Answering Questions At The Gate

God created all things GOOD and EVIL. It's in the bible (not a good documentary). Given that fact (if you are religious), then you must give up some of your thinking about what God is.

There is a reason for everything. Let God stay in control and quit questioning everything.

If your not religious.....please find some spirituality. God or the God consciousness does in fact exist. This Darwinism stuff is so backwards, it's difficult to believe.

There is no way in hell that the human DNA/RNA developed in such a short time. Human DNA has had to take at least a few billion years long to make us what we are from a single cell organism.

Almost impossible from my point of view. It does not fit in from Pangea to our current worldly state. A near impossibility.

reply to post by mathematic

I hear you, and agree.

Just thinking though that the morally guarded entrance to the afterlife is an archetype in many myths.
I recall seeing a documentary on the Egyptian Book of the Dead where a person's heart was morally weighed on a scale.

reply to post by mathematic


I guess what I am saying is I understand completely what OP is expressing, if I have it right: we are what we are created to be and damned for it eternally, regardless of our best intentions. But why put our "sins" down to such a low common denominator as stealing a cookie, or stealing smoke? I think the OP is right, and these were the circumstances we were dealt. However, I think our sacrifices, of integrity and the duality required of us t survive, were far greater than cookies or Internet porn. I think many of us wanted to do what was required, but have been held hostage by what we so desperately and rightly cared for, such as the future of our progeny.
In other words, once you have a child, you will do almost anything, perhaps anything at all, to save that life, won't you, even if it means being damned yourself.

reply to post by brilab45


I'm not doubting the existence of a supreme ALL BEING creator. But religion accepts there to be one, uncreated. Yet, if an omnipotent omnipresent being had to be created, wouldn't that being have to experience everything? Kind of like this universe?

We can't assume we just are, so we assume God just IS. Take a step back, assume God isn't just born everything. Ok, not born, just is. Religion doesn't answer my questions. I post in this forum for answers, and I get Bible verses. I can read the Bible. If I didn't know it was written by over 90 different men over the span of decades and edited by monarchs I might buy into it, but I can't.

I want to have a belief. But I need truth. Buying into your parent's religion to me is a cop out. You need to seek to know truth.

reply to post by mathematic


And I hope I was lucid enogh for you. I appreciate you wish to know my thoughts. You did not denigrate me....and yes, my vodka consumption has surpassed everyones. Unfortunately, it is what I must do to have peace of mind.....that we will all one day have true peace and know what is the truth, and.it will not be what false circumstances we were put into that denigrate all of us.

reply to post by tetra50

Much truth, and yet we find historical texts that speak of times so bad that people ate their own children.
I recently saw a documentary on what made the Egyptians (of the old kingdom) fall, and that metaphor is used.
I think it's even in the Bible somewhere too: a curse of hunger will drive a mother to eat her child.
Without food the beast comes out of men and animals.
Food and food security is actually the great pacifier that keeps us relatively civilized.
Without that you can forget all religion and moralism.

reply to post by tetra50


Tetra are you religious or spiritual? You seek truth.

reply to post by mathematic


Please be aware, I did not buy into my parents beliefs. My beliefs are my own and wholly my own. And certainly, I am not asking anyone to buy into my belief system. Please be yourself by all means. I was merely stating "me".

Peace.

Originally posted by brilab45
God created all things GOOD and EVIL. It's in the bible (not a good documentary). Given that fact (if you are religious), then you must give up some of your thinking about what God is.

There is a reason for everything. Let God stay in control and quit questioning everything.

If your not religious.....please find some spirituality. God or the God consciousness does in fact exist. This Darwinism stuff is so backwards, it's difficult to believe.

There is no way in hell that the human DNA/RNA developed in such a short time. Human DNA has had to take at least a few billion years long to make us what we are from a single cell organism.

Almost impossible from my point of view. It does not fit in from Pangea to our current worldly state. A near impossibility.

It's unclear what side you're taking. You seem to pass off the Bible, yet trust it's Word. I believe some intelligent force created the laws of the physical universe, however I believe that being is much more than our earthly presence.

I seek spirituality. Not from someone who learned it at Hebrew school, or some religious indoctrination. I need to find it within. Man betrayed me. I CANNOT believe man. I seek from within. Within I can find truth, because outside of me I cannot trust what I find.

reply to post by halfoldman


Very salient point. Especially inl light of the line of thinking the OP introduced, with the nature of being a victim of our circumstances, given a certain "morality" and expected to keep our integrity, which is how I perceive the thread. However, I think we live in a "test,".....within what I believe to be what righteousness and god is, this is the only way I can perceive our current circumstances, and still keep my integrity and faith......
Lets say our creator required us to seek nutrition for survival, and we are left nothing but pur progeny for that....
This brings up an interesting question, for if you did not want your progeny to suffer that, but yet, wanted life to survive, what would you then do....especially if you wished for all to survive and know there was a different way, and needed to show what was happening,,

I am not trying to say that what is aberrant to all of us is acceptable; for this horror is not. But I think we have been warned of times which are so upside down, and aberrant to us al, as human beings, lest not we judge easily or discern incorrectly, because of the circumstances that a situation so evil could confront us with.....

