Leading Muslim Terrorist gives this warning. Sept 1st 04

Originally posted by groingrinder
Some ignorant people have even perpetrated violence against non-Muslim turban wearing Sikhs. Here in Arizona a peaceful Sikh was violently murdered by some ignorant redneck.

Im not american., so forgive me, are rednecks racists or something cause everytime i hear of racism in America its blamed on rednecks

[edit on 2-9-2004 by infinite]

Redneck is a term generally given to a person born and bred in a rural enviroment. It is assumed the neck is red from working outdoors on the farm. Rednecks are also assumed to be uneducated and easily provoked.

Originally posted by groingrinder
Redneck is a term generally given to a person born and bred in a rural enviroment. It is assumed the neck is red from working outdoors on the farm. Rednecks are also assumed to be uneducated and easily provoked.

And, usualy, not Muslims

Originally posted by groingrinder
Redneck is a term generally given to a person born and bred in a rural enviroment. It is assumed the neck is red from working outdoors on the farm. Rednecks are also assumed to be uneducated and easily provoked.

Oh right, i see. Thank you for clearing that one up

I am sure there is a continual net gain of Muslims coming into America over those leaving.

America should not allow any more Muslims in - if it wants to avoid another 9/11 scenario it should restrict the rights of those who wish to perpetrate it.

It is worth discriminating agiainst a few Muslims if it means saving thousands of American lives.

Hi' y'all, I live in A small town in Texas www.rra.dst.tx.us...
A good link for the history of this town,, I have lived here all my life, I am 3rd generation shermanite,, anyway let me get to my point.. about 10 years ago this small town was invaded by muslims.. yep thats right we even have a muslim church.. It's strange how all of sudden just like over night they owned all the hotels,convenience stores, liquor stores, and alot of the fast food chains..

Now I have herd that they get these government grants to buy all this stuff,' not even sure if they have to pay it back,, Now ive never had any problems with these folks there mostly nice,, theres just one thing I can't forget.. there is this one church's chicken were about 6 of these muslims work,, well on the day of 9/11 right when the news came on about the planes crashing.. Well these guy all went outside brought down the American flag from the flag pole.. and where jumping up and down on it just haveing a good ol time someone had to call the sheriff office to come out and make em stop...

After that I kinda like the idea of a internment camp for all these fools,, We should have rounded them all up and weeded out the bad ones. Seems like it sure helped after pearl harbor,, anyway just my thoughts,, excuse my grammer Have a nice day...

Originally posted by fanoose

Originally posted by Chuck Stevenson
But I am wondering ... when was Islam dominant?

Originally stated by "Harakat Shuhadaa al-Ummah" ... because we will return to the age of Islamic dominance ..

Really! When? When did they rule the earth?

Get a good education son . . .

IN SHORT:
Islamic Empire (500-1700)
The Islamic Empire controlled egypt from the 7th century AD, defeating the Byzantin Forces which ruled the country. During its height the islamic empire reached from Spain, across northern africa, egypt, arabia, iran and central asia. During the later islamic period, egypt was part of the empire.

The Muslim World c.A.D. 1500 (Photo)



IN DETAIL:
Islam: History
The Prophet Mohammed was born in the northern Arabian trading city of Mecca between 570 and 580 AD. When he was forty years old, he heard the angel Gabriel speaking to him and telling him to start a new religion: Islam. After a slow start, Mohammed made a lot of converts to his new religion, and they began attacking other Arabian tribes to convert them to Islam. After they had done that, they attacked first the Romans and then the Sassanids to convert them. By 640 (after the death of Mohammed) the Arabs controlled most of Western Asia, and soon after that, under the rule of the Umayyad caliphs, they conquered Egypt. By 711, the Arabs controlled all of Western Asia except Turkey (which was still part of the Roman Empire), and all of the southern Mediterranean: Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Algeria, and Morocco, and also most of Spain.

By 800 AD, however, under the rule of the Abbasid caliphs, the Islamic Empire had already begun to break down into many smaller kingdoms or caliphates. The main part of it was ruled from Baghdad in modern Iraq. In the 900's control of Baghdad was taken over by the newly arrived Turks or Seljuks, and the Fatimid dynasty took over Egypt and Israel and Syria. In the east, the Ghaznavids took over Afghanistan and then northern India about 1000 AD.

In 1096 AD, the Crusaders arrived from Europe and conquered a good deal of Israel and Lebanon from the Fatimids. But by 1200 most of the Crusaders' land had been reclaimed by the Mamluks and the Ayyubids (under Saladin).

