Video of Michael Hess trapped in WTC7, before it collapsed due to "fire"

In reply to you ThaLoccster - I'm not interested in bickering about your beliefs being more accurate than mine or anyone elses, that's why I refused to engage with Oldave and I'm on the verge of ignoring you for the same reason.

Have I said that Barrys account of what he saw is the gospel truth. No?
Have I said that Mr Hess is an outright liar? No?

Have I said that the interview Mr Hess gave to the BBC, retracting his claim of any explosions in WTC7 differs significantly enough from both their original accounts to infer one of those individuals is lying? Yes.

Have you said that in referrence to Barry Jennings (in your own words) "that his story is infact erroneous" and "I have shown in this thread how his story cannot be true" Yes
Could this be perceived as posting in the same religionistic vain that a vast number of truthers and official story believers do? Potentially.
Are you on a one man crusade to rubbish anyone who dares to raise an air of suspiscion in a public forum?
I'll leave that one for everyone else to decide.

Originally posted by skunkmunky
In reply to you ThaLoccster - I'm not interested in bickering about your beliefs being more accurate than mine or anyone elses, that's why I refused to engage with Oldave and I'm on the verge of ignoring you for the same reason.

Have I said that Barrys account of what he saw is the gospel truth. No?
Have I said that Mr Hess is an outright liar? No?

Have I said that the interview Mr Hess gave to the BBC, retracting his claim of any explosions in WTC7 differs significantly enough from both their original accounts to infer one of those individuals is lying? Yes.

Have you said that in referrence to Barry Jennings (in your own words) "that his story is infact erroneous" and "I have shown in this thread how his story cannot be true" Yes
Could this be perceived as posting in the same religionistic vain that a vast number of truthers and official story believers do? Potentially.
Are you on a one man crusade to rubbish anyone who dares to raise an air of suspiscion in a public forum?
I'll leave that one for everyone else to decide.

I'm not pushing my beliefs, I'm merely relaying the accounts of people who have a far different account of the events than the one you are relaying.

If you would like to ignore me, feel free to.

As I said before in regards to Mr. Hess "changing" his story, I honestly do not know what his original story was, or what he "changed" it to. But it is likely that he examined the events and took into context the events that happened (the collapses) and was able to understand what happened in light of the context. In the chaos of the day I'm sure it was hard to understand what exactly had taken place, after understanding what had taken place, it made what he went through more understandable.

I'm not on a crusade to "rubbish" anyone's suspicions. There is a difference between having suspicions and pushing fallacies.

I do not understand the inherent suspicion simply because he clarified or changed his story.

By the time they experienced what they did, it was probably clear to them that the ongoing events were not a mere accident but were some kind of an attack. A massive BOOM followed by fire and destruction may have in fact seemed like an explosion. Does that mean it was? Not at all. A few tons of steel crashing into your building would likely create the same exact BOOM, fire, and subsequent destruction. It is possible that there was an explosion, at face value sure. In light of the accounts from the others who were present in the building, and the context of the events that were taking place, is it likely, not at all.

Barry reported an explosion before the towers fell and also reported hearing several further explosions.

I present this next video with an air of speculation. Could this chap have been spot on at the beginning of the vid when he's on the phone to his wife. He suspects he's seeing and hearing an explosion at the base of potentially one of the federal buildings.



Also, and this is also purely speculation, could the fireman at the end of this video be on his way to rescue the fireman sent in to find Mr Hess and Barry.

reply to post by uggghhh

.thanks for taking the time to reply...
im kinda trying to figure out what went on before all that... was he in the building before it caught fire? before the fire alarms went off and they started to evacuate the building? if so what floor was he on? why he would go up to the 23rd in a a burning building, especially in an elevator, clearly stairs are the things to used in a fire situation... what time did he place his call? their must be a record of that at least..... i know its not the meat and potatoes of his story, something doesn't feel right about the story, to me anyways... i just know what i would do in a fire.... jumping into the elevator and heading up to the fire isnt one of them...
.

