Veteran shot in the face by rubber bullet at Occupy Oakland protests

reply to post by theovermensch


It looked like he took a canister hit to me but who knows on the top of the head i don't think he would of bleed the way he did.

Originally posted by theovermensch

Well it is a concern to the world because America affects every individual on the planet.I think we should all vote in your elections.Your President dominates the UN,NATO and has the most advanced military.You hold the reserve currency.It is your empire we live in.OWS is global and for good reason.

No thank you, we don't want to be part of your One World Socialist government/state, but you can have all the leftwingers in the United States if you want...

When all leftwingers, and corpocrats the leftwingers put in power leave, the United States will be way ahead in becoming as great as it once was...

Oh and btw... it was the LEFTWINGER ideas on "PROGRESS" that put in power the central bank known as the Feds and which printed the U.S. dollar and put the world in what you call "the empire you all live in"... Yet you people want even more LEFTWINGER "PROGRESSIVE PROGRAMS/IDEAS" to dominate/control the world further?...

As i said...no thank you, you can keep your One World Socialist government, and even the Feds people like you helped create...

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

So, instead of trying to find proof all you can do is make false claims?... Is that really all you can do?

I'm not making any claims so what exactly am I meant to prove??

You on the other hand are making claims that a small group with little money is controlling protests in multiple cities and even that they started the movement..

Big claims that require a lot more proof that you have shown IMO..

Originally posted by backinblack

I'm not making any claims so what exactly am I meant to prove??

You on the other hand are making claims that a small group with little money is controlling protests in multiple cities and even that they started the movement..

Big claims that require a lot more proof that you have shown IMO..

Obviously you can't be bothered with evidence...

And you call a small group all the leftwinger groups that the pamphlet for the Boston OWS protest shows are partner/organizers and is not proof at all to you?... Or all the videos showing who is behind these protests that even protesters themselves admit what they want, and the groups that are behind the movement?

No wonder the world is going down the drain...

Again, all you do is MAKE CLAIMS without giving any evidence whatsoever, but just claim "that's not enough for me"...

Originally posted by backinblack
...
To say anything different leads me to think there are also those that are paid to exaggerate the situation and try to paint the OWS movement as something it certainly isn't..

BTW, you are not making any claims?... i wonder what you were trying to imply in your claim above?... Or it must be that you have a memory problem and can't remember what you did 5 minutes ago....

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by backinblack
...
To say anything different leads me to think there are also those that are paid to exaggerate the situation and try to paint the OWS movement as something it certainly isn't..

BTW, you are not making any claims?... i wonder what you were trying to imply in your claim above?... Or it must be that you have a memory problem and can't remember what you did 5 minutes ago....

Nah mate..
That's a claim about what's happening outside the protests and I doubt many would disagree..

Your tactics are pretty obvious trying to deflect the questions with little or no proof...

Originally posted by backinblack

Nah mate..
That's a claim about what's happening outside the protests and I doubt many would disagree..

Your tactics are pretty obvious trying to deflect the questions with little or no proof...

You are the one providing NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER as always, yet you want to claim I am the one being paid?...

Again PROVE IT. you can't because you are lying, and since you can't refute the evidence other members and I have provided all you can do like always is lie, claim "they are being paid for this" alongside other BS people like you like to spew when you don't have any way to dispute facts...

Anyway....like your socialist friend walkingfox likes to say..."your are talking from the wrong orifice on the other side of your digestive tract system..."

Occupy Oakland: Iraq vet critically injured by police projectile

So, he comes home alive only to be shot by one of the henchman of TPTB? My husband and I used to have discussions about how the "sides" would break down and would the military be for "us" or "them". I think we have our answer.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by ColCurious
So... Crony Capitalism, Corruption and bailing out Banks is American then?

And AGAIN who made it possible for "crony capitalism" to exist?...

Who installed the Feds, giving complete control over the U.S. economy, and puting Americans forever in debt and made us slaves to a central banking system?... Who installed the IRS as it exists today?...

I will give you a hint... PROGRESSIVES DID.... the left...

So I guess after the 63rd Congress and Woodrow Wilson inacted the Federal Reserve Act everyone forgot about it? There was never a right-wing Congress or President after 1913?

