Let's talk about France and Iraq

Originally posted by wraith30
Actulay one thing noone ever mentions is that jsut prior to WWII really getting started France had a good number of it's military officers in Italy. Almost all of their officers were rounded up by Musalini (sp?) and France was basicly left leaderless. The operation was really quite brilliant. I cannot blame France for not fairing well durring WWII.

Thanks, I did not know that, though I still blame them for not fighting. There is no reason a proffesional military cannot come up with new leaders from the ranks. Even if it was largely uncoordinated, they could have fought back. I mean seriously, put the Germans invading America - you can honestly say that the US soldiers and citizens would have folded so quickly and without so much as a whimper? I think not.

As for the contracts with Iraq for oil.. those are residual contracts left over from the mid 80's when Regan started supporting Iraq allong with France and Germany against the communist influence. France did not trade weapons with them, that was us. France and Germany primarily supplied trucks and helocopters.

I think you are mistaken, as almost every piece of artillery found in Iraq was either french made or a copy of a french design given to them. This included pieces able to fire C/B weapons.

You pointed out that we went into Afganistan, your rige we did.. can you explain to me why we stopped mid-opperation pulling almost all energy away from finding OBL and attacked Iraq asside from Bush wanting to get the man who "Tried to kill my daddy."?

We did not stop "mid operation." The operation (wide scale) was done, we no longer needed whole battalions of soldiers. What we left there is what we needed - SF units and highly trained soldiers such as Rangers. It's not as if we just packed up and left - we simply didn't have the need for all of those men and instead shifted our focus to tracking down the terrorists who are left.

Originally by American Mad Man

Thanks, I did not know that, though I still blame them for not fighting. There is no reason a proffesional military cannot come up with new leaders from the ranks. Even if it was largely uncoordinated, they could have fought back. I mean seriously, put the Germans invading America - you can honestly say that the US soldiers and citizens would have folded so quickly and without so much as a whimper? I think not.

I think that's a little unfair and unecessary. The French had anticipated a German invasion and accordingly built the Maginot Line, however the Germans found a weakness and broke through. You also have to acknowledge the fact that by then the German military were fairly experienced, what with the Blitzkrieg and the Spanish civil war in which the Luftwaffe gained experience.

You can't simply click your fingers and siddenly have officers at the ready, like someone had pointed out most of their officers had been captured. Officers need to have enough experience and training in order to do their job effectively and efficiently.

Often during war confusion can easily set in, and i think it's insensitive to say they went out with a 'whimper'. For one i'm pretty sure French civilians couldn't legally own guns and if they did they'd only be hunting rifles and maybe shotguns.

Secondly even while France was occupied by the Germans they Maquis/French resistance was doing as much as it could to the Germans. Which is why when Italy was invaded by the Allies that the Free French Army helped the Americans.

America is different, America is surrounded by ocean it would've been extremely difficult for the Germans to invade. Not to mention the fact that America is a lot bigger than France presenting it's own problems. I'm also sure that a lot of US civilians would've owned guns and obviously to do some extent could've offered up some resistance.

Why do you think the French fought as soon as they had a chance?

I do however agree with you on France's modern stance on Iraq. I can't believe that they simply objected to the invasion purely on the basis of humanitarian issues. Everyone always points the finger at US & UK selling weapons to everyone, but the French and Russians are just guilty from that too. Whenever US & UK have gone against a country most of the time the opposition are either using Russian or French weapons. Examples of French weapons would be the Mirage fighters, Gazzelle attack helicopter and the dreaded Exocet anti-ship missile.

I'm fairly sure they've sold them other weapons. I'm also certain that France had a vested interest in the oil reserves within Iraq and if America invaded Iraq then this would distrupt any current deals that France would have with Iraq.

However American Mad Man i would in future be careful of what i say before making statements like that. They were a little ignorant, insensitive and completely unecessary. Everyobody suffered during WWII, just have to accept that and move on.

Originally posted by taibunsuu
I can tell you with 100% authenticity that a plane did hit the Pentagon.

Beyond that there is a lot of freaky crap.

I never understood this arguement. So it was a missile or a remote controled plane or whatever that hit the Pentagon. Which would mean it must have been done by the goverment. If thats true then why did they go through all the trouble of having two planes crash into the Twin Towers which we all saw. But then we it came to the pentagon the decided what the heck lets just use a missile instead how dumb is that. If they had the power to carsh two planes into New York then why not one more?

