The Lost Tribe Of Israel, Gad's Tribe perhaps the native americans?

reply to post by Hanslune


Welcome to rapid climate change.

Earth's climate has gone through exceptionally fast cycles in the last 60k years.

Something to do with the part of cosmos, that the solar system is travelling in.

It would be more convincing to me if the Native Americans had more oral history or customs akin to the other tribes of Israel.

As it stands now, to me, there is little evidence to jump to this conclusion.

Have a great day

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by mutatismutandis

 

yes, if you really want to go into detail, there is a human genetic bottle neck that traces back to a mass extinction thousands of years ago, where a small tribe of people are responsible for the entire population of the planet.

Not quite true, actually. There is a bottleneck... But it applies only to people outside of Africa. Non-Africans the world over are all descendants of a relatively small number of people who left Africa. meanwhile, the genes in Africa are more diverse and varied than everyone else in the world combined; A swedish banker and a Pendanjarra tribesman have more in common genetically than a Kikuyu and Masaai who are both from Kenya.

If you're wondering, humans probably left Africa by way of a Somalia - Yemen landbridge / island cluster, and not through the Sinai. We conquered the Indian basin, then started to move inland.

As well as mitochondria eve we can trace or line back to very small female group maybe even one...

What this means is that every human on earth has one single female way way back in ancient Africa who they are descended from. This does not mean that she was the only female, simply that her descendants were the most successful ones.

Now that being said their are genetic markers for each group of humans that can be correlated by race, IE you can tell a native american is really a native american by their dna.

Not... exactly, no. You can get an idea of where someone's ancestors lived by noting that their genetic pattern is "more similar" to other people who lived there than to people who didn't... but it's pretty far from exact. Especially in the modern day, with far-ranging travel and few meaningful barriers to inter-ethnic sex.

That is, you can't say "this is a black man's genome" and "this is a white man's genome." What you CAN say is "this person has a genome more similar to people from west-central Africa than to someone from east Siberia."

JUst as the semetic jewish people can be identified by certain dna characteristics, all that does is trace the seperation of the branches of humanity.

Again, this requires numerous matchings and comparisons, and is hardly accurate.

SO yes we are all related, the question here is how closely, and in this there is no direct heritage from the Jewish people and the Native americans, yes in the abstract we are all related.

edit on 3-10-2011 by benrl because: (no reason given)

Well, that depends on if a given Indian's grandpa is named Jacob Cohen, now doesn't it?

I thought we had established that the lost 13th tribe was the Cylons, and that mankind interbred with them after escaping New Caprica?

reply to post by Viking9019


The Australian Aboriginies have been here for aprox 40,000+ years I would like to know who they speculate that was here earlier than that?

reply to post by WhoKnows100

Do you still believe that Columbus discovered the Americas in 1492?

Of course not, Asians, Norse, perhaps Polynesians were here first.

Do you really believe that all archaeological/linguistic/cultural evidence of Semite influences in the Americas was made up by the Mormons?

Yes. There is no pre-Columbian "Semite influence".

Do you still believe that pyramids popping up in South America have no relationship to the Egyptians?

Yes. Because pyramids are an archetypal form, even a small child playing with blocks utilizes pyramidal forms without being conscious of what a "pyramid" is, other than the most logical and intuitive means of stacking blocks.

If Egyptians came to Mexico, who wouldn't they have built an Egyptian pyramid? Why wouldn't they adorn it with the name of the Pharaoh and Egyptian hieroglyphs? Why wouldn't there be an commemoration to the feat in Egypt? etc., etc., etc.

Do you really believe that several Native American legends, customs and linguistics dobt show a Semetic influence?
The only reason that this information is kept silent and not publicised is that it would further prove the sudden appearance of Semetic/Hebrew lines dispersed throughout the world.

I'm not a linguist but it seems to me that if there were a connection between Semitic languages and N. American ones it would be impossible to suppress. And which N. American language are you claiming shows this Semitic influence? There's a large diversity of those, and while there is no one concrete theory as to how they all originated and what influences they've underwent, they do have a pretty good idea.
Indigenous languages of the Americas

reply to post by safteynet

You have fallen into the same trap as apostiate later day saints, (ex-cumincated members who struggle to prove themselves). The Church of Latter Day Saints does not, nor will ever trurn to scientific means to prove anything. Their is no purpose in this, only those who have fallen out of favor with the church spent their lives trying to disprove the Latter Day Saint faith. There are 14 million plus members worldwide. Ther church membership is supported by value of faith to those who beleive in its teaching. In the book of mormon the decendents of Lamen were called lamenites and were cused to be a dark and lothsom people. if a person beleives in God, as many,(not just mormons) do. He would have the capability to change man, (his creation) completely. I beleive this curse was not merely a dakening of skin color, but a complete genetic makeover.

Are you trying to soften the obvious racism of Smith's concocted religion? 1820's America may have gone along with the belief that "cursed people" were given black skin (as did the ancient biblical lands), but no matter how you choose to re-interpret it, it's still ignorant and racist. As to the "14 million", who cares how many blind followers there are of any faith? There are 19 million followers of Juche (N. Korea's official religion) - does that make it better? I mean, it must be, it has more followers.

reply to post by thetiler

A movie on Solomon Spalding could be a great movie indeed. When you really study his story. I recommend it highly. Just google Solomon Spalding, highly controversial amongst LDS and non LDS scholars. I really think Sidney Rigdon, Joseph Smith burned his book to destroy evidence that he plagiarized it. There has been a book found of his called. Manuscript Story though there is tell-tale influence even in that. View of the Hebrews by Ethan Smith which was the preacher of Oliver Cowdery another co-founding member with Joseph Smith. Sidney Rigdon the 3rd co-founder was said to have taken Solomon Spaldings book from a publishing house in Pittsburgh. And quite possibly destroyed it never to be seen again.

