Do You Fear Change? Is That Why You Do Not Support OWS?

reply to post by dr_strangecraft


Exactly....but:

When the corporate operation lobbies their politician buddies to get extra rules and regulations that the larger operation can afford to absorb, but bankrupts the small operations - that is no longer the free market at work is it?

Believe me, I'm self employed and a free market guy. In my business I have seen corruption at all levels.

I have lost accounts because managment changes and the new guy wants a kick back on everything I do. Even though I have been contracting in that plant and doing quality work for 10 years before that dirtbag was ever there.

I have been offered a no bid contract in the Northeast for 10 times what the contract was worth because of a perceived political connection I had. I turned it down. It would have cost taxpayers in that county $100,000.

Like I said, I believe in the free market, but that's not really what we have anymore.

reply to post by AP-Chris


Is the Chevy Volt an example of the free market at work?

How about Solyndra?

How about Toyota's high profile unintended acceleration problems? Does anyone know that Ford has the same problems. Ford ranked second with 28% of complaints:

In December 2009, Consumer Reports published an article that said 41 percent of the sudden acceleration complaints received by the NHTSA in 2008 pertained to Toyota and its luxury brand, Lexus. Ford came in second behind Toyota with 28 percent of the complaints relating to U.S. models.

source: articles.cnn.com...:US

Insteaqd of a level playing field, our government picks winners and losers, most of the time based on connections/campaign contributions and corruption.

reply to post by AP-Chris

Like I said, I believe in the free market, but that's not really what we have anymore.

Because, in the beginnings of this nation, the Founders tied silver to the price of gold in coining monies, it is arguable that the U.S. never has had a free market, but that is the purist in me talking.

While there are many factors that has led to this oppressively regulated market Americans inexplicably call a "free market system", it is the rise of that ugly and very nasty beast of credentialism that killed capitalism and helped pave the way for corporatism. Of course, first and foremost it was the exponential growth of corporations that led to credentialism, or which came first; the chicken or the egg?

The absurdity of credentialism first tugged on my shirt sleeve many years ago when I walked past a book store with a sign the proudly declared: "We are a licensed bookseller". Whew! Thank God! I thought to myself. It is comforting to know that the city is protecting me from dangerous books. At that time, I did not realize that the legal definition of license meant a grant of permission to do something that would otherwise be illegal. This I discovered later, but once Pandora's Box is opened, there is no turning back.

The interesting thing about licensing schemes for business is what must be done to obtain one. A few years ago, a friend and I were writing and drawing our own comic book just for laughs. We did finally consider self publishing. At some point I saw this advertisement for a book fair, and one of the events was a discussion panel of independent comic book artists who self publish. Among them would be David Mack who I think is one of the coolest comic book writer/artists alive. His Kabuki series is amazing.

Anyway, we went to this book fare to see this event and maybe meet David Mack, and hopefully learn some things and gain useful information that might propel us forward in our publishing ambitions. On that panel was this adorably ditzy young woman, who among them was the least known, and admittedly had not made a single dime off her efforts. Because she was so damned cute, my friend and I were naturally drawn towards her.

While we were talking, it came up that my friend and I had been drawing and writing our own comic and would like to self publish. She got very excited and told us the first thing we needed to do was go the IRS and get a tax ID number. I knew why she was suggesting we do this, because without a tax ID number...well, being more flirtatious than adversarial, I asked her why? "Well, without a tax ID, you can't get a license". "A license?" I asked. "Yeah, you know a business license to publish." "But"; I asked "Why would I want a license?" "To be legitimate." She smiled softly. My friend laughed. She asked him what he was laughing at. He explained that she was an independent/underground comic book creator. She didn't get the joke.

I asked her why she would need a tax ID number outside of in order to obtain a license. She looked at me like I was dense and explained that it was because as a business she had an obligation to report her finances to the IRS. "But" I said; "You said you haven't made any money." "I haven't." She replied. My friend laughed again. Her sweet face was getting red, and she was becoming uncomfortable with us so we stopped being so obtuse with her.