Also what happened to all the people of flight 77 did their famlies just make them up? Did they just vanish off the face of the earth? Are they stuck in a goverment base deep underground?

I have never heard any good answers for this.

[edit on 3-9-2004 by ShadowXIX]

I hate hearing the ridiculous stories about the 9/11 conspiracy, there's no conspiracy, there was no missile it was a plane and i'd imagine this is extremely offensive to the families who lost their loved ones at the Pentagon.

The problem is many people are angry and disillusioned with the current administration, and becuase of that they will invent stupid and ridiculous stories just so it makes the government look 'bad' and paint them as the real enemy.

This kind of crap is not helping and only makes it easier for the true terrorists.

I'm sure there's A LOT more evidence to show that it was a plane and not a missile, UAV or whatever else that hit the Pentagon.

Please have some decency for the people who actually died and suffered.

How much did France make off the UN's Oil for Food Scandal? France had no interest in supporting the US, and alot of interest in supporting Saddam. Germany and Russia also had alot to lose if the US removed Saddam.

Originally posted by American Mad Man
Thanks, I did not know that, though I still blame them for not fighting. There is no reason a proffesional military cannot come up with new leaders from the ranks. Even if it was largely uncoordinated, they could have fought back. I mean seriously, put the Germans invading America - you can honestly say that the US soldiers and citizens would have folded so quickly and without so much as a whimper? I think not.

- I don't think the French WW2 defeat is worth kicking over yet again. Suffice to say they were ready - more than ready - to fight WW1 (and who can blame them considering what WW1 had been.....any country that loses it's young men by the multi-million is going to be deeply scarred) and then to top it all Germans came up with with the shockingly new, fast and very mobile WW2.

.....and BTW everybody was shocked and surprised at this, the French didn't rush to surrender but they were soundly beaten and had no choice but to sue for an armistice.

Faced with utter military defeat and almost complete occupation by a totally amoral and ruthless opponent who knows how people would actually react.....my guess is only those who have actually been through it and the rest is hot air and wishful thinking.

Hopefully you never get to find out, hmm?

Instead of the frat level insults a little thoughtful consideration and respect might be a better course to follow.....if only so you and your country don't repeat the mistakes, eh?

I think you are mistaken, as almost every piece of artillery found in Iraq was either french made or a copy of a french design given to them. This included pieces able to fire C/B weapons.

- It is a mattter of record that the Reagan administration knowingly and specifically supplied Iraq with the Billions $ in credits to buy Russian and European weaponary - it was how they provided direct military support when there was an export ban on US weapons.

The drug money funded Iran and they got US stuff (it wasn't so easy for Iran, they needed spares for all those jets etc etc that the Shah had bought).

Check out the Iran-Contra affair.

We did not stop "mid operation." The operation (wide scale) was done, we no longer needed whole battalions of soldiers. What we left there is what we needed - SF units and highly trained soldiers such as Rangers. It's not as if we just packed up and left - we simply didn't have the need for all of those men and instead shifted our focus to tracking down the terrorists who are left.

- Well there are US soldiers who have said that the operation was begun late and compounding that error halted early.

Originally posted by Carseller4
How much did France make off the UN's Oil for Food Scandal?

- er, surely the idea would be that before alledging any scandal you actually have a few facts about any such scandal in the first place?

I take it you do know the US has a vote at the UN (including the veto) and voted each and every time on the 'Oil for Food/Medicine' program?

France had no interest in supporting the US, and alot of interest in supporting Saddam. Germany and Russia also had alot to lose if the US removed Saddam.

- er yeah. Iraq owed France, Germany and Russia a lot of money. Iraq is not....ok, was not.....a poor country, so, why shouldn't they look for their money back? Their trade was legal and above board and done through the UN....which the USA has full representation at etc etc.

.....and why should France, Germany and Russia persue the USA's interests when they are opposed their own anyway?

One only need check out the way the USA is relentlessly persuing it's own interests in Iraq and shouting a large "F.U." at the rest of the world - even to allies like the UK who continually help them. I don't think the US can say much about others behaving in a less than altruistic and selfish manner at all.