You can stay narrow-minded and dwell in your partisan paradigm, playing the blame-game... but you wont solve anything.

reply to post by Radec


Yeah,I guess what hit him doesnt matter much,I hope he is ok.Funny when something like this happens the mainstream media downplay or ignore it.You would think this would be bigger news.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse

Again PROVE IT. you can't because you are lying, and since you can't refute the evidence other members and I have provided all you can do like always is lie, claim "they are being paid for this" alongside other BS people like you like to spew when you don't have any way to dispute facts...

Anyway....like your socialist friend walkingfox likes to say..."your are talking from the wrong orifice on the other side of your digestive tract system..."

You haven't given any evidence for me to prove wrong..
I have clearly stated numerous times that I have no doubt these people are "attempting" to hijack the protests..
Your evidence backs that up but in no way shows that they actually started the movement or that they control it now..
Pretty simple to comprehend..

No, it was both parties all up the fed's rear end for the last who knows how many years - Ron Paul is a republican and he's against it, and Kucinich is a liberal - and the media has most people believing that they are completely foolish men.

What if we had a Ceasar back, and he said no one owns more than 500,000 acres - maximum property ownership laws, would they still want corporations to be a person? If so they are going to have to give up ownership on a lot of homes.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


I normally justify much of the police actions however Id have to see the video of exactly what happened and be on scene to hear exactly what was said. And it is possible they do or do not have a policy allowing those items used which would be a another factor.

When anyone gets hurt at a protest it is a sad day. I will say though I have seen many videos where the protests have not been so "peaceful". We unfortunately only get pieces of video showing the aftermath and then we hear "police brutality".....why do we judge so quickly without hearing both sides or seeing the complete video? It is upsetting to me that we judge so quickly. I am not saying the police are perfect because in a large department like NY, LA, Chicago....you are going to have a handful of asshats. All im asking is that we single out the bad ones and not judge cops as a whole.

In fact...the only thing in the video i saw is two protesters throwing objects at the police or what I am assuming is the direction of the police...one is unknown and the other is a tear gas canister. We don't see what object hit the alleged veteran which we are assuming came from the police.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by theovermensch

Well it is a concern to the world because America affects every individual on the planet.I think we should all vote in your elections.Your President dominates the UN,NATO and has the most advanced military.You hold the reserve currency.It is your empire we live in.OWS is global and for good reason.

No thank you, we don't want to be part of your One World Socialist government/state, but you can have all the leftwingers in the United States if you want...

When all leftwingers, and corpocrats the leftwingers put in power leave, the United States will be way ahead in becoming as great as it once was...

Oh and btw... it was the LEFTWINGER ideas on "PROGRESS" that put in power the central bank known as the Feds and which printed the U.S. dollar and put the world in what you call "the empire you all live in"... Yet you people want even more LEFTWINGER "PROGRESSIVE PROGRAMS/IDEAS" to dominate/control the world further?...

As i said...no thank you, you can keep your One World Socialist government, and even the Feds people like you helped create...

edit on 27-10-2011 by ElectricUniverse because: (no reason given)

I call your attention the act that is most responsible for this mess.

The repeal of provisions of the Glass–Steagall Act of 1933 by the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act effectively removed the separation that previously existed between investment banking which issued securities and commercial banks which accepted deposits. The deregulation also removed conflict of interest prohibitions between investment bankers serving as officers of commercial banks.
en.wikipedia.org...

the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act, is named after its co-sponsors Phil Gramm (R, Texas), Rep. Jim Leach (R, Iowa), and Rep. Thomas J. Bliley, Jr. (R, Virginia).

It has become impossible to distinguish between elected officials and concentrated capital in this country. In a system where special interest can pull its backing and in effect destroy a candidates re-election chances, is the same as being fired by your boss!

The law should be accountable to the people!

Mussolini said it best when he said "Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power. "

You are Fascist without any doubt!

The OWS has just one demand regardless of whether you have heard it on Faux News or not.


All I ever heard at my local OWS was support for Ron Paul! You need to get a clue and stop begging for this police state!

Violence is not the answer.
Whoever wins the fight (if a real fight ensues) will just become the next douche bag that someone will have to take down at a future point.

Humiliation and and taking away their power... that's the only thing that comes to my mind.
But how do you take away police power? How do you humiliate them?

The idea is to get them to hate what they are doing so they wake up and realize at some point they are all gonna end up like the rest of us.
Because they are Us.