This is a fine example of the absurdity of credentialism. An underground comic book creator thinks she needs a license to be an underground comic book artist. Sigh.

On the other side of the spectrum, there are the licensing of professions like medicine. It makes sense to many why a doctor should be licensed, and so they are. Yet, in spite of that licensing...or maybe because of it...today there is iatrogenocide, which describes death by doctoring, which happens to be the third leading cause of death among American in the U.S. What good are these licensing schemes if you are more likely to be killed by your doctor than any other disease besides cancer and heart disease, automobile accidents, or other accidents, or murder, or any other form of death?

Credentialism has done far more damage than it has ever done any good, and its very nature demands a close economic system.

Let me start by saying, I do not fear anything. Least of all, change.

That is not a bold statement, it is the truth.

But change for the sake of change is useless and unneeded. Twenty-five percent of OWS are Socialist/Marxist, twenty-five percent are Constitutionalist/Capitalist, and fifty percent don't have any clue what they are talking about. However, the talk about there being no proof of a socialist agenda is ridiculous. I don't know how much more people could ignore the facts.

Go to any of the Occupy Facebook pages and look for a schedule of events for today, the day before, or even tomorrow. Take a good hard look at the topics up for discussion on these schedule - Socialism 101, Marxism in the Modern World, movies reviews on Communist documentaries, Death to Capitalism, this list goes on and on and on and on. Ignorance is shown by those who deny such blatant truths.

People seem to have it completely reversed. The socialists represented are majority and the leadership behind these movements, and the "End the Fed" guys, the Ron Paul supporters, and the true Constitutionalist free market protectors, are few and far between, displaying themselves here and there so that people feel better about their choice to support this movement. I have talked to people involved, and if there is a large majority of true Patriots out there, they sure as hell are keeping themselves quiet and invisible.


No, I do not "fear" change, I resent this change. Why? Because socialism in practice puts a limit on the liberty and freedom I have as an individual. Socialistic healthcare, monetary funds like social security, social welfare programs - ALL LIMIT MY INDIVIDUALITY AS A HUMAN BEING.

In America, it used to be that everyone started off with a fair chance to be something, anything if they really wanted to. As time went by, that window closed with every effort government made to protect and foster larger corporations. Thus the America Dream died. This wasn't the fault of banks or corporations - this was the fault of the people for turning a blind eye on their governments and allowing them to do whatever they felt like.

Now the people finally see a chance to open their eyes and take back all the years of passively accepting what was given to them, and instead of focusing on the government that enforced all these problems, they turn against the very people that at one time were just as equal as them, and did nothing more than take advantage of an already broken system. Sure, the corporations and those in charge obviously have no moral code, but that is the beauty of a free America - morals aren't necessary. You can't FORCE someone to be ethical and moral and still maintain a free society. The only thing you can do is make the choice to ignore them and not give them business. Too bad the people this past century have been too STUPID to do that.


I defend freedom and liberty. Why? Because this country was founded on those ideals, thrived on those ideals, and became the GREATEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD based on those ideals. Not on socialism. Countries with socialism "get by", they don't thrive. They don't support the kind of environment that America had in the 20th century that led to a completely new world of technological advancement and luxury.

Change will not come in the form of socialism and Marxism in this country. Why? Because we have at the very least TASTED freedom, and now there are those that will not part with it, not until death. There will be change in this country, as it is reverted back to a true free market, there is brought an end to crony Capitalism, freedom is restored, social welfare becomes a responsibility of the community, not government, and the Tree of Liberty is watered with the blood of patriots and tyrants.

Liberty and freedom will be restored through the barrel of a gun, and it will be defended that way as well.

I do not care for the change being brought by the Marxist Obama, the ultimate change agent POTUS. The OWS movement may have some valid points and issues but is being spurred and supported by the change agent for communism Obama and his Master Komrade Soros. That is why I cannot support OWS. There are too many communists and socialists who want to fundamentally transform our nation and our Constitution. I was told by someone last night that I must be sinister because I called it like I see it, the OWS is talking about writing their own Constitution. Knowing what we know about the Marxist POTUS, why would anyone who values freedom and liberty be on board with that?