In 1260, the Mongols invaded West Asia, and conquered the eastern part of the Islamic Empire, as well as northern India and Afghanistan. During this time also, Europeans gradually pushed the Arabs out of Spain (the Reconquista), finishing up in 1492 AD.

By 1453 AD the Ottomans (successors to the Seljuks) had begun to establish the Ottoman Empire by conquering Constantinople (modern Istanbul). In 1517, they conquered Syria and Egypt, and by 1639 AD the Ottomans had taken Iraq. The Ottoman Empire lasted until the end of World War I in 1918 AD, and takes us out of the period covered on this site.

1) Fixed it for ya! All the important stuff is highlighted.

2) Wow they sure sound like peace loving open minded people to me! Looks more like a "convert or die" scenario to me, so why is Islam so into killing everyone that is not exactly cookie cutter like them?

3) Islamic Dominance - not such a great big empire BTW - Okay, you can have parts of the mideast, but you cannot have Europe, Asia, the Americas or any other part of the world.

4) So the "dominance" was so stable that within a period of 150 years the 'empire' had already begun to break down? Maybe you guys had better stop sniffing each others butts in your mosques and start rethinking your beliefs?

Peter approached G-D one day and asked why he was so despondent. G_D lookad at him and said:
"Every Friday night and Saturday morning the Jews go to the temple and they pray to me and honor me, then they feast and dance for me and all is good." and Peter said "But that's no reason to feel badly! You should feel great about that!" and G_D said "Every Sunday Morning the Christians get dressed up and make themselves humble in my house, singing praises and passing offerings and all is good." and Peter said, Lord! That's just a beautiful thing! Why are yu so sad?" and G_D looked at him and said. Five times a day Muslims go into my house and bend down onto the ground, praying and cutting farts in my direction, FIVE TIMES A DAY!"

[edit on 2-9-2004 by Chuck Stevenson]

Originally posted by ArMaP
The Surat they use in this text is about fighting the polytheists and idolaters, not Christians,

Interesingly, I have heard the saudi clerics refer to christians as polytheists and idolators, becfause of teh trinity concept and the use of statues, crosses, and icons.

who share the same god. Maybe they don't know of any Surat against Christians and only used this one because it was similar to what they wanted.

Indeed. Fundies of either brand tend to warp their own 'holy books' to justify their idiocy

I don't believe the Muslims start going to Muslim countries because of this, they are not stupid. In France they made demonstrations against the use of violence by the people who call themselves Muslims and then kidnap innocent people. One leader of the French Muslims even said she was ready to change place with the kidnapped journalists if the kidnapers wanted.

And yet everyone pretends that normal muslims don't speak out against this (and thusimply that all muslims agree with it).

infinte:
Every since Sept 11th, normal muslims have been blamed and have become victim

Not only that, but the morons have attacked shihks. They wear turbans, so they must be muslim right? Idiots.

build319:
Why do you think they call the Christians "The Crusaders"

Excellent point. Its not just because of the current occupation, its a memory and refernce to the actual crusades.

moley
it's just that the fact remains they are all Muslims

So then all christians were to blame for the crusades, mentioned above? Are all christians to be blamed for the serbs trying to exterminate the muslims in the balkans? And since when haven't muslims spoken out against 911, the beheadings, and terrorism? Some don't, others do, and people shouldn't be expected to perform loyalty tasks everytime something happens.

Just a thought... how about every Muslim in the US or Britain has to swear an oath of allegiance so we can throw out the ones that flat refuse?

Because that would be bigoted and racist. Its not a requirement of non muslims. I would agree that it could be done (at lleast in britain) for everyone, but to single out muslims is sick.

the real extremists will maybe choke and so we can get rid

Don't kid yourself. They'll the oath, then continue on as normal. Legitmate people won't take the oath, at least some of them, because its fundamentally wrong, and they will be the ones kicked out. It would certainly be an injustice, and it won't help at all. Not at all.

like I said how else do we tell the difference

Simply put, you can't. The governement and security agencies are the only ones who can review and investigate these matters properly. If the people start taking things into their own hands, well, then how can you even pretend that muslims would speak out against anti-westernism? The west would've become a spiteful, worthless, racist nothing.

thinker
Them trying to start a war in america or eurpope will get them all deported at once.

Uhm, no. This, quite obviously, won't happen.

They have no military that can go againits the europeans.

And bin ladin doesn't have an airforce, but he was able to destroy buildings with planes.

Israel defeated The islamic army in 1967 in 7 days.

Israel defeated an alliance of arab states, not 'the' islamic army. Besides, no one expects al-qaida to attack with convential armies.

Goes to show how strong they are. 777 of israelie soilders died in those 7 days? What does this mean? 777 means GOD.

