Nothing in the Universe is Wrong

reply to post by AnotherYOU


I disagree. Love as a living ideal, is absolute, and by love I don't mean a feeling, but instead - mutuality.

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by SeeingBlue

 

'Before' the big bang it was now, after the big bang it was now and it still is now, eternally now.
The still still now.
Peaceful, silent and still, always now.

You are stuck in the Now! You kNeed to get out into the Universe and stretch your legs and your Mind.

There is more to this than the Now for the Now you speak of has happened 100's of times, you just don't kNow it.

Ribbit

Originally posted by AnotherYOU
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

the universe only lasts for a day, but that day lasts forever.

Nice, and I suspect, true.

Cool!

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by gabby2011

 

My post above is for you gabby, and for everyone who finds the notion of calling evil the balacing force of good, as a complimentary thing, unnerving and incongruent, or the idea that there's just no such thing, and that all victims therefore must be suffering from an illusion or worse, a victimhood they somehow chose. It doesn't work, this idea of there being no good and evil, no justice, or of evil/good being the yin/yang of the cosmos (talk about a PROJECTION of evil!), or worse, that good is evil and evil, good. It doesn't work, it doesn't grok, it makes no sense, and ought not be accepted.

I must agree with you concerning evil and good kNot being a balancing act.

There is kNOw balance in Chaos!

The problem is that everyone is how they are supposed to be and where We go wrong is by judging them, whether good or bad but those that judge, are just dew'n what they're suppose to dew, so while I said We go wrong by judging others, there is kNOw wrong but that doesn't mean there is kNOw right for to dew wrong, when you are suppose to dew wrong, is right.

The Perfection in Imperfection Paradox.

You gotta love this Imperfect Utopia.

Ribbit

reply to post by NewAgeMan


thats exactly why it does not exist in absolute.

because love, absolute love, includes both evil and good.


a trully loving being will love both what is good and what is evil.
because how can a trully loving being reject any part of himself, or better yet how can a trully loving one engage on the selfish act of judging what is good or evil?


does "judge not" ring a bell?

you cannot cover your eyes and dismiss that wich you dislike as if it disapears, it does not, it is part of creation too.

peace of being comes when both concepts are accepted



what is evil is those who turn their faces away from evil so they wont see

like you are disgusted with your self, what a shame.

how good it is to feel bad for my own self(you and everyone else included)


go figure

reply to post by ButtUglyToad


thats the key issue!

evil and bad is we having a concept for good and evil.
wich implies we are judging things, when we have no authority or morals to judge anything.

thats what "judge not for you shall be judged first" actually means.

over my short life i have seen many people denouncing and acusing evil in others and the world(and plenty rightfully so), but what none of those people denounced or even noticed was, how much evil it transpired from them too when lifting a finger to say "this or that is evil"

who are you to judge?

and who exactly is casting the first stone?

see, not even jebus could cast the first stone as he was as free of evil as you and me

If nothing is wrong.. then nothing is right either, and all is neutral containing nothing of right or wrong. If one exists then both must exist, or if one does not exist neither does the other. Or a lil more simply put.. opposites define each other by the lack of there opposite counterparts. As dark is defined by the lack of light.. and light defined by the lack of darkness. While I find your viewpoint refreshing.. I also find it a little improbable Peace.

reply to post by MemeticHarvest


While we can find philosophical arguments to contend what you post here, I will abstain. It is a nice post that points out something about our reality. Nature will take care of things....to its own satisfaction. It isn't always what you want exactly, but it usualy is enough to make due.

the funny bit of this thread is that if it is right, then those who have replied even when conflicting are all right too.

wich fits quite well whith the way i percieve things.

the purpose of life is simple
our purpose in life seems to be making it increasingly complex

the way it is

Originally posted by Resinveins
If nothing is wrong.. then nothing is right either, and all is neutral containing nothing of right or wrong. If one exists then both must exist, or if one does not exist neither does the other. Or a lil more simply put.. opposites define each other by the lack of there opposite counterparts. As dark is defined by the lack of light.. and light defined by the lack of darkness. While I find your viewpoint refreshing.. I also find it a little improbable

Peace.

If what We consider to be wrong is what that person is supposed to dew, then is it wrong or is it right?

If Imperfection is the desired result of an experiment and if that end result is reached, would that kNot be Perfection?