And yet I know that there is corruption in the financial sector, but Obama is nationalizing it and I think this OWS movement is what he will use to bring that nationization, and he will say he has the support of "the People".

reply to post by sheepslayer247


Of course people are scared, and probably the main reason is, is because change leads us into the unknown. However, in the end, it has to be a risk that we are willing to take.

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


The American propaganda is so high amongst Communists that people disgrace Communism without actually knowing what it is.

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


I think it's dishonest to say that Obama has anything to do with the OWS movement. If anything, Obama has tried to use OWS as a way to get some of his voters back, but OWS has made it quite clear that they do not support him.

I also find it dishonest to say that OWS is a communist, Marxist movement. Sure there have been people saying things and handing out papers for such causes, but that is not the majority of OWS. At my local Occupy, there was people handing our Corsi pamphlets and excerpts from Tea Party ideals. Who;s to say that is any better.

Both sides see the power of OWS and are trying to co-opt it for their benefit. So to say they are strictly leftist is dishonest.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


The Socialist Party USA endorses the Occupy Wall Street Movement.
socialistparty-usa.org...

The Socialist Party USA supports the mobilizations to occupy Wall St. in New York and various cities across the US and encourages our locals to take part in these actions.

House Democrats Endorse Occupy Wall Street
dailycaller.com...

The Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee (DCCC) — the campaign arm of the House Democrats — sent out an email Monday morning urging readers to sign a petition supporting the growing “Occupy Wall Street” protests.

The email, titled “@Stake: Occupy Wall Street,” said, “Protestors are assembling in New York and around the country to let billionaires, big oil and big bankers know that we’re not going to let the richest 1% force draconian economic policies and massive cuts to crucial programs on Main Street Americans.”

Read more: dailycaller.com...

American Nazi Party Endorses Occupy Wall Street
anp14.com...

ANP Report for October 16, 2011

Racial Comrades: I am going to address the issue of this "Occupy Wall Street" fervor that has been sweeping the land like a breath of cleansing air!

THE NATIVES ARE GETTING RESTLESS, AND ZOG FEARS IT MIGHT HAVE A POPULAR UPRISING ON ITS HANDS - finally!

This issue is TAYLOR MADE for National Socialists, as well as WN who are serious about DOING SOMETHING - MORE - than shouting "racial slurs" and acting like "poster boys of hate" loons.

After all - JUST WHO - are the WALL STREET BANKERS? The vast majority are JEWS - and the others are SPIRITUAL JEW materialists, who would sell their own mother's gold teeth for a PROFIT. And MORE and MORE people are AWARE of this truth, are not only NOT afraid to TALK ABOUT IT - they're shouting it on WALL STREET!

I urgently URGE all of you to TAKE PART and JOIN IN when these protests hit your neck of the woods. Produce some flyers EXPLAINING the "JEW BANKER" influence - DON'T wear anything marking you as an "evil racist" - and GET OUT THERE and SPREAD the WORD! Put as a "contact point" on your literature, our www.ANP14.com address - it won't immediately "scare off" some of these scaredy-cats for even looking at our FACTS - for FACTS they ARE!

If you are unable to produce your own leaflets - check out the "support" section of our website - there are a LOT of good flyers there to utilize.

This issue reminds me a LOT of the "GASOLINE SHORTAGE" of the 1970's - where National Socialists found a HUGE receptive audience, for our viewpoints - per the JEWISH CONTROL of OUR GOVERNMENT and its insane support for Zionist Israel, and the Arab Oil Boycott that hit OUR people so hard.

