The Peculiar Death Of Bobby..

It would be amazing to know just for half a second what things would be like now if JFK, MLK, RFK were never murdered. Lot's and lot's of heavy stuff was going down in the 60's, which undoubtedly steered us to what we know as modern life today.

Spot on again as usual ! I have too believed much of what you have written here, especially the shots from behind in an upward direction, powder burns, security officer directly behind him, but somehow it still happens. Yes it had to be him that did it, but he should have been hung out to dry for letting the imaginary shooter get passed him. But of course, they were trying to misdirect everyones focus to Sirann from the front, so the last thing they would want is to highlight a shooter from behind.

reply to post by Rising Against

I have to agree, the whole thing stinks of MK Ultra style programming, and from what I have gathered regarding the investigations there definitely seems to be a massive cover up.

Jesse Ventura has shed some light on this, and he even did a very interesting interview with the man who was snapping photographs at the time. The fact that he had to sue to get his pictures back, and they conveniently were "stolen" on the way to him are laughably ridiculous.

I believe people like Bill Cooper were on to something when he said all of these horrible events that have taken place in the last fifty years have been orchestrated by a shadowy group of elitists. I believe America has been fighting a war within itself probably since its inception. Hell, even Andrew Jackson went on the record as stating that the only reason he got into politics was because he was sick of the corruption that was running rampant in Washington. Makes one wonder....

By the way OP, my condolonces for your brother Bobby. Its good to see JFK is alive and well and living it up in the UK!

reply to post by Rising Against


You're probably correct, but I'll wager the idea that changes in race equality bothered many
of the 'Old Guard' and anyone pitching to black folk for equality would be looked on as a danger.

Bobby had many enemies -as you say, and the video from Jokerzwild that shows the Mexican
-American lady enduring an investigation - indicates how far The-Powers-That-Be will go to
subdue any doubts.

"We don't want another Dallas" was said about The Ambassador Hotel's murder... so they destroyed
the evidence, lost vital clues and let shady characters slip away.

But who was the girl in the Polka-Dot dress?

reply to post by Rising Against


Reading about the Kennedys consistently makes me emotional. Being only 22, I'm always disappointed I didn't get to witness such a great era in history; at the same time, I'm so grateful I wasn't around to witness such a dark era in the same time period.

I feel that if you love the Kennedy family even half as much as I do, we owe it to them to keep these cases on everyone's minds. I'm pretty pessimistic any effort will make a difference, but after they sacrificed our lives for us (especially Bobby- he obviously knew before JFK was killed they were targets, he had no obligation to run for president after) the least we can do is shed light on how they were brutally murdered by "TPTB" (I've never used that acronym before...).

Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who gets so worked up over the Kennedys or even cares about how they were killed. Seeing threads like this give me some hope and actually caused me to log into my account after months of inaction. This was the first thread I've ever read all the way through and I'm grateful for all the facts presented here that I never even knew before (that I probably should have). Thank you!!

reply to post by A boy in a dress

You're probably correct, but I'll wager the idea that changes in race equality bothered many of the 'Old Guard' and anyone pitching to black folk for equality would be looked on as a danger.

I agree, that's what I meant before. I think someone from a KKK background certainly would've been employed by the FBI - assuming the FBI is responsible in the first place of course - simply because they have a very strong motive against Bobby due to his work on civil rights. A hell of a lot of people hated Bobby over this issue after all. But the point is the original ones recruiting him, imo, would only do so because of Bobby's push for the presidency. It was too dangerous for them. Not civil rights like some might suspect. I'd imagine that was a mere distraction technique.

But who was the girl in the Polka-Dot dress?

Unfortunately no one, to this day, can say for sure. A women called Kathy Ainsworth seems to be the leading suspect though. I discussed her in the Opening post, particularly how she died in an FBI shootout a mere 3 weeks after Bobby was shot.

reply to post by maximumpower

Reading about the Kennedys consistently makes me emotional. Being only 22, I'm always disappointed I didn't get to witness such a great era in history; at the same time, I'm so grateful I wasn't around to witness such a dark era in the same time period.