So just because there is kNOw wrong, doesn't mean there is kNOw right, it just means there is kNOw wrong. Another way to look at it, if you have always done something a certain way, it doesn't make it right or wrong per se, it only makes it the way you've always done it but because you were supposed to dew it that way, you were right in dew'n it that way, regardless if it is right or wrong.

Where neutrality comes into play is realizing there is kNOw wrong and to stop judging others for their actions.

Ribbit

Originally posted by AnotherYOU
the funny bit of this thread is that if it is right, then those who have replied even when conflicting are all right too.

wich fits quite well whith the way i percieve things.

the purpose of life is simple
our purpose in life seems to be making it increasingly complex

the way it is

kNot complexed, complicated.

Ribbit

reply to post by AnotherYOU

I don't turn away from it, and I see what you mean about absolute love transcending the duality (Jesus on the cross here comes to mind obviously).

I don't see it as part of any cosmic yin/yang though I think that's ridiculous and narcissistic of man to presume such a thing, and I don't think we need make any compromise with it either, whether in ourself or another, or in the world at large, in the "elite", the Corporations, whatever, as it needs to be stood up to and stood down, not accepted and embraced like a friend, because it's not a friend of man, but love is.

At the same time we cant' be vehemently in opposition to it either, chasing after it in judgement, no that doesn't work either, and there is wisdom in what you're saying.

I think you understand, and no this isn't about me, if anything I suffer from a case of survivors guilt whereby the abuse passed over me, and hit others close to me.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


i understand quite well

the way i see it, one does have to overcome evil.

but you only can overcome it by judging it as necessary, and not necessarily evil.
by doing it any other way you empower it.

if someone wants to cause evil unto you, and you percieve such as evil, that evil intent has succeded
whereas if you embrace what is meant to be used as evil against you, theres no evil or harm anyone or anything can inflict upon you


even the greatest pain can be turned into the most glorious joy, and vice versa.

its those moments when we transcend on how good it is to be alive
even when you are made to walk along evil

to me theres just no way to separate good and evil

Your OP was positive and a refreshing way of looking at what you described with the hermit crabs. This whole discussion about the relativity, subjectivity, etc of good and evil though has really caught my attention. I think it is wise to be very careful with judgement, as discernment in these matters is increasingy difficult, and we are warned In much great literature that many who seek to identify and destroy evil become what they seek to destroy.
Having said that, especially the last poster's assertions that even in those moments of great pain we can find the joy in being alive, even walking beside what is evil.....and I also agree with OP's point in one of his posts that many who have great evil in them have experienced and carry great pain... But I must ask those of you who find it relative or subjective, if you have ever known a true psychopath, experienced someone who only views others as an object of some kind to be manipulated for their own pleasures, and this pleasure or sole purpose in life may be only to thrive off your, or anyone's pain or manipulation or control? Someone who will analyze and pick out the best parts of you and use them against you to hurt you, and enjoy this. Someone who would restrain you, torture you, or hold you hostage with inflicting pain or death on you or someone you love. These kinds of actions are what I define as true evil, and I can't seem to wrap my head around the idea that there is any good possible in such things or actions, or anything redeeming in a personality that would commit such acts, or that there could be any subjectivity about this. These people do exist, amost often prey upon those least able to defend themselves. And nothing about being a victim of such things, I don't think, makes anyone feel more alive, and frequently leaves the victims wishing for their own deaths after having realized that such exists in the world.

reply to post by AnotherYOU

Evil is just a type of human mental illness, a disease, a sickness, arising from all the worst parts of humanity, and no it's not "neccessary" that's ridiculous, I'm sorry. And good, the good is good for goodness' own sake, and it's it's own reward, there's no evil in it, at all. And love is never evil. I'm not sure you do understand now and I don't mean that in a harsh or negative way.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


ok, but thats not the issue.

right here right now, we can agree that there is alot of good in this world, and that there is alot of evil too.


so where is that absence of evil you speak of? how can you know? you surelly know nothing about a world without evil.
but when you percieve no evil, no evil exists.
if we agree that evil exists by conceptulizing it, we are creating it.

and yeah, there is good and evil, and so far you havent showed me how and why they have to be separate.
all you showed me was how to favour one in dextriment of the other, is that not evil? or being evil unto evil suddently makes evil good? maybe it does, see the relative nature of the problem?

theres no absolutes, you are talking of a two way street when its really two sides of the same coin

Like I said, good is it's own reward and it's formative, fruitful, fun and enjoyable. In the good, there's no evil in sight, it's nowhere to be found.

