Opponents of Occupy Wall Street -- Since you know better, WHAT DO WE DO?

Left and right people have been criticizing my involvement and enthusiasm in the movement. I get mad u2u's telling me "you're wasting your time" and "you're gonna change nothing" or "i hope once you get arrested you go home and apply for a job"...

first, let me set the record straight, I'm a married man with 2 children, and a job. that does not make me socially unaware, nor does it take away my ability to make an effort against that with which i disagree.

now, people always say that this isn't gonna work, and this isn't gonna change nothing. worse, this is a theatre of the absurd, or this is just a fad, but they NEVER provide an alternative. while comfortably reclining in their arm chair, or sitting in their cubicle, or laying in their beds, people criticize those who are out trying to spread the word, raise awareness, talk to people, pass out pamphlets with information on the fed, and just TRY. what in the hell gives y'all the right to criticize??? if you don't think that occupations will make a difference get involved and suggest changes.

The answer is simple,
Go home you've been duped.

reply to post by TinfoilTP


that wasn't the damn question..... read maybe???

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


A lot of the people telling you this also seem to think that paradise is the way the U.S. before workers had many rights or expectations to any sort of decent treatment or safety standards and before there was any regulation of food and medicine safety at all (though, admittedly, precious little exists today).

Think Bigger.

You want to act on the global level, then you are going to have to pick which global actors you're going to throw your support behind.

I know what I want already.

You convince *ME* that you guys get it, and that you aren't be led by the nose.

Just like the conservatives/tea-party people who are also being led by the nose.

You want to "lead from behind?"

Screaming about how you want it to change, and then demanding *THEY* change it is ridiculous.

What are you going to do to bring the politicians, the bankers, the media oligarchs, the top 0.01% to heel?

They've heard. They see. They are PLEASED.

You want to effect global issues, without having an global actors. While rejecting the entire notion of it.

That's not going to work.

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
reply to post by TinfoilTP

 

that wasn't the damn question..... read maybe???

WHAT DO WE DO?,

From your title, I answered.
I was courtious enough not to link back to any threads in the process too.

reply to post by TinfoilTP


by "we", i did not mean those of us who are occupying our cities, i meant WE as in all of us.. what do you and I and him and her do? we all want change, then we have to agree on a method of getting that change.. do you agree?

for my response to your first post i apologize because i'd guess that the first step to uniting a people is for people to communicate better..

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


Not everybody wants the same change and many of these wanted changes directly conflict with other wanted changes.

The most important step to bringing about enough changes to satisfy enough people would be destroying the national unit and breaking things into smaller units.

Or at the very least destroy the virtual control the national unit and state units wield over the smaller units.

I'd be willing to bet that upwards of 80% to 95% of all the specific people who want to see "change" would be satisfied to just not have some magical entity holding a gun to their heads 24/7 shouting "no!" at every turn.

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
reply to post by TinfoilTP

 

by "we", i did not mean those of us who are occupying our cities, i meant WE as in all of us.. what do you and I and him and her do? we all want change, then we have to agree on a method of getting that change.. do you agree?

for my response to your first post i apologize because i'd guess that the first step to uniting a people is for people to communicate better..

edit on 26-10-2011 by My.mind.is.mine because: (no reason given)

If they go home and stop being sheeple, that is change enough as far as OWS Inc. is concerned. The only change they can bring about is the ushering in of Globalism, where you are no better off than a starving Third World Nation peasant.

reply to post by TinfoilTP


I'm all for realizing that the world's issues are global, and dealing with that effectively mean having global level actors.

Anyone thinking that they can IGNORE global level issues into going away is going to get frackin' owned. Probably literally.

No.

reply to post by TinfoilTP


ok, again, i'm not speaking in regards to occupations.. i'm saying, since you don't agree with the occupations, what would YOU do? what's YOU'RE alternative to occupations in regards to fighting this oppressive system..?

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
reply to post by TinfoilTP

 

ok, again, i'm not speaking in regards to occupations.. i'm saying, since you don't agree with the occupations, what would YOU do? what's YOU'RE alternative to occupations in regards to fighting this oppressive system..?

Identifying the problem - not the 1%. Then supporting the changes that will effectively deal with it - you know, the institutions most of Occupy movement are vilifying.

If you taking care of your street was enough to effect global level issues and lend the security and consistency to make sure that you won't then just get annihilated by a group who are willing to act as a group, then I'd be your biggest cheerleader. But I'm not, because for your ideas to work would have to be caused by a mass change in the human mind so that no one ever acted as a group. That's just not going to happen.

I would have thought it was obvious no-one has any frigging clue how to actually help society, people just want to run their mouths. that and they hiding that they agree on some points because nazi's keep records for later.

there is nothing we can do until joe blow gets it.

ed: I could give a damn less about occupy, im talking about change for the greater good, why you think EVERY COUNTRY is protesting banks?

reply to post by whatsinaname


yet it's our country men who have nothing but criticism to contribute.. problem there?