Don't worry, I'm not much younger myself so I wasn't around for when it happened either. Hell, I'm not even American, I'm English.

But I can relate to what you're saying there. It's really odd when you think about it but yeah, It really would've been good to be around when it actually happened yet at the same time It would've been a horrible thing to live through. If I had to choose though, and strictly from a research point of view, I would without a doubt choose being around at the time it happened.

I'm pretty pessimistic any effort will make a difference

Again, I find myself agreeing.. Not wholly though of course. I mean I really do think It's important to know what actually happened, hell, a leader was literally stolen from his people. We should get to know what really happened there. Yet at the same time putting anyone to justice for the crime is just unrealistic and if that's what anyone's still trying to do then quite frankly It's a huge waste of time. This case first started almost 50 years ago now, we're way past finding someone and putting them in jail or anything like that.

But like I said, I think people deserve to know what really went on. And actually finding a name responsible is still pretty important really. That's my personal motivation for looking into the case anyway - I feel we deserve to know even if it won't make any real difference to our way of life today. I imagine in 30 to 40 or so years from now people will still be asking questions surrounding 9/11 also.

Here's some great info on the RFK assassination, from some of the experts who has followed the case from the beginning:

www.realhistoryarchives.com...

reply to post by starviego


You're links aren't working so I tried to fix them for you.

Sirhan and the RFK Assassination - Part I: The Grand Illusion

Sirhan and the RFK Assassination - Part II: Rubik's Cube

That's a really great link too! Not one I've seen before so thanks a ton for posting it. I appreciate it a lot. I'm looking forward to reading through it all.

Ok, I have spent the better part of today looking into the ballistics of this case. In all actuality I was looking for an official report on the markings of the bullets from the 2 different guns but I've not been able to stumble across that just yet. But some of the things I've been able to find are equally as interesting like this essay done by John Hunt that questions the official findings of the investigation as it relates to the bullets and wounds.

"Did Sirhan fire the bullet which actually killed Robert Kennedy?" has never been fully investigated. Nor has the import of ballistic and medical evidence been litigated, not even at Sirhan's trial during which his legal team arbitrarily stipulated both to the integrity of the physical evidence and the prosecution's version which has Sirhan as the sole assassin.

Today, however, we can move past those tantalizing possibilities to what I believe amounts to proof of conspiracy; a round fired from Sirhan's gun could not have caused the wound that actually killed RFK—the headshot. As inconceivable as it sounds thirty-eight years after the fact, the "proof" comes straight from RFK's autopsy report.

The link below is to the complete essay that is too packed with pertinent information for me to present in this posting.

Robert Kennedy's Head Wounds, Part 1: The Case for Conspiracy

Also in my trips and travels around the interwebs I ran across a rather interesting YouTube series of videos done by "Discovery Times"... I'm only posting one at the moment as it pertains to the testing done on the gun. But you will notice that due to a 'clerical error' on the part of the tester, the wrong serial number is listed and is NOT the serial number of Sirhan's actual gun. How this was used as evidence is just beyond me... yet here it is spelled out for all to see. The part about the serial number starts at around 4:46.



Here is an article that backs up the above youtube video:

Subsequent research has uncovered problems with the marking of evidence bullets, including bullet #47, which should have a "TN31" etched in its base but instead says "DWTN." There is circumstantial evidence for a switch of crime scene bullets and even of the Sirhan gun with a test gun. LAPD criminologist DeWayne Wolfer had in fact introduced into evidence at Sirhan's trial the test gun, and represented it as the murder weapon, despite the different serial numbers.