As I have so often in the past spoke on - the White Working Class - is going PAST, the BOILING POINT, and is quickly reaching ULTIMATE EXPLOSION! THEY want ANSWERS! THEY want RESULTS! All of which this evil corrupt, decadent JUDEO-CAPITALIST SYSTEM is incapable of giving them. WHY? Because its BOUGHT and SOLD to the CORPORATE ELITISTS who are fast turning America into a "South American" style - THIRD WORLD WAGE-SLAVE STATE - ( complete with MILLIONS of BROWN illegal aliens willing to ACCEPT YOUR JOB for LOW WAGES and NO BENEFITS ) where, currently 3% of the population CONTROL 85% of the nation’s WEALTH! And the "GREAT DIVIDE" is GROWING each and every year that passes.

WE - the WHITE WORKING CLASS - have been LIED TO and totally DECIEVED - just the other day, the system APPROVED THREE MORE so-called "Free-Trade" deals. ALL of which mean that MORE JOBS are going to be SENT OVERSEAS - YOUR JOBS! Don't you CARE? Enough to DO SOMETHING?

NOW is the TIME! GET INVOLVED! IT’S YOUR FUTURE THAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT.

YOU can DO - ONE of TWO THINGS - SUBMIT to the uncaring GREED of these CORORATE, WALL STREET THUGS and their SOCK-PUPPETS in GOVERNMENT. OR, - YOU can RESIST! I CHOOSE RESISTANCE for MY FAMILY and MYSELF!

reply to post by sheepslayer247


SEIU Organizer Plans to Terrorize Families of Wall Street Executives

askmarion.wordpress.com...

SEIU organizer Stephen Lerner laid out his plan to terrorize the families of Wall Street executives. Here he is in his own words, calling for violence at a conference that took place on October 3, 2011. I wonder if he’s behind the death threats against successful New Yorkers.

Via Matthew Vadum who points out that Obama’s ACORN is still alive and well in America.
Americans need to know that ACORN is restructuring in time to help re-elect President Obama in 2012. Obama used to work for ACORN and represented the group in court as its lawyer. These radical leftists who use the brutal, in-your-face, pressure tactics of Saul Alinsky want to destroy America as we know it and will use any means to do it.

The Communist Party USA endorses Occupy Wall Street
www.cpusa.org...

This is an exciting time! Thousands of mainly young people have been occupying Wall Street for three weeks already, and the “Occupy Movement” has spread to more than 200 other cities. On Oct. 6 the actions spread to our nation’s capital.

Obama endorses Occupy Wall Street
www.forextv.com...

In a stunning, but not totally unexpected statement, President Obama tacitly endorsed the violent protests of the Anti Wall Street movement.

"I think people are frustrated and the protesters are giving voice to a more broad-based suspicion about how our financial system works," Obama told reporters in a televised speech that was carried live on ForexTV.com.

Obama used the anger and violence of the protests to gain political cover for the devastating effects of the Dodd-Frank regulations on financial institutions. Dodd-Frank has been criticized by many banks and financial institutions as being anti-growth and too restrictive.

reply to post by thehoneycomb


That's a lot of information and I think it's important that people read what you provided.

What you need to understand is that anyone can endore OWS if they so choose, but OWS has not endorsed these particular groups.

As an example: If NAMBLA came out and endorsed the Republican Party does that mean the Republican Party are a bunch of child molestors? That is the line of thinking you are using towards OWS.

It is dishonest and wrong.

Like I said before, if OWS is the one endorsing these groups I will be right at your side screaming to high heaven. Until then we need to realize that OWS has no control over who endorses them

Originally posted by Unvarnished
reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

 

The American propaganda is so high amongst Communists that people disgrace Communism without actually knowing what it is.

No; there is no use arguing semantics or textbook class room definitions

Plenty of people alive today have seen first hand the inevitable result of "communism".It's universally "bad"for anybody not occupying high party positions.
Don't give me that: "well that's notreal communism" b.s.!

Great,great thread OP!
People are afraid,that's it!
We must help them understand that the current and the keeping the way it is,is what they should be afraid.
We've been ruled by SCUM and don't matter what party is gonna win the election it will stay the same.
Don't forget mother earth and the environment,we are killing them thus killing ourselves.