According to who? On both claims.

gazrok:
I'd just say this, "Look guys, the next time a 911 style attack goes down, the Kabaa in Mecca is going to be turned into rubble and then we're going to drop a cargo load of crap on top of it... If you even think about retaliating, we'll simply target other religious sites, etc."

So you think that bombing that vatican would be a good way to influence catholic opinion? Honestly, I had thought about this before. Infact, the kabba is probably an iron meteorite, so it could be mined and processed too, which leads to some interesting (and properly ludicrous) ideas. However, how can you destroy somethign so sacred to so many americans? If it were just the taliban or somethign like that, i'd say, sure, do to their stuff what they did to the Buddha statues in afghanistan. But we can't destroy it, not for their sake, but for the people who live here who are muslim

Thinker:
Their is no good muslims.

Do you actually think that any rational person is going to beleive a stupid, assine, pig headed, ignorant, and wrong statement such as that? There ceratinly are 'good' muslims. You are a bad non-muslim.

nukunuku:
I mean if somebody asked you to leave their house and told you you are not wanted there, wouldnt you just leave and never come back?

So if you are visiting someones house, and one of their bratty little bstard children tells you to shove off, you would run away?

mpeake:
The Catholic Church made it their mission to seperate themselves from the evil acts and you saw priests taken out of power left and right

No we haven't. The church, after much debate, decided that child molestation by preists was wrong and that covering it up was wrong too. They didn't get rid of preists left and right at all. They did agree to suspend people who were involved, until the cases against them were resolved. It wasn't very harsh or even a hard-line. Contrast that with what they did to one preist who got married. They told him to divorce his wife, or face excommunication. None of these people have been treated as such. They also threatened some women who had been ordained (somehow) as preists with excommunication. But the people who molested children and the authorities who covered it up, they didn't get treated like that. Which bishop has been defrocked because of all this? None that I am aware of.

So why does the civilised muslim culture stand seeing their own people smear their names?

To put it simply, the islamic countries are, literally, in their own dark ages. When europeans were wallowing in illiteracy, ignorance, and parochialism, under the authority of a church-state, the arabs and muslims were enlighted, advanced, cosmopolitan cultures. Now the situation has reversed. Now its the muslims who are held under the thumb of theocratic church-states, where only their holy books are read, where the rest of the world is feared. Why is this? Well, if you look at the history of the region, you can see why. The 'west' is in part to blame, having interfered with the poltics of hte region for a while, althought ultimately everyone is responsible for themselves of course.

but you say one negative thing about the muslim faith and you are labeld a bigot, racist, KKK member

Most of those accusations have followed, at least from me, when the speaker says that all muslims, inherently, are evil little creatures, which is obviously untrue. Islam can be perverted, and the perversion is whats holding sway with most muslims right now. Establishing modern, democratic liberal states in the mid east will correct this problem.

crossfire:
No Muslims are innocent - they are ALL a danger to us, our freedom and civilised way of life.

Listen, pig, the good peole here will not stand for this crap. You think all muslims are evil eh? Why don't you go and tell them that then huh? I guess your just a little coward. Why don't you join the military and go to iraq and fight these 'evil people' huh? Or why don't you try doing that here" Guess what, when your disgusting kind tries to rise up agianst the people here, your kind will be stopped, arrested, and destroyed. It was done in WWII, and it'll be done again, domestically, internationally, anywhere. If you don't like the western way of life, and if you need to be a stupid, brutish, barbaric, ignorant jackass, then leave. You are, explicitly, not wanted. Coward.

weirdo:
he would not be allowed to inform any Western authorities any details against a fellow Muslim.

Yes, and jews aren't supposed to make high interest loans to other jews, and christians aren't supposed to call other christians fools. But they do. These holy books are from thousands of years ago, of course they seem barbaric, its because they are. Everything is dependant upon the person's interpretation of these texts. Obviously not all muslim men have multiple wives, even tho its allowed. Obviously not all muslim men commit honor killings. There are allways people who will interpret thei religious texts to allow them to do terrible things. Islam isn't immune to this, and neither is Christianity or Judaism.

If the Muslim law is so backward why should we not outlaw it in our own country

It is outlawed, in case you didn't realize it and most muslims obviously aren't following their 'religious laws'. Vigilante justice is illegal in most western countries, whether its judeao-christian laws demanding stonings, or muslim laws demanding corporal punishment.

lazarusthelong:
SOME MUSLIMS ARE LEAVING

Lemme tell a little story, to end this ludicrously long post.

