1.98 million year old skull has What?

Originally posted by hopenotfeariswhatweneed
5 flags because there are so far at least 5 short sighted people, i mean blind sorry....certainly i slightly raised impression on the bone...but hey i can clearly see the drawing of crosses people kindly put there for us...

peace

I think it just kinda happens to look kinda like a cross, no significance to me really. However it is still a strange marking to appear right between the eyes, most likely, as another member said, its from an injury of some sort. That being said, I flagged it after reading a few replies like your own, simply because I find it amusing when people like you become so annoyed, and flagging helps to expose people like you for the presumptuous, egotistical person that you are. Helps me get a few chuckles in. It never ceases to entertain me when someone thinks that they are somehow better than others, and based on what they choose to flag on a website. Someone on a computer clicked a button, now you're all annoyed and making claims of judgement against the people who did that. You must be a very, very important person... Oh, and some people may have flagged it purely for the educational value of such an old find. Many people are interested in old bones. But of course someone of your stature would know that already.

Originally posted by john_bmth
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

A coss (and variations of) is an incrediy simple shape that's going find symbolism in pretty much every culture at some point. That's as far as the meaning goes, it's of little (if any) significance.

Something to bear in mind is that significance is in the eye of the user. You may believe it to be, on the whole, irrelevant. But to the people who have used the cross as a metaphor for some of their sacred teachings, the cross has a very deep and profound meaning.

To dismiss its value is to claim to understand the mind of its user. And that is truly preposterous.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


It's a basic shape that has no inherent meaning. What exactly do you think is the significance and how is it pertinent to this thread?

MMMH I never quite understand how creationist religionist christianist cultists can on one hand deny evolution and on the other find evidence in a 1.98 million year old skull - not saying that the OP is a creationist, but anyone can find 'evidence' to suit their own particular agenda - I'm not quite sure what the agenda is in this particular post.. PS I've got a funny scar on my knee that looks kinda ambigous - anyone want to investigate ?

Ya, we know creationists are scratching a cross in all these old skulls. Oh, maybe I'm wrong and we are supposed to believe Jesus told them to do it to themselves 2 million years ago.

Anything to keep religion taking your money-they don't take mine

Originally posted by john_bmth
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

It's a basic shape that has no inherent meaning. What exactly do you think is the significance and how is it pertinent to this thread?

I will post this link one more time for you. The title of the paper is "Hermetic Meaning Of The Cross":

www.hermanubis.com.br...

If you do not understand the difference in thinking between mainstream thought and Hermetic thought, then I do not expect you to understand. I am trying to inform you here. Not argue. Take it as you will.

ETA: the above link is by no means all inclusive. It is just one persons take on it, and reporting of others take on it. I posted it in hope that the reader will be enticed to do a Google search for other information. Like this.

I would also add that this is exactly why the truly inquisitive mind, the philosopher, approaches all new interests from a perspective of having no beliefs. Once you believe something, you exclude all other contradictory data. Major folly.

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan

I will post this link one more time for you. The title of the paper is "Hermetic Meaning Of The Cross":

www.hermanubis.com.br...

That's not a paper, its an unsourced webpage.

If you do not understand the difference in thinking between mainstream thought and Hermetic thought, then I do not expect you to understand. I am trying to inform you here. Not argue. Take it as you will.

You're not informing me of anything. You're presenting your unsubstantiated opinions as some sort of ultimate truth. Again, I ask what exactly is the significance of a simple shape that even children will draw in the mud with a stick? It has no inherent meaning. So what does this have to do with the thread?

reply to post by john_bmth


OK, so you are "one of those".

I will leave you with this then: the meaning of any symbol is held by the person who uses it, and observes it. To you, there is no meaning. To a follower of Pythagoras (as an example) it had lots of meaning. As well, the time it took you to reply shows that you had no possible way of reading the first link, or anything in the second link. What is it you are arguing against? Do you understand my position at all? It would seem you do not, based on your replies.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


Yeah, "one if those" who doesn't believe any old unsubstantiated pseudo-science or New Age woo hoo. The only symbolism is what a given culture or belief system attaches to it. The Christian cross, for example, represents the cross that Christians believe Jesus was crucified on. That's a very specific meaning. Do all other cultures and belief systems use the cross to symbolise the resurrection of Jesus? No. Case closed.

Originally posted by john_bmth
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

Yeah, "one if those" who doesn't believe any old unsubstantiated pseudo-science or New Age woo hoo. The only symbolism is what a given culture or belief system attaches to it. The Christian cross, for example, represents the cross that Christians believe Jesus was crucified on. That's a very specific meaning. Do all other cultures and belief systems use the cross to symbolise the resurrection of Jesus? No. Case closed.