Originally posted by American Mad Man

As for the contracts with Iraq for oil.. those are residual contracts left over from the mid 80's when Regan started supporting Iraq allong with France and Germany against the communist influence. France did not trade weapons with them, that was us. France and Germany primarily supplied trucks and helocopters.

I think you are mistaken, as almost every piece of artillery found in Iraq was either french made or a copy of a french design given to them. This included pieces able to fire C/B weapons.

France also delivered aircrafts for Iraq (Mirage) before the 1st war
Those were worthless of course but it means something
trucks are also something because you can install something on them

I have to say that this post was first a mistake, I wanted to answer in an other discussion, but I clicked on the bad bottom and created a discussion (instead of replying), so my first post looks like nothing.

Also, I said �Funny game : But can u answer, sorry, I'm not english speaker, may I write in french, so nobody would understand (!!), by being in the topic and not in the way Iraq, or Irak is written all over the world as it is a translation from Arabic names (childy and ridiculous! Good example of American people, nothing else to say?) � to 2 persons that were trying to be �funny� with �where is Irak?�, This question was asked to them. I didn�t want to curse America at all, but tell them to stop that game that gives an impression to the world reading us. Thank you AceofBase for the answer you gave them.

Ok, I answer now:

Saddam arrived in Irak(q/c) in 79 and asked very nicely �Bush� oil lobby to get away. Then he asked USSR, France and others to extract the oil and finance the extraction. In 1990, the American oil men (I won�t take my dictionary), it means Bush lobby could extract oil in Irak once again. Every oil vampire (US very first, but also France, UK, Germany, Russia) made a lot of money with �oil for food� getting Iraq very poorer (Iraqis owned 1 /4 to 1/10 than under Saddam). Oil is a nationality. We can�t say oil financers have a country; they have money and pay taxes to countries. If oil was good to the American economy, I can tell you that America would be richer today, but only the richer are richer with oil and they pay taxes to their weapon industry, and pay themselves, etc� It is the very same in France and oil men are sometimes (always) politics, but politic is only good for their oil (and weapons).
So, for me (and France) this war is first a war for oil men, not for America, this is why we don�t understand Amirican people and think they are not told the truth, because in France, we know that oil men are not friends of countries and sell weapons to any one with clever. What had change in Irak in 1990, is that American oil men could come back and the financers (from any countries) are now speculating on the price, making it much higher wining money. But, the matter is that Bush lobby (Cheney) came back in Iraq with false theories of terrorism in Iraq that was in fact from Saudi, as every body told Bush and as he will discovered to late (?), but that terrorism came in Iraq with him (?). Bush lobby is oil, but also a lot of weapons and much more also. It produces for the American army and many others. Back in Iraq, Bush put everybody away and started the second war in a wonderful violence and non sens for many people. I must speak about Ossama. He told his family that he didn�t admit it to steal the oil of the Wahhabit kingdom (Saoudi) and trade only with Bush lobby that was emptying the oil and �colonializing� Saudi with imposing a way of life to his country. It really seems that Ossama was saying �I want my country back and strangers to get away� and not �I want to destroy America and the world with no reason�. He did the 9/11 with no claiming. What did he want? To be destroyed?!! It is a long time that Bush lobby is �controlling� the oil of Saudi. Now, we can say that Bush oil and weapond lobby is controlling with Saudi and Iraq half the sold oil (some say up to 70%) in the world and sold a war to America and he, and Cheney are making money with big industries like Karelyle. I hope everyone is knowing that Iraq has never been so down.
I said that knowing who are the religious people was the difference between a la�que country (like France) that accept every religion when they are normal and peaceful because they observe the 10 commandments (or are peaceful), and a religious country that accept every religion without knowing if they are normal, sect, terrorist or not. This was the matter with Ossama. I can tell you that France and other countries told America that a bad religion was created in Saudi, and that religion is nothing doing with Ossama. There was the matter of Ossama who promised to stop the trade of his family and the one of Bush, but there was also the matter of a false religion and France denounced it very soon with the laws of la�city and French Muslims that say that religion is integrist and dangerous for freedom of there women. What is La�city : a catholic world used by the Republic, that say every religion, politic or way of thinking have to be protected in a democracy, but that democracy can censor a dangerous religion or politic that can�t go with freedom or respect. So, in France, nazi web sites are forbidden, politic and religion at school when it is nothing to learn but imposing (we learn the basic history of the 3 monotheists but also antic Greece, Roma and sometimes Buddhism, Hinduism�) are also forbidden, like politic propaganda� for children in public school only. The matter with the veil of the faces of little girls is that it is nothing Islamic and is only an adaptation in some areas of �no WATCHING women not to be tempted, but getting the EYES away of that temptation�. It is 100 years that every veil of face (Christian, Jewish and Muslim) are forbidden at school and at school only, because nobody was thinking it is religious and good for children. This fashion came from Saudi. France told the world with making an adaptation of the law to control this because the integrists coming from Saudi and other virused countries were talking about something Islamic but where only �sectes�. Their message was very strong and hateful with slaving women, we fighted a lot with it in Algeria since 10 years, helping Algeria with their matter of terrorism. But no! Bush didn�t move a finger to stop it in Saudi and protect it with telling the world that everything is ok� up to 9/11. A lot of country came in Yugoslavia with the call of Germany, France and UN to stop this and stop genocides. We did it once again in Afghanistan with the call of the UN. But it is only now that the world is discovering that this terrorism and those false Muslims were financed by Saudi at 80% and virused the Arabic world till a long time.