A friend of mine told me this. He was talking to his mother one day and she told him that these people that live on their street (or in teh town, i forget), they were middle easterners. Shortly after 911, they packed up their house and moved out, never to be heard from again. Very mysterious. People were talking. Where'd they go, back to the mid east? Did they know? Were they part of it? Afterall, they had left so suddenly and without saying good bye? What was going on.

My freind tells his mom, 'thats [joe's] house and family. They moved months ago. I went to school with him. They moved to [florida, or somethign like that]. It wasn't a secret, i wasn't a surpise, it wasn't mysterious, and they weren't terrorists.'.

People in this and other countries are scared, and the bogeymen are starting to come out of the closet. Rational thinking is what is needed, unfortunately its not being applied.

You can write reams of that *rap, justifying your love of Islam and your defence of the terrorists.

The irony is that the very people you seek to defend are the people that will eventually behead you, rape your wife and then put her in slavery.

You are in part the author of your own downfall - Muslims will eventually kill you - but from the sounds of it - you will be happy with that.

Why is America (and its citizans) always the first to be critcized? THIS is the place to go if you want to practice your religion freely! THIS is the place to go if you want to start a business with help from the gov't! THIS is the place to come if you want a good education for your children! The number of people that leave their countries to come here in hopes of a better future are MUCH MUCH larger than the opposite. So why are we the ones to be criticized all the time? If you don't think this is true I dare you to go to one of these other countries with your family and your religion and see what happens. I bet you don't even find a house to live in before you are either forced out or killed.

I'm not saying anything hurtful about anyone else here (I got nuthin but love ), I'm just saying quit haten' on the greatest country in world. No, we aren't perfect, but we have it better than anyone else, and we offer more than anyone else as well. PEACE!!!

Nygdan

you really did your home work today, great post.

Originally posted by Nygdan

build319:
Why do you think they call the Christians "The Crusaders"

Excellent point. Its not just because of the current occupation, its a memory and refernce to the actual crusades.

Meant to inflame and generate hatred among the "peaceful" Muslims.

To put it simply, the islamic countries are, literally, in their own dark ages. When europeans were wallowing in illiteracy, ignorance, and parochialism, under the authority of a church-state, the arabs and muslims were enlighted, advanced, cosmopolitan cultures.

Ahem - In my study of history, it appears that the only "enlighted, advanced, cosmopolitan" culture was in Spain, where the Muslims did not have complete control.

Originally posted by NygdanThese holy books are from thousands of years ago, of course they seem barbaric, its because they are.

The Khoran was written about 1500 years ago, and thanks for admitting that it's barbaric.

I live in a small town where we have a naval weapon center. We have probably 10-15 mini-marts here. EVERY single one is operated by middle easterners. I have to admit, at first, after 9/11, I didn't want to go into those stores anymore even tho they had always been very friendly. I couldn't help but wonder "what if", "what do they really want and why are they here", considering what the Quran says about the muslim religion verses christianity-which America is largely contrived. It doesn't make sense to me why they're here. Since then, I can't help but go into the stores, I pretty much have to. I actually felt bad when one guy asked me why he hadn't seen me as much anymore. I felt terrible, but at the same time still couldn't help wondering "what if". What if this guy really hates me and is just acting friendly. This whole situation sucks. Most people I know agree. I can't hate them without knowing their true feelings, and at the same time have no doubt some of them are here for unhealthy reasons. So how do you fight terrorism, does anyone know? Wouldn't it be nice, I'd admire the heck out of them, if they faught and exposed their own kind, the extremists, and we left their country alone from that point on. How the heck can we get to that point?

[edit on 2-9-2004 by livenlearn]

The problem with terrorism is that anyone can be a terrorist. Do not forget that the fact that everybody talks about Muslim terrorists does not make the other terrorists disappear. The responsible for the Oklahoma bombing must have been someone's neighbour and friend.

And do not forget that when people talk about Muslims they mean Muslims of all races, there are many Muslims that are not from the Middle East, like Muhammad Ali.

I am disturbed to read some of the things posted here. I don't believe the people saying "all muslims are bad" have done enough homework to be able to say that.

Even under the most normal and basic circumstances generalizations are simply wrong. Let alone circumstances like this.

For starters most of the quickie mart people you're talking about are not middle eastern muslims at all. Some are, but a hell of a lot of them are Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi (if that's the right term) and others. You're right, the people attacking Sikhs and blaming them for 9/11 are peabrained jackasses.

It's a stupid thing that you can chalk up to being a human being. A human instinct is to hate someone that hurts you. Unfortunately people are taking that instinct and directing it at the wrong people. It is highly doubtful that the Arabic taxi driver I rode with on Friday is involved in a terrorist plot, yet when he stopped to pick me up a man in a minivan yelled out "Why don't you get out of my way you #ing arab, dont you have something to blow up somewhere?"