These are complex times and very complex questions, and I think you will find that the considerance of what we confront is so difficult and heinous that being the slightest bit honest about it even is a challenge, to simply admit what we have let take place already, so that we cannot stop the progression of what has already been in motion for so very long

reply to post by halfoldman


Very salient point. Especially inl light of the line of thinking the OP introduced, with the nature of being a victim of our circumstances, given a certain "morality" and expected to keep our integrity, which is how I perceive the thread. However, I think we live in a "test,".....within what I believe to be what righteousness and god is, this is the only way I can perceive our current circumstances, and still keep my integrity and faith......
Lets say our creator required us to seek nutrition for survival, and we are left nothing but pur progeny for that....
This brings up an interesting question, for if you did not want your progeny to suffer that, but yet, wanted life to survive, what would you then do....especially if you wished for all to survive and know there was a different way, and needed to show what was happening,,

I am not trying to say that what is aberrant to all of us is acceptable; for this horror is not. But I think we have been warned of times which are so upside down, and aberrant to us al, as human beings, lest not we judge easily or discern incorrectly, because of the circumstances that a situation so evil could confront us with.....

These are complex times and very complex questions, and I think you will find that the considerance of what we confront is so difficult and heinous that being the slightest bit honest about it even is a challenge, to simply admit what we have let take place already, so that we cannot stop the progression of what has already been in motion for so very long

reply to post by mathematic


Most of my belief is based on guilt of my upbringing. However, I have separated from the belief system of my childhood. Good eye OP.

I'm all about spiritualism and humanism. My true belief is that if we can not treat other human beings with the utmost respect, then we simply are not worthy of God.

God in my belief, is a building block builder. Love yourselves first and build up to a higher loving being.

How can we love God first..........We don't even know what God is! Start at the level we know first and grow outwards is my belief.

reply to post by mathematic


I do not know how to define mysef in those terms. There was a time when i would have said spiritual, because I so rejected the religious for the damage I saw that it caused. And yet, spiritual does not describe what I identify with, either, because even that term, I think, has been so misused.....
I do not have a word, and I saw tonight a thread in which someone defined truth as being so relative to perception I was shaken at my core over it.,,... If truth is so relative, I find the world a place I cannot hope to exist, and this, my friend, is why vodka has become such a comfort....and yet, really, no comfort at all, just a panacea, for the purposes of sleep, if nothing more

Originally posted by tetra50
reply to post by mathematic

 

I do not know how to define mysef in those terms. There was a time when i would have said spiritual, because I so rejected the religious for the damage I saw that it caused. And yet, spiritual does not describe what I identify with, either, because even that term, I think, has been so misused.....
I do not have a word, and I saw tonight a thread in which someone defined truth as being so relative to perception I was shaken at my core over it.,,... If truth is so relative, I find the world a place I cannot hope to exist, and this, my friend, is why vodka has become such a comfort....and yet, really, no comfort at all, just a panacea, for the purposes of sleep, if nothing more

Tetra,

I find it hard to believe you rely that much on the bottle since you are still holding a coherent, and intelligent conversation. I think you may find yourself in a bit of a hard place in life, a slight depression. You seem like quite an intelligent woman and are probably speaking from the glass, yet the heart too.

You are a new user here, yet wise enough to know you cannot find truth on ATS. You find intelligent discussion, conspiracy, off the wall stuff here. I know you know, you won't find your truth on the bottom of the bottle. It's in your heart and in your head. You're a brilliant woman.

reply to post by tetra50

Perhaps "truth" is not a destination but a journey.
Perhaps there is no "truth" that will satisfy the seeker, there is only the search for truth, which is always noble.

I recall an African myth of the hunter who went to find the great bird of truth.
After crossing many lands and climbing treacherous mountains he found one feather.
But that was OK.
It was more than most hunters had ever found of that elusive bird.

Originally posted by brilab45
reply to post by mathematic

 

Most of my belief is based on guilt of my upbringing. However, I have separated from the belief system of my childhood. Good eye OP.

I'm all about spiritualism and humanism. My true belief is that if we can not treat other human beings with the utmost respect, then we simply are not worthy of God.

God in my belief, is a building block builder. Love yourselves first and build up to a higher loving being.

How can we love God first..........We don't even know what God is! Start at the level we know first and grow outwards is my belief.

We're not that far apart. Seek within, it's all that you know is true. Based off that building block, I can step on yours. We seek the same. I enjoy your input.

reply to post by mathematic


Your reply means a great deal to me Mathematic. Thank you. I will enjoy seeing you around. You are a good human being.

It is always comforting to me to know others are seeking truth. I was a pastor for many years but became discouraged by what I saw and experienced. Currently I am trying to live more surrendered to the idea of just living life with those around me. I seem to be crossing peoples paths that I have the honor of participating in dialog. Communication from the heart. It has been an amazing experience. I agree with others that it is an inward search but finds expression in caring for others. Don't give up! I am glad to meet you all and look forward to more communication.

reply to post by mathematic
[
Thank you for your kind words, and I enjoyed the proverb, halfoldman.
2nd

Seriously,

i don't think you are "going to hell" because you are smoking, drinking beer or stole a cookie as a baby.
Even that example with the drunk driving and killing, it's horrible...yes, but there was no intention.

I don't think that god or St. Peter or whoever would bother with such stuff...i actually think it's kind of a shame that religions try to distract from the real issues ("What makes a human REALLY a good/bad human?" etc..) and instead want to induce guilt for rather, silly things.

In other words: So, let's say a person does not smoke and drink, he doesn't gamble and all those "alleged" evil things...does this automatically make him a good person?

I really think the heaven has better quality standards to decide and to "judge".

I'm all about spiritualism and humanism. My true belief is that if we can not treat other human beings with the utmost respect, then we simply are not worthy of God.

Yes, i just wanted to mention..RESPECT might play a huge role. Humanism