The Robert F Kennedy Assassination - Mary Ferrell Foundation

This is a very interesting read above and beyond the ballistics information it provides, however on the topic of ballistics it provides this little gem that I had never ever heard before:

It is worth noting that the 1975 panel discovered that two bullets allegedly removed from Sirhan's car contained traces of wood on both the base and the tip. Were these bullets dug out of the door frame?

(Source for above quote the same Mary Ferrell Foundation website listed above)

Now, if the bullets found in Sirhan's car showed traces of wood on them, and Sirhan himself was detained almost immediately in the pantry of the hotel after the shooting...how in the world were they found in his car? Did they teleport there.... or were they planted... interesting.

The more I dig into this the more questions I have. I will continue to dig and report anything of any note on this thread.

The sad thing is, Sirhan continues to rot away in a prison cell, the system being much happier to blame an innocent man rather than admit their own mistakes; though such a thing would of course point to the power structure as being responsible for Bobby's death.

There is an EXCELLENT documentary regarding both assasinations that are pulled directly from "forgotten" footage and interviews pulled from the Library of Congress.

Evidence of Revision , which you can see for free on google videos, is long. But worth it.

In it , it details with astounding presicion the Lyndon B. Johnson -with the help of the CIA - black mailed JFK into giving him the vice presidency and then killed him because he WAS infact about to dismantle the Fed and make corporations more responsible by ridding the country of wind fall taxes.

Lyndon B. Johnson had a string of corruption from the get go , and essentially owned Texas. In this documentary there is a young Deputy - at the time - who recounted first hand of the strange directions they were giving as plain clothes officers. Essentially to not do anything if something happend. That young deputy was fired and multiple attempts (gun shots in public, his car blew up) died and untimely death.

But back to Bobby,

I wish I new how to work this site yet, but there is footage in which bobby whispers to LBJ - why'd you kill my brother. LBJ's look of shock and "gotcha" expression is priceless. Within the footage, there are interviews - particulary of one woman - who stated to the police that she had witnessed a man and a woman in a polka dotted dress run down the stairs jubilant after the assasination. At the time the witness was in the stairwell and did not know anything had happened. The lady in the dress screamed "we did it" ! The witness inquired "did what?" The lady said "killed Kennedy" .

She gave this info to police and was called into questioning. She noted that a well dressed man came in - who did not seem to be a police officer - and started to question her. What you will hear is audio-and see transcripts- of this man essentially telling her that she did not see or hear what she thought, and that she was "hurting people" buy not admitting she is lying, or maybe , admit to herself that she did not see what she "thought" she did.

Its a startling first hand view of CIA confusion techniques.

Mk Ultra is noted to be possibly a major player. The "killer" was noted to look "dazed and confused" at the scene with no memory of what happend afterwards. He had also mentioned the "women in the polka dot dress".

In any regard, all Kennedy enthusiasts, history buffs, or conspiracy theorists should watch this. It is excellent

reply to post by Rising Against


RA, you have provided the most in-depth and thorough threads on the JFK and now RFK assassinations I have come across. Thank you for the hard work, I enjoy these greatly and have come across some things which I never previously encountered on these subjects.

reply to post by femalepharoe



loving that documentary...and I thought I knew it all. really great stuff!
thank you very much.

A wonderful read, and thank you for researching and posting it.

I've often wondered if Sirhan might have actually had his pistol out to protect RFK. A bit far-fetched, yes, but bear with me. I've considered the idea that SS somehow knew RFK was going to be assassinated; perhaps through info passed from polka-dot dress (whom I admittedly did not know about until now). Perhaps he tried to take out the killer but failed?

Admittedly, the theory needs more fleshing out, it's more of an idea and the info I got from this thread seems to point away from that.

I remember reading that VP Johnson absolutely despised JFK especially because of the Bay of Pigs fiasco.
Apparently JFK ordered the cuban-americans who were secretly training for the invasion of Cuba with CIA funding to be disbanded. He had decided he did not want this invasion to take place. The cuban-american terrorists in training refused to leave their training compounds. George Bush Senior was also involved in this.

