New ATS Survey: Occupy Wall Street

I wish you would have asked if the movement was an "owned controlled opposition"! It would be nice to clarify why one would think it to be a boon. I respect and understand the intents of the protesters.....and I think they're being exploited. It's 2 separate issues.

Originally posted by rabidrabbit

Have you ever considered that the way you 'got wind of it' might have been intentionally diluting and confusing the message? You seem overly intent upon maligning a 'movement' that you say you know little about.

I first caught the scent at ATS, so I doubt it was all that intentionally diluted. Since then, I've researched it across the internet. So far, I've not found any focus or direction, but I HAVE found disturbing indications of the inception of the "movement". I hesitate to call it that, as "movement" generally implies a direction that movement is heading towards, and I find none in this protest.

Why move at all if all you're doing is going in circles?

I've recently been apprised that the initial floundering attempt at organization locally has been resurrected, so that's where I'll have to concentrate more of my own focus at this point.

Originally posted by neo96
already know how that survey is going to turn out theres nothing new there same things i have been reading for over a year on here.

government has zero blame wall street is evil and we want our "Free stuff" same thing the current potus campaigned on.

theres not one original thought among that crowd.

Wow. I remember people saying the same unfair, broad generalizations about the Tea Party, at least until it was co-opted by corporate America.

If you haven't been down in 'the crowd' how can you claim to know what they all think?

I don't think you would find a single person down there who would say anything close to 'government has zero blame'

You should really go outside and challenge your assumptions more often.

reply to post by rabidrabbit


really now then why arent they protesting the people who make and write and enforce the laws.

i live in the real world dont get my information for the internet like all those folks have.

the only thing ows is showing is the abismal failure of the us educational system of america

Originally posted by rabidrabbit

Originally posted by neo96
already know how that survey is going to turn out theres nothing new there same things i have been reading for over a year on here.

government has zero blame wall street is evil and we want our "Free stuff" same thing the current potus campaigned on.

theres not one original thought among that crowd.

Wow. I remember people saying the same unfair, broad generalizations about the Tea Party, at least until it was co-opted by corporate America.

Seriously? You heard someone saying that the tea party assigned zero blame to the government, and that they wanted "free stuff"?

Where did you hear that?

reply to post by RainbeauBleu


It's not NY, but I'm heading into Boston to check out the protest here. I'll look for any types of sponsorships, any influences going on, varying messages, the signs, the "type" of people, the police presence... I'm charging my camera now, it's got video as well, I can't find my tape recorder, but maybe I'll just capture it all on video for accuracy... this is my Friday night. Be back later, or will post tomorrow when I get up.

Edit: I'm on the fence, so I'll be unbiased in interviewing but I'll be looking through an ATS-type lens. And, trust me, I am fully aware of the varying standpoints about this movement from members here.


Edit: 8:42 EST, heading out. Laters.

Great survey team, can't wait to see the results.

The only thing that violence understands and respects is equal or greater violence.

Police officers "following orders" are and will continue to bring this to a violent end. Police officers are "not" burdened under oath to follow orders but to support and defend the Constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic. That includes defending the rights of Americans to assemble and voice their grievances. Kennedy himself said "when you take away the peoples right to peaceful revolution you then make violent revolution inevitable."

Agree with the message (whatever it might be) or disagree with it, it is of little importance. What is of great importance is that they have a right, and oath burdened defenders of the Constitution have a duty to defend that right.

Originally posted by Jason88
reply to post by RainbeauBleu

 

It's not NY, but I'm heading into Boston to check out the protest here. I'll look for any types of sponsorships, any influences going on, varying messages, the signs, the "type" of people, the police presence... I'm charging my camera now, it's got video as well, I can't find my tape recorder, but maybe I'll just capture it all on video for accuracy... this is my Friday night. Be back later, or will post tomorrow when I get up.

That's wonderful! I have a friend, armed with videocamera and enormous people skills who is leaving for NY tomorrow. Be safe and fill us in!!

reply to post by nenothtu


No, I am saying I saw the same type of unfair characterizations and broad generalizations. The superficial talking points change, but the approach is the same-malign, smear and insinuate without ever addressing any of the more articulate or legitimate concerns.

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by rabidrabbit

 

really now then why arent they protesting the people who make and write and enforce the laws.

What makes you think they aren't?

i live in the real world dont get my information for the internet like all those folks have.

I see. And yet you can dismiss thousands of people, via the internet, who you have not interacted with in the 'real world' ?

the only thing ows is showing is the abismal failure of the us educational system of america

I remember such ad hominem attacks from the liberals about the 'tea party'. I found them distasteful as well.

(Also, when criticizing the education system, you might want to spell "Abysmal" correctly. )

reply to post by rabidrabbit


Fair enough

Can you point out what any of the more articulate or legitimate concerns ARE in this protest?

reply to post by rabidrabbit


Fair enough

Can you point out what any of the more articulate or legitimate concerns ARE in this protest?

The ones I'm catching are entirely dependent on which direction my ears or eyes are aimed at the moment.