However I'm sure right now a lot of them Love what they are doing.
You can't tell me there's not a few cops out there who are loving every second of this...
There's probably quite a few of them who have been waiting for a moment like this, to hand out some authority on some of the a$$holes they come across on a daily basis. Why?
Because they are Human just like you...

Just like some civilians, wanting to retaliate with revenge, in the name of justice... it's the same type of behavior. Why? Because they are Human just like you.

People need to get creative about how to continue this Movement.

Otherwise someone is gonna end up doing something stupid like hijacking a gas truck and driving it straight into a large group of of Humans who all think they are doing the right thing.

If everyone would stop buying gasoline.
Maybe things would change.
Or maybe someone would notice.
But they won't because they have to get to work.
If everyone didn't pay their taxes this coming year.
Maybe things would change.
Or maybe someone would notice.
But they won't because they will end up in jail or they need that refund check that they are just gonna get taxed on next year.
It goes on and on... because the game is rigged.

The only things that really matter in this world are Food & Shelter.
If everyone would focus on those things and stop feeding the machine...
The machine would starve.
But you can't spread the message because the Machine controls the Media, so the message is inaudible by most & the ones who get the message will be scoffed at and punished for it.
So it goes by word of mouth, a very slow process.

I think some people forget the "Why" of it because they get caught up in the politics and the labeling of it all that some of the people out there protesting have no homes nor $ to feed themselves or their families because it was taken away from them.
It's easy to say "Hey, go get a job!"
However if your your already living on the street with no $... how do you get one?

I think if more people would discuss rather than dictate, things may change but the only thing I see people doing are making opinions... and then other people opinionating on the original persons opinion.
Just like my opinion... Means beans to you but to me it's my way of life.

I've lived a simple life for quite some time now and I have to say... I've done a whole lot more living than most people I know. I can appreciate the small things much better this way and it leads to a richness no $ could ever buy.

Everyone is making opinions but No one is really talking.

Which leads us to violence and as I said from the beginning...
Violence is not the answer.
Get creative.

Originally posted by backinblack
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

 

So, instead of trying to find proof all you can do is make false claims?... Is that really all you can do?

I'm not making any claims so what exactly am I meant to prove??

You on the other hand are making claims that a small group with little money is controlling protests in multiple cities and even that they started the movement..

Big claims that require a lot more proof that you have shown IMO..

A small group with no money? Better check again, obama gave acorn billions. www.newsmax.com...

Obama's Bill Hands ACORN $5.2 Billion Bailout

I wouldn't call billions no money.

Here's another one dated 2/12/10 Seems obamas takeing care of his friends. www.washingtontimes.com...

To add to the list of outrageous earmarks in Obama's fiscal 2011 budget, it appears left-wing activist groups including ACORN, the embezzlement-prone, voter-registration-fraud-plagued community organizing group, are eligible to receive up to $3.99 billion in taxpayer-backed slush money.

So it's looking like acorn and other groups through obama seems to have plenty of money to fund ows.

I absolutely agree that the police are acting in a brutal manner, without regard for the so called "God given rights" granted to us by our Constitution. They do not seem to understand that we are their sisters, brothers, cousins, uncles..

Retaliating against the police with violence will only strengthen their resolve. Officers who are sympathetic to our cause will immediately and without reservation start viewing us as hooligans, savages, RIOTERS and we will lose any chance of having them as an eventual ally.

National Guard would be called in immediately to disperse the crowds. I assume those of you calling for violence, in this hypothetical situation, would stay and fight the National Guard and police because you're all so hardcore. I know many of you think that the Army, Marines, Navy, Airforce and their respective reserves would be on our side, but that would probably change for the majority of them when it became apparent that we were willing to kill LEOs.

Eventually, when the police and National Guard realized that the crowd was resolved to meet violence with an equal level of violence, they would start using lethal means to take control of the situation.

The Federal Government would declare a state of emergency. A curfew would be instated. Crowds would be dealt with swiftly and harshly. Prisoners would be branded "terrorists" and moved to an undisclosed location with no legal representation, no trial.. They would disappear.

All of this of course would only serve to increase our anger and level of hostility. Gorilla warfare would break out in our city streets. All the gun owning Americans in the world would not be enough to stop the onslaught.

These events would most definitely be used to justify an immediate disarming of citizens, by force. The majority of American people would be so frightened about what is happening in their country that they would fully support the efforts of the government to disarm the people and bring some semblance of peace back to their country.