WWII : Who financed Hitler? Who had a process in 1942 that the press couldn�t tell in order there was no civil war in the USA? Why were the nazis so strong, burning Europe with no army resisting to them? No one knew the power of there army, it was impossible. Prescott (and many other friends of him) financed the camps of forced work for the nazi army till 1932. Prescot Bush offered the nazi castle to Hitler in 1928. The nazi were producing a big army with the money of Prescott Sheldon Bush and George Herbert Walker and the slave of Poland first and Jews next. They took everything they had. In France and Europe many people were hiding them at home, being killed with there family and neighbour when discovered, and the Jews deported in the camps.
Don�t think America have free Europe alone with there only army. This is not really true. Most of the towns in France were free by themselves (like Paris) and theere was an order from Roosevelt to forbid any action against the Nazis by the French people and army in the country. We didn�t wait the bombs that would have destroyed much more things, like in Normandy where nothing stood on, but every town took their weapons, disobeying to Roosevelt and we free our towns when we heard �les carottes sont cuites� that meant the Coalition was in Normandy, we were now stronger. America, England, France, Scotland came by the north of France and the French African troops, by the south (Provence) a few days later. But when those army arrived, the whole France get their town free in a few days with the FFI and the police, the GI�s arrived many times in self free town and could run to Germany with the armies coming out from the maquis (French, Italian, Belgium...)
The gifts of the war lobby were the Marshall plan, but also the new money (euro-dollars) that was imposed by the American administration but destroyed by de Gaulle, the desire of Roosevelt of a �new French government� with ex nazis that de Gaulle and Churchill didn�t admit and the fact that we didn�t understand the order of no action and the bombs we would have receive if we didn�t disobey to free our town and protect Paris of its destruction, because no army was allowed to get in, even the French and it is only when it was free that an American general allowed a French army to get in.
Nobody understood what Reagan did 1985 when he came in Auschwitz for ceremonies about the Holocaust, forgetting a lot of ceremonies and acts, but came on the tombs of 48 SS�

Do you understand why we French don�t believe in the Bush and Walker families as we know what they made to us with the Nazis and the Marshall plan that was coming after there Chao? And they had still some financial interest in the debarquement and in the Marshall plan. It is not America that France hate, no, of course not, we love America and many things in America (juste like the food, but this is a joke!). No!!! It�s all about the financers and what we think about America is that it is used by them and that the world is now going to be used, in wars� they create. We thing, I must confess, that the American people is becoming fanatic, dangerously fanatic, with the same people that 60 years ago. Danger!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You can also see what I wrote in the 9/11 index reference tread. I have to correct something about my texts: Skull and Bones is free-masonry, the amerigo-masonry (daughter of the Franc Ma�onnerie, but very different in its aspiration and ethic) and they are linked by the richest men of the world, like David Rockefeller and the New Order of the World he promised in 1999 saying a big crisis will come and will be good for the world, after the Chao, just like in 1929!!!!!

See you soon if not dead!! (Joke!!!?)