Enslave all of humanity, we 1% will feed you and cloth you as long as you work hard we promise. It's going to happen sooner than later lets just get it over with bow down to the leetness of the 1% silly slaves.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


Amazing point, but i am afraid that you are just going to get some more of the same answers.
They are going to say "Go Home", "Get a Job" and all sorts of other non-productive, uninformed, regurgitated answers.

The fact is that they are the same ones who would tell others that if they didn't like something, why aren't they doing something about it? Now that something is being done about it, it's being done wrong, or for the wrong reasons, or whatever other clever thing they heard from their favorite pundit.

I support OWS 100% because i believe every American has a right to be able to 1. Have job options available that pay a fair living wage. 2. Keep a fair amount of that wage 3. take steps to prevent insane debt from being passed on to our children.

Myself and a lot of other OWS supporters have open minds, and we are willing to listen to ideas from non-supporters on how to better tackle the challenge we are facing. Outright negativity helps no one, and will only work to further divide the American people. Constructive criticism will help to align the American people for the common good, and foster an environment where we can work for the common good, which is all OWS really wants.

Peace
DC

My solution for the current situation is for the ows protesters to go home, they have made their point, And I fully respect their right to make their point, and everyone has heard loud and clear, if they keep protesting like this it will eventually get violent and then the pie will be in their face. Think Woodstock 99 riots....

I know their intentions are good, but the road to hell is paved in good intentions is a idiomatic expression for a reason....

I believe if the passion that burns in these protesters were focused in a constructive way, and they tempered their passions with logic and reason, they could contribute so much to our society. They are for the most part brilliant people but they are focusing their efforts in the wrong place. They need to use all that intelligence, passion and creativity to bring good things into the world.


My personal solution to our worlds overall problem is simple, go back to basics and make every American child take a class called " ethics" begin this in elementary school.

Make sure every American child has a strong positive spiritual foundation whether it is traditional religion or new age belief. I do not think it should be enforced by law, but I think that children function better with spiritual foundations.

Make sure every American child has a supportive strong family base, whether traditional or untraditional as long as the family unit is focused on raising that child to become a productive part of our society, by productive I mean socially, physically, emotionally and mentally fit to function and contribute in a positive way.

Make sure every American child understands the foundations of our nation, the guiding principles of what it truly means to be American. I am not talking about George Washington cutting down a cherry tree, I am talking about explaining to kids why our nation was founded, what the settlers where comming to America for, and I do not mean the whole streets paved in gold bs....teach why we have three branches of govt checks and balances....

The only way the corruption will be weeded out of the Economic/political system is if we weed it out of every single individual in our nation.......

The USA has poisioned the well, and protesting about it will not change it, each individual has to get right by themselves, the corruption of the system is a direct reflection of us as a people, micro/macrocosim, or as the aleister crowley crowd says " AS ABOVE/SO BELOW"

Once we get right as individuals, our society will reflect that....people have forgotten somethings are sacred for a reason......

reply to post by xDeadcowx


"something is being done about it"

What is being done about it at Occupy? Nothing, not a dam thing.

The politicians will come out winners, the globalists will get concessions. The next time they feel they need more concessions to further their cause they will organize another event precluded by economic disaster fully orchestrated by them again.

You see they set up the system to fail, then took your money to pay themselves back. They lost nothing, gained stirring up the masses at the expense of their impoverishment so they can ask for more control.

Global banking will be further centralized and further subsidized by the common people, that is what Occupy is getting done. The ultimate twist of irony.

On a smaller localized scale of the global agenda, socialist politicians will gain stronger support, pandering to the very concerns they enabled in the first place. Obama announcing yesterday student loan debt relief? Mortgage relief? In other countries I am willing to bet their resident prominent Socialist is pandering just as hard.

Originally posted by lokdog
Enslave all of humanity, we 1% will feed you and cloth you as long as you work hard we promise. It's going to happen sooner than later lets just get it over with bow down to the leetness of the 1% silly slaves.

And you are the 3% Globally. But you in your arrogance don't realize what that means.

If you don't want to work, get together with your friends and buy up a farm and share it.

You can all work your share, and live subsistence. You have that choice. Please feel free to exercise it.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

Are you interested in the opinions of Occupy*'s opponents, or opponents of how Occupy* is doing things? Personally, I think Occupy* would be better off starting a business and monetizing the obvious appeal their brand has. They can sell Occupy*-approved tents, literature, drum sets, Halloween masks, whatever. They can employ Americans to manufacture these things, and do all their banking through a credit union. Maybe they can even do all their transactions in gold and silver specie, or donate their profits to Ron Paul. They won't accomplish any sweeping political changes, but I think that's a good thing.

If you want to know what Occupy* should be doing to accomplish their goals, they need to run candidates and get signatures for initiatives / referenda that will advance the kinds of laws they favor. Most lists of Occupy* demands I've seen would require rewriting huge swathes of state and federal law, so they need to get familiar with that process right away. They also need to engage civil society on an intellectual level. Start from the ground up with editorials in the local papers and organizational blogs, then promote those through larger media outlets, and eventually people will be inviting Occupy* representatives to come to them. And they must choose their representatives carefully. None of these people.