VP Johnson disobeyed President Kennedy's order to disband and ordered the invasion anyways.
This put President Kennedy in a very difficult position as far as sending in the Air force back up.
Kennedy decided to not send in the back up for the invasion because he had explicitly given orders that it was not to happen in the first place. The invaders as a result ended up being killed and captured.

I say this because Mrs Johnson has stated that the night before JFK's assasination there was apparently a meeting that included Vice President Johnson, Richard Nixon, George Bush Senior, various nefarious cuban-americans and Dave Hunt, a known hitman. When Johnson came out of that meeting he said to his wife
"after tommorrow I will never have to deal with that SOB (Kennedy) again. The next day he was assasinated.After Kennedy was shot Johnson phoned his wife and said (they got the SOB, good).

I do believe for more reasons than I can put here (too tired right now) that Johnson and George Bush Senior were involved in the planning of it, possibly Nixen as well. I also believe that Johnson and Bush and possible Nixen as well as other nefarious individuals CIA were probably involved in the murder of Robert Kennedy as well. They hated him as much if not more that they did JFK.

As far as Sirhan Sirhan I have no doubt he was programmed. Programmed people often seem to suffer head injuries somewhere along the way. What is scary too is that MK ULtra style programming is still going on today only it is more advanced than it was then. Anyone today can be programmed to kill and have no recollection of it.I wouldn't doubt that Robert highly suspected or outright new that Johnson was responsible for his brother's death as well as I believe a younger George Bush Senior as well as others. He wanted Johnson out and was willing to risk his own life for it. The Sirhan's of the world need to be understood.

reply to post by Rising Against


She Was Russian Or Cuban.

reply to post by Rising Against


I'm old enough to remember both JFK and RFK assassinations. Much later I became aware of how both brothers worked hard to check the mob, curb Vietnam, Bay of Pigs, etc. Both Jack and Robert learned from Eisenhower about the Industrial Military Complex, etc.

After I learned all that they had done to fight greed and corruption together I understood why they were killed. 5 years apart. 5_ years_ apart. Despite all the questions concerning how they died and who was responsible, the biggest proof in my mind that TPTB were ultimately responsible is that after Jack died, Bobby was pretty much mute until he decided to run on the same platform as his older brother. Once he announced his candidacy and his anti Vietnam stance and showed some popularity, that was it. Soon after he was also dead.

That same corporate, military, government beast that wanted to start and wage endless war for profit in places like Vietnam made sure that the message of "peace of the bargaining table instead of the peace of the grave" would be silenced a second time.

Those same powers that be are still firmly in control of this nation at the top today. The protracted wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, and now Libya are their dream come true.

reply to post by Rising Against


reply to post by Rising Against


If it was indeed confirmed that the bullet came from behind and it was also confirmed that Cesar fired his weapon and was undoubtedly standing behind RFK then it would only stand to reason that Cesar be investigated.

It's also here that Thane Eugene Cesar also becomes one of the prime suspects as amazingly he could be observed with a gun in his hand immediately following the assassination -

Was Cesar ever officially considered a suspect? to me its a no-brainer. I mean if the doctors said that the bullet came from behind wouldn't the first thing you think of as an investigator be the only other known weapon that was confirmed to have been fired? And that weapon known having to have been fired from behind RFK at that!

All this information would have been available to the original investigators yet did anyone on the investigative team make any mention of a possible gunman from behind?

So, I guess this leads me to a few questions.

When was the information about the entry/exit wound to RFK's head made available to the investigators?

Was recorded testimony ever taken from Cesar? If so is it available?

If that was my town (if i was Sharif) I would have put everyone in the entire building in quarantine and very thoroughly question everyone. I would have called in ALL of my investigators and any other person qualified to take testimony. Wake em up call em in if need be.

This was a senator of the united states for goodness sake and likely the next president, this was a super extremely important investigation, the most important investigation of any investigators career.