Timeline for WTC 7

8:47 Tower 1 hit by American 11

9:03 Tower 2 hit by United 175

~ 9:30 WTC 7 evacuated do to concerns that additional aircraft are inbound

Hess and Jennings arrived sometime after 9:30 AM and go to 23th floor OEM headquarters. Find it empty

Jennings answers phone and finds that OEM has been evacuated, told to leave starts to leave by stairway

9:59 Tower 2 collapses, showers lobby of WTC 7 with debris smashing windows and triggering fire alarm

10:28 Tower 1 collapses, debris from it smashes into south face of WTC 7 causing extensive damage and
starting numerous fires

Jennings and Hess are in stairway on 6th floor when debris smashes stairs beneath them forcing them to go
back up to find other escape route

Hess arrived in building after OEM evacuated and before first collapse. It was 2nd collapse the destroyed the
stairs and trapped them in building , Fires werer started by debris by 2 nd collapse

Watch BBC documentary which lays out events

video.google.ca...

Starts about 7 minutes in

reply to post by skunkmunky

Also, and this is also purely speculation, could the fireman at the end of this video be on his way to rescue the fireman sent in to find Mr Hess and Barry.

It was procedure to search the building (WTC 7) to ensure that nobody was left there

Would not believe how many will remain in a building thay is on fire and been evacuated. In my town (belong to
local FD) had a fire in an office tower (9 stories). Literally had to kick people out of the upper floors - would
complain "OH I have too much work to do,,,," This in a building where fire alarm blaring and smoke filling lower
floors from dumpster fire on loading dock ,,,,

FDNY would have sent crews to search the floors and insure nobody left. Unknown exactly what time search
began - would depend on manpower . Concerns would have been to clear WTC 1 and 2 first, along with WTC 3
(Marriott Hotel) between the towers, 40 FDNY men were killed in Marriott when crushed by collapse of WTC 2
and then by WTC 1

Know that by 11:00 am FDNY had crews inside WTC 7 searching building, inspecting condition of building and
trying to fight some of the fires It was here that FDNY men found Hess/Jennings and took them out

After 12:00 pm decision made by FDNY to abandon WTC 7 and remove all crews from inside as material
condition of building was suspect and no water was available to fight the fires

Originally posted by ThaLoccster

Originally posted by 4hero
To all those people that seem to think the collapse of the towers/fires caused building 7 to collapse, symmetrically, into it's own footprint at freefall speed... What about the FACT that no fire has EVER made a steel framed building collapse, yet on 9/11 there was a world 1st, three times in one day!

Does this very fact not raise alarm bells? I'd love to hear your explanations!

Does the fact that you make false claims raise any alarm bells?

As I understand it, the collapse was due to a combination of structural damage caused by falling debris and resulting damage from the fires. The modifications made to the building also were said to have compromised the integrity in light of the damage caused.

While many may or may not agree with that assertation, claiming that the buildings collapsed into their own footprint at freefall speed because of fire is just plain false.

The same holds true for the towers themselves. You can retract your claim that fire alone caused 3 buildings to fall that day. That is just not the case. The official stance is structural damage exacerbated by the fires caused the collapse.

edit on 10/12/2011 by ThaLoccster because: (no reason given)

False claims? How am I making a false claim? I didn't say fires alone cause it, re-read what I wrote and then you might realise you've made a reply without correctly reading what I wrote. Anyway, alarm bells should ring in your mind when you see a building come down in that way because to collapse symmetrically at freefall speed into it's own footprint would require carefully timed explosives, surely that is obvious?

OP, sorry if you think it's off topic but it's about building 7 and that ties in with your post in one way or another. I didn't realise we were not allowed to expand on things!

Originally posted by 4hero
What about the FACT that no fire has EVER made a steel framed building collapse, yet on 9/11 there was a world 1st, three times in one day!

Originally posted by 4hero

False claims? How am I making a false claim? I didn't say fires alone cause it, re-read what I wrote and then you might realise you've made a reply without correctly reading what I wrote. Anyway, alarm bells should ring in your mind when you see a building come down in that way because to collapse symmetrically at freefall speed into it's own footprint would require carefully timed explosives, surely that is obvious?

OP, sorry if you think it's off topic but it's about building 7 and that ties in with your post in one way or another. I didn't realise we were not allowed to expand on things!

You say right there, that fire caused 3 buildings to collapse. What am I missing?

It does seem like you made two claims in the same post, one that the collapse/fire couldn't have caused building 7 to collapse, then another saying that fire caused 3 buildings to collapse.

Nonetheless, this thread is in regards to the claims made by Barry Jennings and Michael Hess, there are other threads where you can discuss the irregularities of the collapse. I believe that is what he may have been referring to.