New Rules for a Better Economy

reply to post by CantSay


Capitalism is the best system. Capped capitalism (which is an oxymoron) isn't. You want to cap Bill Gates' wealth when it's just hyped up paper wealth that's only good if he withdraws all of it at once. And only if the stock price remains high. Capping his unreal wealth won't magically transfer it to the poor because it's not really tangible in the first place.

Go keep dreaming.

Originally posted by eldard
reply to post by CantSay

 

Capitalism is the best system. Capped capitalism (which is an oxymoron) isn't. You want to cap Bill Gates' wealth when it's just hyped up paper wealth that's only good if he withdraws all of it at once. And only if the stock price remains high. Capping his unreal wealth won't magically transfer it to the poor because it's not really tangible in the first place.

Go keep dreaming.

edit on 10/2/2011 by eldard because: (no reason given)

Capping alone will not transfer virtual wealth, which is what our economy is given the contracts issued by the emotionally driven stock markets, to the poor alone, but built-in incentives will in order for corporations to increase their cap limit and allow their stock prices to increase without being taxed. I believe this system plays along with our inclination towards greed by allowing it to exist, as always, but only if civic responsibility and social support acts increase in benefit of society. How much do money do top executives or corporations need? Would they feel the pinch if 10% of their wealth was given to support poor people? To better the circumstances of poor people? If they have millions, I doubt it. For example, Google or Microsoft could easily achieve exact same level of productivity and still make a decent profit at an operating cost in the millions. Software companies produce virtual products (vaporware).

reply to post by CantSay


Or they will simply move to wherever there's no capping. I know I would.

Originally posted by eldard
reply to post by CantSay

 

Or they will simply move to wherever there's no capping.

I know I would.

True, so a common global governance would have to be in place first, or pose limits on corporations based internationally operating domestically in order to have domestic ownership and accountability under these new economic domestic laws.

Ok, this is perhaps your best argument as a one world government would be needed.

reply to post by CantSay


Rest assured, I'll join those who opposes it.

Cap everything, and no one would bother produce anything. Guess who'll suffer the most?

reply to post by eldard


who's producing now??? actually producing a viable product for resale???

there isn't a high percentage of people actually producing something...they are serving people, they are using their wealth to make more wealth, but the actually producers?? well they've watched their jobs get shipped overseas or the wages drop to a level that would barely provide for a little apartment and the heat to keep it warm!!!

seems to me, the quest for profits above all other concerns, the desire for cheap labor, well, we've already lost our producers!!!!

I went through the job listings of several sources for my area this weekend....
there was even a waitress job in there paying $2 something an hour!!! of course the waitress also gets tips but, well.......they'd have to make close to $8 an hour in tips before they'd even come close to what it would cost to live in this area I think!!!


you want producers??? well, sorry, but we seem to be turning them into beggers lined up at the welfare office!!!

now robosigners!!! ya, now they are valued members of the workforce!!!!

reply to post by dawnstar


It's only Amerika that's whining (such giant whiners lolz) about the loss of kitchenware, cotton and simple electronics manufacturing to other countries. I don't hear Germany, Japan and Korea (which are better at engineering than you are) complaining. They're simply making more stuff that can't be easily copied and that the world wants.

reply to post by eldard


sorry, but when you own military has to rely on imports just to be clothed.....

ummm...there's something wrong!!!!

if a blockade was ever set up, what?? you think our military is gonna be fighting naked???

there is a natonal security issue here!

there is one other way to divvy up the economy...

have the govt. support Strategic Industry by way of tax credits, training, etc for industry in the scope of the strategic industries that were requirements for State development, say like post WWII America up to & including most of the Eisenhower administration... Atoms-for-peace might be dusted off



leave the venture capitalist businesses & globalizations/ offshorings and vulture business have free but regulated markets & scope of operations.... & absolutely no TBTF bull like the banker cartel & Paulson pulled on Congress


just a thought

reply to post by dawnstar


You do realize that Amerika supplies most of the cotton for the world's textile industry? Like I said, this Amerikan whining is getting really pathetic.

reply to post by eldard


ya, you do realize that just about all the manufacturing resources to do anything with that cotton had been left abandoned, to rust and degrade, don't you?????

ya, ship the cotton overseas, have the produce something out of the cotton, then ship it back into the country....
IT'S CHEAPER!!!

really, it is?? then why are the products much higher now than they were when they were produced in this country????

reply to post by dawnstar


1) Because of global demand
2) There were more rich people than before
3) Because the gullible idiots that is the middle class keeps buying
4) re: cheaper = you've just answered your own question

You do realize that of the $14 trillion wealth(?) that's generated in the US each year, China gets a mere...$365 billion? If you buy a $400 iPhone, only a fifth of the price goes to China. The majority goes to corporate America.

Yes. Keep lamenting the loss of you industrial base (like kitchenware, cotton and oven toasters ) when you're still the 3rd largest car producer and 2nd biggest plane maker. And you still export twice more than Japan.

About your cars, though, not for long since only morons buy those.

To add: 5) primarily because of oil. Which skyrocketed after the second invasion of Iraq.