I read through Christopher Hitchens book "God is Not Great" (mostly out of curiosity), obviously J. Smith and crew got some posthumous 'splainin to do. Maybe God will sort him out.

reply to post by mormonmike

Well, It's time to say something here. Guys, believe me, after being a "Good Little Mormon" for the last 34 years , I can tell you, this is one well concocted organization that has millions fooled by one of the biggest con-artists that ever lived and put this together. Even the authorities of this church are beginning to back-peddle and say that "well, it's possible that first inhabitants of this continent could have arrived across the Bering land bridge". My "coma" ended about three years ago and it has never felt so good to finally "wake-up". My apologies if I have offended any LDS out there..........NOT !!

I don't think anyone here is attacking LDS as such, just pointing out a major flaw in one of it's chief claims. Glad to hear your not brainwashed into accepting what any organization is doling out (especially one with an agenda). If you're a member of the LDS and are happy with the church, that's fine, but if you try to re-write history and plant false evidence as Joseph Smith's followers clearly did to trick "believers" into accepting their concocted story, then shame on you.

The problem with Smith's story is that there have been so many advances made in the various disciplines - archeology, anthropology, geneaology, linguistics, history, etc., advances that he could never have foreseen or conceived of, and his story is being seen for what it really is - a story.

As a side note, from Hutchin's book, in 1826 when Joseph Smith was 21 a Bainbridge New York court convicted him of being a "disorderly person and an imposter." Hitchens says at trial he admitted to defrauding persons who signed up for various gold-digging expeditions and by claiming "Necromantic powers."

Originally posted by kingofmd
I don't believe there is that big of a mystery as to what happened to the 10 tribes following their exile by Assyria. They didn't travel too far, if one is interested, look into the Pathans of Afghanistan


www.dangoor.com...

Why is this still being discussed? There is more than enough proof that the lost tribes assimilated into India Pakistan and Afghanistan. Jews Related to native Americans is a dead end. Look into the
Pathans

I found this web page interesting about the tribe of Dan in Egypt, Greece and Ireland.

www.hope-of-israel.org...

reply to post by Sarkron


That is a theory. Nothing more. And a far fetched one at that. Please dont post theory as fact. Many people here are easily misled.

reply to post by kingofmd


Yup.

I had earlier made a post explaining the Israeli connection of modern day Pashtuns of Afghanistan/NW Pakistan here
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I wrote -

This is a very strong theory held as valid by many jews, christians and muslims. Heck, even A former Israeli president writes in his book that he believes Pashtuns have a strong Israelite connection.

Also Pashtun tribe names strongly resemble Israelite tribe names...

Ephraim = Afridi
Reuben = Rabbani
Levi = Levani
Gad = Gadoni
and so on.

Its interesting to note that the Pashtun are also known as "bani israel" (sons of israel, like b'nei israel.. despite harboring a dislike for jews.

There are mountains of evidence to support this theory, as Israelite names and symbols appear in their culture... right down to their clan names. But still, people seem to ignore this.

Perhaps the lost tribes of Israel being muslims is not as exciting or appealing as them being, say, Native American, Irish, British or Greek... as suggested in this thread.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


You have understood how political beliefs become more important than blood lines over time.

Please visit my thread 'Vedic civilization..' and you may find some good stuff how Aryavrata and Lanka were same people genetically but fought a big war, due to adherence to different beliefs.

Whatever is happening now, has happened before, but people fail to learn.

reply to post by vedatruth

You have understood how political beliefs become more important than blood lines over time.

The promise to Abraham rests solely on blood line... and NOT religion.
People believe that "jews" are the exclusive descendants of Israelite tribes... but jews are just one of the people who are part of the Abrahamic bloodline. Most of the descendants of the tribes converted to Islam.

P.S - Post a link to your thread.

reply to post by vedatruth


How can you be so sure?, most of the world leaders seem to be blood related

Originally posted by vedatruth
reply to post by Hanslune

 

Welcome to rapid climate change.

Earth's climate has gone through exceptionally fast cycles in the last 60k years.

Something to do with the part of cosmos, that the solar system is travelling in.

It may appear that way as we have much more data for the latest ages, more details. However if you have some data to back that up I'd be glad to see it.

Something to do with the part of cosmos, that the solar system is travelling in

Hmmmm that sounds rather fringy what would be the caustic agent?

Originally posted by Marco0Aurelio
reply to post by vedatruth

 

How can you be so sure?, most of the world leaders seem to be blood related

well if you go back to 200,000 years you might be right but recently? Europeans if they go back 20 generations must have at least one common ancestor - by the math - but I stand by to be corrected

reply to post by Hanslune


I correct myself: most of Western leaders (Europe and russia included) seem to be blood related, as for the eastern nations (China, Japan) I don't have any information (I don't think so though).

Originally posted by Marco0Aurelio
reply to post by Hanslune

 

I correct myself: most of Western leaders (Europe and russia included) seem to be blood related, as for the eastern nations (China, Japan) I don't have any information (I don't think so though).

The sets of European Royal were related generally but they have little power now. I would suspect that the present sets of European leaders have few common ancestors. The Chinese did a flip flop a generation ago and all old elites were overturned and new ones created. The Japanese Emperor is related just to himself and the noble families besides the new trend to take commoners as wives.