Alchy - Bonjour, confr�re, �a va? Je ne suis pas Fran�ais mais je suis Canadien-fran�ais

France-bashing has become quite a fashion, and Time magazine this week, in an interview with George W. Bush, gave us an inkling why... Bush, according to Time, doesn't pay attention as much to the arguments against his policies as to the motives of the people - or nations - making those arguments. Obviously, France's arguments against the war have long been forgotten, while instead the French were vilified for an economic link to Iraqi oil... conveniently occulting the fact that the U.S. has been looking to appropriate those oil reserves for a good while.

But if you really want to analyze France's position on the war in Iraq from a serious, political science standpoint, please consult this:

www.iiss.org...

Now as far as what happened to the French in 1940 is concerned... because I'm really sick and tired of hearing people call the French "surrender monkeys"...

To the world's surprise, Germany's new Panzer armies sliced through the crumbling French defenses at Sedan as they fought to and across the Meuse river in only 3 days. The French plan of "Methodical Battle," an outdated concept based on WW I, called for the French defenses to be ready in 4 days; one day too late.

In short, Guderian, Hoth, and Rommel, among other German leaders, presented the French Army with exactly the one thing their planning and training was ill-suited to deal; a fast-paced, chaotic battlefield.

This is not to say French troops didn't fight well. On several occasions, they fought well at the tactical level against German infantry and tanks. In fact, most French and British tanks were superior to those fielded by the Germans. The Allies also fielded about 1,000 more tanks than the Germans. The Allied error was that they fielded them in small, tightly controlled battalions, with the mission of supporting the infantry. This tied them to the 3 mph speed that infantry has been fighting at since the times of Alexander.

(the rest is at home.sandiego.edu...)

"An estimated 390,000 soldiers were killed defending France whereas around 35,000 German soldiers lost their lives during the invasion." www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk...

I would have liked to see the performance of the US Army against the Germans in 1940.

Without French surrender monkeys the United States would never have won war against Britain. Or it would have taken a long, long time. Kind of hard to fight colonists when your convoys are intercepted and future officers of Napoleon are giving peasants instruction on how to run professional military.

Asswipes talking about surrender monkeys must never have heard of fusilade, maneuver, defilade, parapet, etc.

I'd like to see one of the geeks walking around talking about surrender monkey say that to the face of Legionaire. You'd see attitude rearrangement right quick.

Also, American Mad Man, Iraq fielded M60 tanks against the US in Gulf War 1. Guess where they got 'em.

Originally posted by taibunsuu

I'd like to see one of the geeks walking around talking about surrender monkey say that to the face of Legionaire. You'd see attitude rearrangement right quick.

Not that I called anyone a surrender monkey but a Legionarire is not even French if I am correct. They are the French Foreign Legion and are made up of all foreigners.

Originally posted by ShadowXIX

Originally posted by taibunsuu

I'd like to see one of the geeks walking around talking about surrender monkey say that to the face of Legionaire. You'd see attitude rearrangement right quick.

Not that I called anyone a surrender monkey but a Legionarire is not even French if I am correct. They are the French Foreign Legion and are made up of all foreigners.

I think you're right. Something about no French outside of France for fighting. I think officers are French. In know training camps are in France and you must learn French. I always daydreamed about joining. Don't know any other tough French units.

One thing about invasion, the most modern French and British tanks were quite good but in small numbers. Germans concentrated on tanks acting independent from infantry. French tactic was outdated and to have tanks support infantry. Germans could move so fast without waiting for infantry. Such an advantage. There was one battle where Totenkampf division panicked and broke. They run into bunch of French with most modern French tanks and the PkIII couldn't do anything but get blown up.

Also as Alchy said, the idea that our president is grandson of guy who financed Nazis, all the way to 1942, should make you stop and think.

Originally posted by taibunsuu

Originally posted by ShadowXIX

Originally posted by taibunsuu

I'd like to see one of the geeks walking around talking about surrender monkey say that to the face of Legionaire. You'd see attitude rearrangement right quick.

Not that I called anyone a surrender monkey but a Legionarire is not even French if I am correct. They are the French Foreign Legion and are made up of all foreigners.

I think you're right. Something about no French outside of France for fighting. I think officers are French. In know training camps are in France and you must learn French. I always daydreamed about joining. Don't know any other tough French units.

If you really thinked of joining My hats off to you. The French Foriegn Legion is only of the only military forces that basically guarantees you will see combat if you join up. A fact most other militaries cannot boast. People that sign up are not in it for college money they are signing up to go into combat and that takes balls.