Originally posted by St Udio
there is one other way to divvy up the economy...

have the govt. support Strategic Industry by way of tax credits, training, etc for industry in the scope of the strategic industries that were requirements for State development, say like post WWII America up to & including most of the Eisenhower administration... Atoms-for-peace might be dusted off



leave the venture capitalist businesses & globalizations/ offshorings and vulture business have free but regulated markets & scope of operations.... & absolutely no TBTF bull like the banker cartel & Paulson pulled on Congress


just a thought

The strategic industry by tax credit is interesting. It's still a form of incentive economy to move the economy into areas that are needed. Nice.

But you lost me with the rest of your statement.

Originally posted by eldard
reply to post by dawnstar

 

1) Because of global demand
2) There were more rich people than before
3) Because the gullible idiots that is the middle class keeps buying
4) re: cheaper = you've just answered your own question

You do realize that of the $14 trillion wealth(?) that's generated in the US each year, China gets a mere...$365 billion?

If you buy a $400 iPhone, only a fifth of the price goes to China. The majority goes to corporate America.

Yes. Keep lamenting the loss of you industrial base (like kitchenware, cotton and oven toasters

) when you're still the 3rd largest car producer and 2nd biggest plane maker. And you still export twice more than Japan.

About your cars, though, not for long since only morons buy those.

To add: 5) primarily because of oil. Which skyrocketed after the second invasion of Iraq.

edit on 10/4/2011 by eldard because: (no reason given)

edit on 10/4/2011 by eldard because: (no reason given)

Never thought you were stupid, and this shows it though you come across too aggressive. So where was this logic when we were debating. If anything, you highlight that corporate corruption is rampant. This isn't sustainable.

I still believe in an economic system that caps wealth, via actual caps or taxation, and forming an incentive economy - I'll add a strategic incentive economy. A system that goes along with innate permanent human greed and curbs it in favor of society while still allowing people to become wealthy.

Also, I believe that licensing should be removed or minimized. There is no much red tape with licensing. Remove licensing and enable people to start businesses more readily.

reply to post by CantSay


lolz you call me stupid when you're the one who should look at the mirror.
Taxes are an invention of the Jew and is immoral and unnecessary. Of course corruption will always be there. To deny that is delusional. Something I'm sure you're familiar with.

reply to post by eldard


whatever,,,,,

but well, when world war three starts, don't come whining because we all have giant gaps in major sections of our economies, because the "friends" that we made ourselves dependent on to supply these things, well, just aren't our friends anymore, or just can't get the ships through the blockades to us!!!

by the way, we don't have a capitalistic society, we don't have a socialistic society....
we have this hybrid that is throwing everything out of wack!! a purely capitalistic society would be better, a purely socialistic society would be better...
what we have at the moment is crap!!! designed only to profit the better offs and the corps... what?? the people aren't buying your products because the price you want for them is too high??? oh, don't worry, we will solve that, we will give the poorer amoung them the means to have them!! or we will write new laws...and force them to buy them!!...or we will give them a tax credit at the end of the year!!! whatever, but don't worry, you will sell your products and see insane profits!!!!

at one time NY state had some of the best apple orchards around!!! now they are only a shadow of what they were...why??? oh ya, the gov't started giving out tax breaks to companies for importing apply concentrate from some other country!!! it wasn't cheaper, there's no way it was cheaper! it was only cheaper for the company because of the tax break!!!

reply to post by dawnstar


You do realize that 62% of Apple's income now come from outside the US? About WW3, you betcha it will happen soon. Remember the recent Bin Laden "raid?" It was all a ruse to give stealth tech to China.

1. Place a Cap on Personal Wealth

2. Place a Cap on Corporate Wealth

Sorry, this is pure nonsense.

For a start, why dont you US Americans look at other countries, like certain Northern European countries., W. Germany etc..etc..

Our social system is better, and we are still a free, western society without any "wealth caps" or other nonsense.

But: It wont work as long as you (and this means "YOU" as in "many average Americans") *think* that countries like W.Germany, Sweden etc. are "socialist" or "communist" (which of course is an absurd statement, but i hear it quite often).

YOUR problems are at the core of society: It's the lower income class, the lack of a good social net, health insurance, driving lower class/middle-class into debt and bankruptcy..while THE BANKS profit from it.

As long as you don't get a better social net and support for unemployed etc...people..your system WONT WORK respective will stay as screwed as it is right now.

Go look at Sweden, Finland, Norway etc. and ask yourself WHY the system works there. How it's possible that people are rich, work FAR FAR LESS, earn more, have free healthcare and and overall higher standard of living. Hint: IT WORKS AMAZINGLY WELL.

reply to post by flexy123


You do realize that so called socialists paradises of Germany and Japan are pathetically dependent on chasing dollars i.e. selling to the US? And the US in turn, is pathetically dependent on easy credit aka artificial wealth creation?

Originally posted by eldard
reply to post by CantSay

 

lolz you call me stupid when you're the one who should look at the mirror.

Taxes are an invention of the Jew and is immoral and unnecessary. Of course corruption will always be there. To deny that is delusional. Something I'm sure you're familiar with.

You misunderstood. I don't think you're stupid. Aggressive yes. Delusional also , but with a few good, but brief, points. I think you could be better. I still want to hear your solution to this economic mess...in detail!