This is what you people are calling for. I know there are millions of people around the world harboring some dark fantasy where this is the reality, but for those of us with rational minds this is a nightmare and the exact opposite of what OWS is trying to achieve.

The police, in many states, are showing who they've pledged their allegiance to. We need to continue to peacefully demonstrate to them that we are willing to take their punishment for as long as it takes and will not lower ourselves to their level. This is the only possible way that the police and military (not small amounts of individuals, but these entire establishments) will eventually stand with us in this time of change. It is horrible any time someone sustains life threatening injuries, but to escalate based on one incident where it is still not clear exactly what happened would be beyond foolish.

I hope you all do your best to react with your brains, and not your hearts. While your anger is admirable, it's also dangerous.

This may set a precedent. It's interesting that protesters and Iraq vets are considered terrorists by members of the Federal Government, isn't it?
Iraqui Vets are Terrorists

A clear pattern has emerged in the response to occupations throughout the country, from San Francisco to Denver, involving midnight raids by heavily armed paramilitary units of riot police deployed to enforce park curfews.

These efforts to intimidate the protesters are symptoms of three decades of policies that have militarized civilian law enforcement.

So urce
The police are certainly acting as if they are dealing with armed and dangerous terrorists. I guess they haven't figured out that the terrorists are in the White Haus.

Originally posted by Sly1one
reply to post by TinkerHaus

 

These protests are ineffective because the people who have all the control are paid for by the elites (the people are most pissed off at), protesting and asking for "specific" legislation will not solve anything...the people know this. It would actually be INSANE to keep trying the same ole failed methods of "appeal" and "protest" the government is broken and because it is broken…there are very very few options left to achieve the change desired, whatever it may be…

This is why violence is ALWAYS the end result when corruption is too thick…there are no options of ridding the corruption left. We rely too heavily on TRUST in that our “leaders” will do the right thing and not abuse their power when that trust is gone the realization is apparent that you cannot ask them to suddenly fix what they broke…they are corrupt.

TPTB just don't care they have all the control and no lone president (Ron Paul) is going to be able to weed out the corruption...no handful of decent judges or legislators will stand a chance at making any meaningful change at what has be come a metastasized tumor of corruption within ALL FACETS of our government...

I guarantee you this will turn violent by the end because people will finally realize how ISANE it is to continue to participate in what has become a cesspool…They realize that marching around with sign no matter how many of them, thousands, millions etc…will solve nothing.

The only thing left is violence because nobody prepared for this…nobody prepared to suddenly “up and quit the system” there is no contingency plan for individual livelihood that gives an “out” other than “violence”…

Stop paying your taxes? Uhh…most people don’t even have control of that money in the first place…most people’s taxes are taken straight out of their paycheck before they even see it. They never have the option to “stop paying taxes”…its gone before they even get it…its up to the “big business” that employs and pays people to do that…and they won’t

Taxes doesn’t even address the even deeper rooted issues of a fiat currency…


The problems are TOO LARGE and TOO MANY to solve in any traditional manner, the government cannot digest and stomach all the problems it has accumulated over its existence…and because it can’t it wont and people will give up and resort to the default primal cornered animal fight or flight response, and you will have…violence…

This is not surprising, this is not new, this is a cyclic phase of an INSANE group of beings that keep utilizing the same methods (government) that require the same concepts (control, authority, power, leadership, rulers etc) which always have and always will create corruption and abuse to the point of violence…

Wash, rinse and repeat…PEOPLE ARE INSANE!!!!

edit on 26-10-2011 by Sly1one because: (no reason given)

I agree with much of what you say, but disagree that the situation ended violently is inevitable.

It's a strong possibility, yes. Not yet inevitable.

This is why I am calling for tax withholding, general strikes, "call bombs" to congressmen and senators. We can shut the system down by refusal to participate. Using our numbers we can have huge effects on the mechanisms that keep the country running smoothly.

I'm not apologizing for the police, I believe many of them are 100% in the wrong right now. I'm not saying violence is 100% avoidable, I'm saying let's not get our collective panties in a bunch just yet. There is still opportunity for OWS' success without violence... Let's make it happen.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
I'm absolutely shocked at the polices response. Tear Gas and rubber bullets against a majority of peaceful protesters. It is completely unacceptable, yet I fear some on ATS will defend or justify the polices actions

You're shocked? I'm not. This has been in the making for a very long time. I expect they'll be using real bullets soon.