizens if so much as raise a finger at police, they get arrested for Assault of a Police Officer, Resisting Arrest, Disrupting the Peace, Interference of Police Business, etc....

I would think a great strategy would be to just grab one of the officers, pull him into the crowd surrounding him utterly, but not harming so much as a hair on his head, and then releasing him back to join his buddies, his heart pounding, and hand him a letter at the same time, to read to his friends.. you know really give it to them, in the mind and heart, and do so in a powerful non-violent and resistant manner, that's what I'm thinking.

When you grab the devil by the beard and pull, nothing comes away but mere fluff in your hand.

Enough is enough... No change is going to happen protesting peacefully.

I wonder if this is just a big joke amongst the police and their employers. Some kind of efed up cop pinata party. Sitting getting whacked with batons does nothing but change the way one looks. If I was there I would have been arrested. Not before one hell of a thumping from the goon squad tho I do not understand how they could just sit there and take a beating. Are they trying to prove a point to "oh, look at the mean cops world" Let me tell you this.... THE WORLD DOES NOT CARE! They have their own problems.

I think the video is disgusting and it's becoming too common a sight. Those particular cops had no right to act as they did. I've said it before and will keep saying it until my fingers fall off, not all cops are bad, not all protesters are bad and the bad ones are probably in the minority. Forget the movement for a minute, all of you...supporters and detractors.

On one side there's propaganda targetting the movement on the other there is propaganda targetting the cops. Who and what is getting lost in the mix? When an enemy has been named in your mind you don't feel as bad when "they" get hurt or killed. This is the method that is always used to make wars ok in the minds of the people fighting those wars or losing loved ones in those wars. This is how we always end up locking our own chains. Reject this paradigm. Understand the paradigm is enforced because hate is the emotion that short circuits the others and over rules logic. All the dirty work is being done while we call eachother morons and take up arms against eachother.

If you truly want freedom, it can never come at the expense of anothers. Unless a person is truly corrupted or truly mentally ill, all any person ever wants is love and security for themselves and their family. We don't need to fight back...not in the way that is being expressed in this thread. You fight back by refusing to fight, sit down, disobey orders to hurt another human being.

I understand the purpose of a peaceful protest but when the "peace officers" are refusing to act peacefully, action must take place. As much as I dread the idea of another war. I think a war needs to be waged against the ruthless cops that refuse to make peace. It's time to take up arms and take our country back. The police have lost all credibility and need to be removed and replaced.

Occupy Portland= head and body lice outbreak. Occupy Vancouver= people overdosing in their tents. Maybe these bums should stop looking for handouts, and stop trying to provoke the cops. Go get a job.

Originally posted by blupblup
This is what should happen...


Look what happens when these cops "jab" someone, an unarmed man.

That's how it should be. People need to stand up for each other, against injustice.

Originally posted by randomname
aren't you allowed to hit back. isn't self defence to use force to stop a police officer from cracking your head open with a baton.

No law in this world can dictate your life to self preservation.

-rrr

This is what a police state looks like...,

On the contrary, a police state event would have been reversed. Instead of 10 or 15 (in view only) cops fighting a hundred or so protesters, it would have been 15 or so protesters fights off a hundred cops. So no police state yet but there is allways tomorrow

The police don't know how to handle peaceful non-compliance. That is why you will always see them instigate trouble. They know how to handle that.

I think the protesters have got it right. Stay peaceful and the cops end up looking like the thugs that they are.

reply to post by MrUncreated


maybe they all should have disrupted the game together. maybe the people running the stadium shouldnt have hired the police to do what they did. maybe the fans shouldnt have payed to watch the game. the true fans of the game should have whipped up on the jerk who started this whole incident.
it must be capitalism's fault.

reply to post by stephanies-chase


Why?
How many cops families have been hurt to date?
How many officers have been retaliated against?
Mmmhm, zero, zip, zilch!
But it may be a deterrent for future officers if they know that if they intend to oppress, they may become a nationwide target.
The crowds tell these officers, "the whole world is watching", it would be a good thing to prove it by taking some names.