There seems to be one basic, underlying and inarticulated sentiment, but nothing that can really be debated or acted upon. I'm expecting that "demands" will crawl out of the woodwork some time on down the road, and that the main focus right now is getting a lot of ticked off people all gathered in one place, and the "directors" for lack of a better term, seem not to care what it is those people are ticked off about so much as that they can gather a ticked off crowd to be given direction later.

reply to post by rabidrabbit


protesting new york and where are laws written.

and spelling? please typing some people havent sit their whole lives in front of a computer but hey lets make a big deal out of my typing skills.

its not like this country has bigger problems but nope lets talk about typing.

Originally posted by nenothtu
reply to post by rabidrabbit

 

Fair enough

Can you point out what any of the more articulate or legitimate concerns ARE in this protest?

Certainly. Although I have to wonder if you are feigning ignorance.

Repeal NAFTA. Hold Banks accountable to financial regulations. End corporate bailouts. End the Military Industrial Complex. Stop money from controlling political parties. These are all issues being expressed by people down there.

These are but a few. Now, I could also find examples of idiots talking about the price of Brocolli or free education for everyone. But I tend to think the media likes to focus on those people for the same reason they focus on the idiots and rednecks at tea party rallies.



reply to post by neo96


Why are you ignoring the bulk of my post in favor of harping over a typo? Strawman? deflection?

Originally posted by rabidrabbit


Certainly. Although I have to wonder if you are feigning ignorance.

I assure you that any ignorance I have is real, honest, concrete ignorance - not feigned in the least. I seriously haven't found any of these gripes listed anywhere at their websites. All I've found for the most part are 1960's catch phrases.

Repeal NAFTA. Hold Banks accountable to financial regulations. End corporate bailouts. End the Military Industrial Complex. Stop money from controlling political parties. These are all issues being expressed by people down there.

I could agree with some of those sentiments - but why are they aiming them at Wall Street? Government holds the reins of NAFTA, accountability to regulations, corporate bailouts, monetary control of political parties, etc. Do they really expect Wall Street to cut it's own throat in those areas just because there are some people standing in the street and shivering?

Seems to me that it ought to be aimed at DC, or the state capitols locally, .if they really expect results that are effective, rather than just hoping to gather sympathy from the "police brutality" in an unrelated and impotent area.

reply to post by rabidrabbit

Originally posted by mishigas
This question struck me as a non sequitir:

"I believe everyone deserves the right to a free and high-quality education, including the first four years of college."

Colleges are bastions of liberalism, so there is a hidden agenda here....

Not the college I went to.

Or are you implying facts favor a certain political ideology?

There are some excellent colleges, such as Hillsdale. But what I'm referring to are the many reports we get of the colleges that employ the Ward Churchills of society. And the Harvards, and other liberal outposts. The Columbia's. Those places where capitalism is scorned and accused of being the cause of the world's problems.

There are colleges that are apolitical, to be sure. But the majority have a liberal bent when it comes to politics and culture.

Originally posted by nenothtu

I could agree with some of those sentiments - but why are they aiming them at Wall Street? Government holds the reins of NAFTA, accountability to regulations, corporate bailouts, monetary control of political parties, etc. Do they really expect Wall Street to cut it's own throat in those areas just because there are some people standing in the street and shivering?

Don't you believe Wall Street are the ones really calling the shots? Why are you so interested in maligning a protest you admit to not knowing much about?

Why shouldnt they be protesting on Wall Street? Also, people are ALSO protesting in DC. It's not an either/or. And all over. It seems like you are desperately trying to malign a group that you might very well have much in common with.

reply to post by rabidrabbit

Originally posted by nenothtu
reply to post by rabidrabbit


Fair enough

Can you point out what any of the more articulate or legitimate concerns ARE in this protest?

Certainly. Although I have to wonder if you are feigning ignorance.

Repeal NAFTA. Hold Banks accountable to financial regulations. End corporate bailouts. End the Military Industrial Complex. Stop money from controlling political parties. These are all issues being expressed by people down there.

These are but a few. Now, I could also find examples of idiots talking about the price of Brocolli or free education for everyone. But I tend to think the media likes to focus on those people for the same reason they focus on the idiots and rednecks at tea party rallies.

It doesn't sound like he is feigning ignorance to me. I don't think there are many people who could list why OWS is down there. The shopping list you supplied seems desperately catch-all.

It seems to me that the OWS is Obama's desperate version of the Tea Party Movement. He has even infused unions into some of these gatherings. But it is a poor, pathetic attempt at a copy of the TPM; and will not help him to win the election in 2012.

reply to post by cerebralassassins


Good point and one I took when responding to the survey.

Tried to look into my crystal ball to see what the future holds, but the connection is down...again.

reply to post by Druid42


I went to the OWS rally in Cleveland, it was very different from what I saw on Livestream in New York. Of course, they didn't have the numbers like NY did, but it was a pretty cool experiance nonetheless. I'm gonna keep a eye on it here and see where it leads.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

But I have to get my head out of my butt and figure out how to shrink my photos so I can post them.