How could the "bullet from behind" theory have been over looked?

Was any of the investigators ever (on the record) asked about the "bullet from behind"? If so what was their reply?

If you or anyone else can answer any of my questions I would be most grateful.

This is a great thread very provocative indeed S&F for your hard work and effort to find the truth.

-Alien

reply to post by intrptr


You are absolutely correct.

I mean even if at the beginning of their presidential campaign if those guys actually believe all the good things they are saying to the American public, it is quickly silenced by someone because all of them turn into liers as soon as they are elected.

It is as if the powers that be (TPTB) pull them aside as soon as they are elected and say something along the lines as......Look at JFK, look at RFK look at......

Following is a list of prominent foreign individuals whose assassination (or planning for same) the United States has been involved in since the end of the Second World War. The list does not include several assassinations in various parts of the world carried out by anti-Castro Cubans employed by the CIA and headquartered in the United States.
1949 - Kim Koo, Korean opposition leader
1950s - CIA/Neo-Nazi hit list of more than 200 political figures in West Germany to be "put out of the way" in the event of a Soviet invasion
1950s - Chou En-lai, Prime minister of China, several attempts on his life 1950s,
1962 - Sukarno, President of Indonesia
1951 - Kim Il Sung, Premier of North Korea
1953 - Mohammed Mossadegh, Prime Minister of Iran
1950s (mid) - Claro M. Recto, Philippines opposition leader
1955 - Jawaharlal Nehru, Prime Minister of India
1957 - Gamal Abdul Nasser, President of Egypt
1959, 1963, 1969 - Norodom Sihanouk, leader of Cambodia
1960 - Brig. Gen. Abdul Karim Kassem, leader of Iraq
1950s-70s - José Figueres, President of Costa Rica, two attempts on his life
1961 - Francois "Papa Doc" Duvalier, leader of Haiti
1961 - Patrice Lumumba, Prime Minister of the Congo (Zaire)
1961 - Gen. Rafael Trujillo, leader of Dominican Republic
1963 - Ngo Dinh Diem, President of South Vietnam
1960s-70s - Fidel Castro, President of Cuba, many attempts on his life
1960s - Raúl Castro, high official in government of Cuba
1965 - Francisco Caamaño, Dominican Republic opposition leader
1965-6 - Charles de Gaulle, President of France
1967 - Che Guevara, Cuban leader
1970 - Salvador Allende, President of Chile
1970 - Gen. Rene Schneider, Commander-in-Chief of Army, Chile 1970s,
1981 - General Omar Torrijos, leader of Panama
1972 - General Manuel Noriega, Chief of Panama Intelligence
1973-83 - Various Tupamaros in Uruguay (at behest of US)
1975 - Mobutu Sese Seko, President of Zaire 1976 - Michael Manley, Prime Minister of Jamaica
1980-1986 - Muammar Qaddafi, leader of Libya, several plots and attempts upon his life
1982 - Ayatollah Khomeini, leader of Iran
1983 - Gen. Ahmed Dlimi, Moroccan Army commander
1983 - Miguel d'Escoto, Foreign Minister of Nicaragua
1984 - The nine comandantes of the Sandinista National Directorate
1985 - Sheikh Mohammed Hussein Fadlallah, Lebanese Shiite leader (80 people killed in the attempt)
1991 - Saddam Hussein, leader of Iraq
1993 - Mohamed Farah Aideed, prominent clan leader of Somalia 1998,
2001-2 - Osama bin Laden, leading Islamic militant
1999 - Slobodan Milosevic, President of Yugoslavia
2002 - Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, Afghan Islamic leader and warlord
2003 - Saddam Hussein and his two sons
2011 - Muammar Qaddafi, leader of Libya

* Washington Post, June 27, 1993 Taken from Killing Hope: U.S. Military and CIA Interventions Since World War II by William Blum

Do YOU want to be next?

-Alien