Everyone is at fault here. Americans are at fault for getting so caught up emotionally that they lose sight of what's happening. Europeans are at fault for ignoring the problem entirely and getting caught up with worrying about America being too "imperialistic" and taking their thunder away. Muslims as a whole are at fault for not turning the extremists into a pariah community of lepers and withdrawing from them. Normal Muslims outnumber extremists Muslims by plenty. They COULD do more, but many are afraid. The followers of the extremists are at fault for being so easily manipulated into believing the messages of hate.

So what we have is a tremendous number of people screwing up. Where will that take us? Well, I hope somehow we're able to correct some of these problems because otherwise all that's going to happen is in 10,000 years when life can live on Earth again a group of Archaeologists are going to be digging near my house, finding a painting that once hung on my wall and saying "Do you think they were intelligent? They seem to have had a form of art."

Djarums

You are right in pointing Europe's guilt. Do not forget that what are now Muslim countries, if I am correct, all of them where dependent or a colony of a European country, mostly Great Britain. That could be the difference between European Muslims and the Muslims from those countries that where European colonies.

Originally posted by ArMaP
Djarums

You are right in pointing Europe's guilt. Do not forget that what are now Muslim countries, if I am correct, all of them where dependent or a colony of a European country, mostly Great Britain. That could be the difference between European Muslims and the Muslims from those countries that where European colonies.

You are correct, i think Great Britain did rule some of the middle east, but when we and other Europeans countries left, we left the countries in pieces that resulted in extremist groups taking power.

My Muslim friend is leaving to go back to jordan...
I asked him why during lunch. Here is what he said. "It is time to go back".
I asked him to elaborate... he said (i noticed he had the paper open to the article about the US air attack on the jordanian terrorist in Iraq), it is time because I am ready to go home. I said what about america? isn't that home? he said of course, but much of his family is back in jordan, he has always planned to go back there to retire... I then asked him the pointed question of "it isn't due to recent threats to have muslims leave?"
he replied with a very important point:
"Jordan has the largest population of christians and other religions of any of the mid east...he was more worried about going home, than staying. He even said he is keeping one of his houses, just in case he needs to come back.
But for now, Jordan is an example of how christians and muslims live in equality side by side... why don't they have more trouble there than in other countries... i think it is because Jordan does not tolerate religious intolerance. They don't seem to allow all the hate filled Mullahs to fill the streets.

Originally posted by Djarums
I am disturbed to read some of the things posted here. I don't believe the people saying "all muslims are bad" have done enough homework to be able to say that.

Even under the most normal and basic circumstances generalizations are simply wrong. Let alone circumstances like this.

For starters most of the quickie mart people you're talking about are not middle eastern muslims at all. Some are, but a hell of a lot of them are Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi (if that's the right term) and others. You're right, the people attacking Sikhs and blaming them for 9/11 are peabrained jackasses.

Ok, I guess I don't know for sure what nationalities run all the stores, but the instance in which I was mainly referring to, I do. Pakistan
I by no means was implying that he is here for unhealthy reasons. Just simply that I was uneasy because of his nationality and not really knowing what his feelings are. I just meant to say it's a crappy situation to be in.


Apparently I suck at using this "quote" feature. My statement begins with "OK". Just to clarify

[edit on 2-9-2004 by livenlearn]

[edit on 2-9-2004 by livenlearn]

Originally posted by JoeTex
Hi' y'all, I live in A small town in Texas www.rra.dst.tx.us...
A good link for the history of this town,, I have lived here all my life, I am 3rd generation shermanite,, anyway let me get to my point.. about 10 years ago this small town was invaded by muslims.. yep thats right we even have a muslim church.. It's strange how all of sudden just like over night they owned all the hotels,convenience stores, liquor stores, and alot of the fast food chains..

Now I have herd that they get these government grants to buy all this stuff,' not even sure if they have to pay it back,, Now ive never had any problems with these folks there mostly nice,, theres just one thing I can't forget.. there is this one church's chicken were about 6 of these muslims work,, well on the day of 9/11 right when the news came on about the planes crashing.. Well these guy all went outside brought down the American flag from the flag pole.. and where jumping up and down on it just haveing a good ol time someone had to call the sheriff office to come out and make em stop...

After that I kinda like the idea of a internment camp for all these fools,, We should have rounded them all up and weeded out the bad ones. Seems like it sure helped after pearl harbor,, anyway just my thoughts,, excuse my grammer Have a nice day...

Seriously, they should have been on a plane that same day heading back to where they came from.