I have also heard it is on of the few forces that lets you leave your past at the door when you sign up. If you made mistakes they do not care they give you a fresh start. I have even heard you get a new name when you sign up.

I think the foerign legion is a bit like a private military contracter group in a way. But I've heard some nasty stories about them since a lot of criminals join up thanks to the whole fresh start idea. Oh yeah and Alchy sorry for bashing your spelling.

[edit on 9/5/2004 by cyberdude78]

Yeah, French Legion kicks all. I'm pretty sick of hearing the "French lose all their wars" which isn't true. Sure they have lost of a few and surrendered, but that was always due to a bumbling command. If you ever study WW1 in-depth you'll realise how resilient and brave the French military is.

Is made of murderers, of long time jailed people, and half of "normal" soldiers that love to be in danger and have nothing else to do but win or die. This is there life and they always have the joice to join in or not, but when they join, it is for 5 years, or 10 or 15. Half persons are foreigners that made trouble in friends countries of France (some Arab coutries, African, but also European...) They train in french Guyanne (South America) generaly. The foreign legion (L�gion �trang�re) is said to be the most dangerous of the world and in Koweit, some GI's said that legion was 3 times better than a simple army like them, as they have nothing to loose.
After 5 years of legion, every crimes are forgotten and the soldier can become french and have a normal life. I realy don't know what to think about this legion and its method of making new "correct" people, but it seems to work very well and make a very good army that many GIs (and many others) say they wouldn't like to get for ennemy, but of course, it is a little army of 500 men max.
The l�gion �trang�re is many times the way to go back to life when a man have distroy his life, juste like any army, but this one is for violent and dangerous people.

In WWII the matter is that when Germany attacked, we stupid french were fighting with the Geneve laws of war, but nazis were realy not and we, of course, and with such an army they created with prescott bush, had the big surprise to discover that nazis were not human and became less and less killing any resistant and his familly, when it was not a whole village, for one resistant. Nazis were realy strong and crazy, we couldn't know this. But what is more crazy is that some important French (like P�tin) accepted the new order of the world and the peace of the Nazis and started to fight with them against the resistance and get the jews in the camps of prescott Bush.
The european resistant had wait 1942 to know in witch camp was America. Before, America was saying that they wanted to make a peace with hitler and that this New Order of the World was not so bad!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
1942 big matter, the world was about to know who fonanced hitler and what was happening in the camps of the nazis with the Jews that were producing the nazi army like no slave in that world and America said they will help Europ. Not to late! A civil war in America was stoped in front of such a financement hidden to the public. The white house has always known that american big financers (bankers) financed hitler and its Chao, as they were also in the white house. Germany would never have found the money or the technologie, it was foreign money and tech, from America in its major part. It was a putch of the bigest financers, using America and Germany over the world.
Strange is that in 1942, we discovered that the nazi army was produced in camps in East countries by slaves, Germany was bomb with its annexions, but no one search to bomb the camps or more inteligent, the trains of the weapons between those known camps. USSR will discover them in 1945... But America knew about, because of the process of prescott and friends for the financement of camps of work for nazi weapons production!!!

Originally posted by ShadowXIX

Originally posted by taibunsuu

Originally posted by ShadowXIX

Originally posted by taibunsuu

I'd like to see one of the geeks walking around talking about surrender monkey say that to the face of Legionaire. You'd see attitude rearrangement right quick.

Not that I called anyone a surrender monkey but a Legionarire is not even French if I am correct. They are the French Foreign Legion and are made up of all foreigners.

I think you're right. Something about no French outside of France for fighting. I think officers are French. In know training camps are in France and you must learn French. I always daydreamed about joining. Don't know any other tough French units.

If you really thinked of joining My hats off to you. The French Foriegn Legion is only of the only military forces that basically guarantees you will see combat if you join up. A fact most other militaries cannot boast. People that sign up are not in it for college money they are signing up to go into combat and that takes balls.

I have also heard it is on of the few forces that lets you leave your past at the door when you sign up. If you made mistakes they do not care they give you a fresh start. I have even heard you get a new name when you sign up.

You can choose a nom de guerre. But there are a lot of myths about the Legion. If you google it you can come up with a great site that explains the joining and training.