Evil on the other hand, is like a house divided against itself, and yet somehow seems able to sustain itself in our world, and yeah sure I can see how resisting it, and judging it and chasing it around in an effort to KILL it, does nothing more than give it undo attention, which is why the old addage "resist not evil" since what we resist, persists.

So somehow we are left with a dillema or a paradox, that on the one hand we must ignore it completely, as if it's not there, and on the other, face it and contend with it directly, so as to overcome it and transcend it, while teaching others how to do likewise. There is where forgiveness comes in, starting with the self, one's own family of origin members, and then extending outwardly from there, dissolving more and more of it, by the power of love.

In my mind, simply telling them that it's the flip side of the same coin and that in love is evil too, just isn't helpful, I'm sorry I can't buy that one, it's a dog that don't hunt.

An ever expanding sphere of influencial love overcoming evil in our world, while treating it as a type of sickness or mental illness and nothing more, now that is something I'm very interested in, not just to be rid of evil, but to increase love by many orders of magnitude, which is the purpose of life imho.

reply to post by MemeticHarvest


Everything is the way it should be. If you've ever had a Peak Experience you will know this. Just for a couple of second's you reach that incredible level of enlightenment, your whole being understands instinctively that everything is perfection, an unshakeable belief that you are creation and creation is you. You are co-creator with God, no fear, no tears, no regrets. Everything happens for a reason and that reason is love, you are love unbounded, perfection, immaculate. Then you come down like a ton of bricks and everything looks wrong and twisted again. The fact is your consciousness has contracted into your body again and you start to look at thing's as that separate entity again, that charlatan the ego comes rushing back to seduce you into fear, greed, unhappiness. Ego you little b'stard, one of these day's i am gonna kick your but!

reply to post by tetra50


i have met people who consciously done alot of evil things, the kind you describe.
i did not necessarily judged them as bad individuals though.

as ive met many who consciously done good things, but i cant say i considered them as being good, or certainly as being better than the ones mentioned before.

i cannot judge people, i can only judge their actions. and by judge i mean judge how it relates to myself and my experience, my personal judgements hold no power into the actions and decisions of others.
our judgements reflect on ourselves.

this to say i cant say i ever met or know anyone who i consider to be purelly evil, or good for that matter.
we all have our flaws, no one is perfect, there are no saints or devils here, we all play our role and switch each week.


but i ackowledge that there has to be people like that, not that i will say i understand why or how, but i cant separate both ends.

as long as some insist that we have to be 100% good and act like saints, be flawless(wich does not exist)
well some will insist in going the other way, just to show they can.

none of those people are right, yet none are wrong either.

and im surelly not the one to judge

i can only judge myself
and judge why i still embrace some things but am repulsed by others

when i came to acccepting that all is trully one, that makes no sense.


then i started looking at the world without being judgemental on what i like/good or dislike/evil, and its pretty much like a second childhood, once again you start to see and perceive everything as new and exciting.
theres no good or evil, this is just one big playground.

and when playing cops and robbers, as it is with this world where duality is offered and prevalent.
the game gets quite dull if we all want to play on the same side.

what evil world would be if we had nothing to make us mad, or no one to blame or point the finger.


if recognizing evil usually leads to one striving to do good, so how evil can evil be?

Originally posted by AnotherYOU
what evil world would be if we had nothing to make us mad, or no one to blame or point the finger.

I like what you said in that post, but this summation, isn't that the very world you are living into according to this view you now hold, which is making the world appear fresh and new to you?

I noted you added another line, recognizing the absurdity of evil, once recognized.

Could it be that clarity of vision, and honesty, forgiveness and love negates evil, whereas evil only exists or occurs in the blindness of ignorance?

Perhaps evil is unreal, in this way, and everything that's left is just the real world as it is, that simply what is could also be thought of as love, and not a duality coin of good and evil.

Maybe indeed, we give it too much credibility, too much reality, when it's born from blindness and ignorance.

I think there's something quite extraordinary when we see it dissolve before our very eyes, without the NEED to keep it alive, because we're afraid that the implications is that we must be "perfect" and without any error, which is hardly "evil".