WOW. You just summarized my argument perfectly. Thank you.

I care nothing for Jesus. That was irrelevant. Completely irrelevant. As i said: The meaning lies with the user, and the observer. Like any other symbol.

Are you so looking for an argument that you mismanage comprehension so badly? Anyway, thanks for agreeing with me. We don't have to agree to disagree in this case. Only agree to understand.

ETA: as it pertains to the OP, the "meaning" of this cross would imply that this "proto human" was ascribing deeper meaning to simple symbols. AKA: spiritual belief (as I can think of no other reason to inscribe a cross on a skull). I would assume some sort of Shamanic process.

Or perhaps it isn't a cross at all. My only interest is in philosophical discussion.

I see more of a diamond than a cross, but this is just plain silly.
Given that we understand the female was found with a juvenile male skeleton, presumably her son. She not only was capable of walking on land but having a ball in the tree's too.
Like everyone of us, she must have had the odd fall, accident or fight during her lifetime so it's most likely just repaired bone..

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


You seem to be confusing your opinion with fact. No geometric shapes have any inherent meaning. They are just shapes. If you want to believe otherwise, fine, but it's an unsubstantiated belief, not fact.

ETA: as it pertains to the OP, the "meaning" of this cross would imply that this "proto human" was ascribing deeper meaning to simple symbols. AKA: spiritual belief (as I can think of no other reason to inscribe a cross on a skull). I would assume some sort of Shamanic process.

What cross? You and the OP are the only ones seeing this "cross". There is no deeper meaning. It's an indistuingishable mark on an ancient skull, nothing more. To say otherwise is utterly absurd.

reply to post by john_bmth


There is no "inherent" meaning in anything. As creatures of free will, we all ascribe our own meanings to things, be they symbols or events (i.e., omens). That has nothing to do with this thread.

You already summed up my argument: the meaning lies with the user. I have clearly stated such. What are you going on about?

BTW, the information I get my position from would call almost all other beliefs "New Age". Your ad hominems and apparent disgust of mindsets different from yours are not going to get you far on this site. Once again, take that for what you will.

I thought I'd try inverting the image and see if the cross would show up a little more clear. What I found out is that the "cross" is actually the letter "t", and a hidden message was revealed. Have a look:

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by john_bmth

 

There is no "inherent" meaning in anything. As creatures of free will, we all ascribe our own meanings to things, be they symbols or events (i.e., omens). That has nothing to do with this thread. You already summed up my argument: the meaning lies with the user. I have clearly stated such. What are you going on about?

Right, so what exactly is your augment, again? How is it pertinent to this thread? The "cross" isn't even a cross. Do you have any evidence whatsoever that 1.98million year old proto-humans used the cross as symbolism? More specifically, do you have any evidence to demonstrate that this "cross" is anything other than a naturally-formed ambiguous mark? Do you have any evidence that said proto-humans had spiritual beliefs, let alone ones where the cross was significant?

BTW, the information I get my position from would call almost all other beliefs "New Age".

To you, maybe, but to everyone else, New Age has a very specific meaning:

A broad movement characterized by alternative approaches to traditional Western culture, with an interest in spirituality, mysticism, holism, and environmentalism: "the New Age movement"

Your ad hominems and apparent disgust of mindsets different from yours are not going to get you far on this site. Once again, take that for what you will.

Sorry, I don't believe in pseudo-science or unsubstantiated opinions. You might believe that conjecture and scientific illiteracy is to be valued but I, however, do not.

I have that exact mark on the bridge of my nose too. I was riding a bike, when I was young, and fell off while attempting to ride down some stairs. I hit my nose on the edge of one if the steps, cutting myself quite deeply across the bridge. I remember the x-rays they took because of the odd mark it left on my nosebone. It is an almost exact match for the mark you see here.

My guess is the 'person' fell and struck it's nose on a sharp rock.

reply to post by Wyn Hawks


So was I..

Pareidolia is a type of illusion or misperception involving a vague or obscure stimulus being perceived as something clear and distinct. For example, in the discolorations of a burnt tortilla one sees the face of Jesus Christ. ...

reply to post by TsukiLunar


hmmmm, i would say that you would have to broaden that outline a bit and then it wouldn't look like a cross......

The only reason there is a cross on there is because the stupid guy presenting this finding is drawing it on with paint...

There is no stupid cross, and if he thinks it is, its probably the god damn skull... nobodys gonna put a cross on it so where is this thread even going....